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#112054 - 03/29/17 11:24 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Czereda]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
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 Originally Posted By: Czereda
 Originally Posted By: SIN3
As if it's easy elsewhere? Students in the U.S. also struggle financially...


I'm not saying it's easy in the US either. I'm simply opposed to doing something because such is the custom. Move out when and if it's convenient and beneficial to you and not because this is something you are supposed to do or because most people do it.


I don't think it's as simple as that. Many families want their kids out and on their own because it releases them from the financial burden. How many years after reaching adulthood should families carry these 'kids'? That financial debt can last as long as it takes for them to pay it off. Many students even going into default, then find they can't get a leg-up in the economy because they are black-listed. It's less about social expectations than you think.

 Quote:


 Quote:
Better than what in the bigger picture?


Than fucking things up. Let's say, a considerable group of people take loans in Swiss currency. In the course of time, the Polish currency gets weaker and their payments double. Many of them are no longer able to pay the debt so they start petitioning the parliament to fix it and punish the banks for deceiving them. As if they didn't know about exchange rates fluctuations. Childish really.




There's also corruption. We have a fair bit of that here in the U.S., it can take many years to catch it, litigate it and offer reprieve to those scammed. Many people go into debt not having a full-grasp of flex interest rates and take into consideration lifestyle changes. I don't know that it's childish per se but all part of the learning curve. People learn pretty quick after to burn to read the fine print. It may even take them multiple burns to force them to read it before agreeing to the terms.
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#112055 - 03/29/17 06:27 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: SIN3]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 1793
Loc: Poland
 Quote:
Many families want their kids out and on their own because it releases them from the financial burden.


It's not a financial burden if the kids support the parents financially and otherwise. I'm talking about mutual aid, not babysitting. Living together is simply cheaper though I agree it's not a good idea if you can't get along with your family.
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#112060 - 03/30/17 03:45 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Czereda]
Dimitri Offline
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Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3125
[Quick Reply]
This thing started great and ended up as a trainwreck.

It derailed as soon as it went back to the classic "what it is/ what it ain't".

The devil is a gentleman while Satanism has more to do with a persons "core". The thin line where the ego apologizes and justifies (primal?) urges and acts upon it.

The heroine needle entering the vein, the cigarette butt in the ashtray, the spilled beers, the men and women marching the streets,...
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#112063 - 03/30/17 09:37 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Czereda]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
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Loc: Virginia
This notion operates on the assumption that once a person has gone to college, received the degree that they are employed in their field of study. More often than not, college graduates have a hard time finding work and end up in menial wage-jobs. If they can't support themselves, or pay off their loans, how can they pitch in to support the household?

Maybe over there, it works a bit differently in terms of how expenses are divided among the adults. I've spoken to my fair share of people from Norway and they often complain about how high the cost of living is, that living together is their only option for survival and that burden remains for the parents.

Do you have any stats from Poland that could demonstrate its success rate?

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#112069 - 03/30/17 03:25 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: SIN3]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 1793
Loc: Poland
SIN, I don't have statistics and I don't know about its success rate. I know a few examples from my neighborhood and that's all. I'm not claiming it's always the matter of mutual aid because it all depends on individual cases. In Poland an average income is low but an average pension is also low so if a working child lives with a retired parent there is more money. Of course, on condition that the kid works and spends money in a reasonable manner.

If I understood you well, you wrote that some parents kick their kids out and then the kids get in debt. Perhaps, it's because they can't afford to buy or rent an apartment. And then the parents take the child back after they got into a debt spiral? I see no logic in it unless I misunderstood you.


Edited by Czereda (03/30/17 03:30 PM)
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#112071 - 03/30/17 03:59 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Czereda]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 6737
Loc: Virginia
Not quite. I'm stating that young people don't always have that option. Even if they did, it's not always unanimously accepted in the household. Extending that security net, isn't always the best option because it just enables young people to count on it. What happens when they hit a situation and there isn't one there?
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#112073 - 03/30/17 05:07 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: SIN3]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 1793
Loc: Poland
But what happens if you're hit by a car or get sick and become handicapped? Shit can happen even if you learned to count only on yourself. I'm not talking about lazy bums who don't work but sit for the whole day watching TV and can't even cook a dinner for themselves but want their parents to change their diapers. I'm talking about people who are single, who work but live with their parents to cut the expenses and sometimes to even help their parents in house work because as the parents get older, they often need help. I realize it's not always an available option but if it is, then why make one's life more difficult?
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#112078 - 03/31/17 07:44 AM Re: What Satan Is to Me (A Revision). [Re: CanisMachina42]
Sargeist Offline
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Registered: 02/20/15
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If everything was random then particles would act randomly, we would be unable to observe repeated patterns of action. Fact is, they aren't and with our knowledge we are able to stablish laws which help us comprehend how and why everything in the universe works in the way it does.

I know chaos has a huge appeal, but I honestly think this has more to with subjective perception rather than with what is actually happening around us.


Edited by Sargeist (03/31/17 07:46 AM)
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#112079 - 03/31/17 09:08 AM Re: What Satan Is to Me (A Revision). [Re: Sargeist]
Megatron Offline
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Registered: 08/22/14
Posts: 859
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 Originally Posted By: Sargeist
If everything was random then particles would act randomly, we would be unable to observe repeated patterns of action.


Nah, it's actually a bit more tricky than that. You have to first establish the domain of the "randomness". Then perhaps what you accept as truly "random." And unless you believe each time-slice of the universe is itself randomly generated (as some kind of atom of space-time), you will be dealing with interconnections that are, by their very existence, conditioned across many axes, and hence not random by definition (i.e. dependent variables are a feature of reality).

Again, it's tricky . . .
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#112082 - 03/31/17 10:22 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Czereda]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 6737
Loc: Virginia
 Originally Posted By: Czereda
I realize it's not always an available option but if it is, then why make one's life more difficult?


You're missing the point. I'm speaking of future pay off from tempering yourself. You say it's making things easier, I disagree. It makes things a lot harder later.

Believe it or not, people without families get on fine without them.

People are available resources if you need them, they just need incentive to do things for you. Whether that's pay, or some other ROI makes no difference.

Shit will happen continually, it doesn't mean you need people to clean up the mess.

I'm not saying that you are purposely making your life difficult by refusing help, I'm saying that that should be a second thought - not a first thought.

Remember, this convo was sparked from the fundamental question: How can you know what you're really made of until you stand on your own?
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#112142 - 04/04/17 09:08 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Sargeist]
2ndHandSatanist Offline
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Registered: 01/01/16
Posts: 32
Loc: CHICAGOOOO
If an answer is what you seek, you will get an answer.

If a word is what you wish, you will get only one.

Your word is... 'BENIGN'.
What is the point of your word being BENIGN? Well it was that it made you feel special for one, no...?
But as well as that it was that you were going to see that ask a lot of questions.

Here is your answer:
BENIGN.

Leave it benign.
See how that levels out. \:\)
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#112150 - 04/05/17 04:33 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: 2ndHandSatanist]
Megatron Offline
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Registered: 08/22/14
Posts: 859
Loc: fuckit, some kid cracked my co...
 Originally Posted By: 2ndHandSatanist
If an answer is what you seek, you will get an answer.

If a word is what you wish, you will get only one.

Your word is... 'BENIGN'.
What is the point of your word being BENIGN? Well it was that it made you feel special for one, no...?
But as well as that it was that you were going to see that ask a lot of questions.

Here is your answer:
BENIGN.

Leave it benign.
See how that levels out. \:\)


Let me go out on a limb here and just say: this (^^^) person is awesome. It might actually take 3-digits of IQ to get the humor, dry as it is, but holy fuck, this is my new favorite Clubber.

Did I just say that? Where's my SpellChek? Stop fucking with me . . .


Edited by Megatron (04/05/17 04:36 AM)
Edit Reason: Oh, so NOW I can edit. Fucking Gnomes. I hate those motherfuckers.
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#112303 - 04/12/17 08:51 PM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Megatron]
Sargeist Offline
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Registered: 02/20/15
Posts: 346
Loc: Chile
After some days reformulating the ideas exposed on my previous post, I've come to a similar yet slightly different take on Satanism:

As I had mentioned earlier, Free Will is an illusion. We're all conditioned by our genes and environment. We have choices of course, but these are still determined by pre-existing factors.

So, if everything has been set for us already, is there a point in doing anything? Many people would actually feel relief at the idea that they no longer have to be held accountable for anything they do nor worry about tomorrow.

With Satanists, such is not the case.

As this video explains, just because we can't pinpoint the exact factors that led us to an action, we could, in theory isolate them - if we knew enough about all the beliefs, desires, and temperaments swirling around in our brains.

So my theory is that what makes Satanists stand out from the rest is that they have a better capacity to know themselves, their strengths and weaknesses, and the reasons why they do what they do. Once they have this information, they can use this knowledge to their benefit.

Most people go through this life in denial, which is why the alcoholic won't stop drinking and abstinence will only make him a slave of his weakness. Similar cases abound.

But, where's Satan then? Simple: "he/she" is the very essence of the universe, created at about the same time the Big Bang took place. Just as not all stars can become black holes, not everyone on this planet has what it takes to follow the path of Satan.

This is not to say that humans aren't individuals. It is in fact because of this determinism that humans are different from each other and therefore, conflict ensues. We are all someone else's Satan.

But does being the product of things we can't control mean that we shouldn't be held accountable for our actions? Indeed we should. Conflict doesn't mean that you let yourself be assaulted by somebody and say "oh poor thing he must have had a pretty terrible life to be doing this to me", it means that you fight back and rid the world of that sucker. Prey on the wild doesn't ask the predator for its motivations to chase it, either it defends itself or runs like hell. Forgiveness and self-sacrifice will hardly change your enemy's nature.

Knowing yourself gives you might, and Might is Right. There's divinity in Power and power in carnality.



Edited by Sargeist (04/12/17 09:37 PM)
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#112631 - 04/30/17 02:17 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: Sargeist]
fiendish Offline
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Registered: 02/27/16
Posts: 253
Either you are na´ve, or you think your readers are na´ve. By saying our choices are determined, you cancel free will. So, what makes you a Satanist if not free will to choose?
That he/she was created at the same time the Big Bang took place is a completely new theory to me. The belief that the center of the universe is Man is very old, yet it still stands as a conflict.
What is the true nature of conflict? It is the crush between two different individuals' free will. Or more. It is a part of a wider deflation process.
What is totally laughable is the comparison of the critical mass of a star with the ... "critical mass" of a Satanist. Yet this argument is so straight it makes me wonder, is there any validity up to it?
I totally agree that free will is an illusion, in a sense that we are slaves to our desires, not in that we're slaves to some kind of cosmic order. In a sense, that makes us alive.
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#112633 - 04/30/17 02:42 AM Re: What Satan is to me (an interpretation). [Re: fiendish]
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Posts: 751
Loc: Oregon
Sargeist, you have free will, albeit limited. What you choose is your own becoming. It is not an illusion, its misinterpretation is the flaw.
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