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#112854 - 05/22/17 11:23 AM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: when7iseleven]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
Speaking only for myself, I think it's fairly straight forward on the 'how'. Compromise is always treated like some mutual agreement but it's not. One person has to concede to the other, if the other part is in agreement then you've lowered your standards.

I refuse to. I am not required by any agency to lower the bar and I certainly won't concede to things I will not tolerate.

I think Dan has it right. I like the simplification too. If you do lower your standards, you end up resenting that decision later. I've learned that from experiences of youth.

Respect between two parties is the glue that holds the relationship together. Doesn't matter what the nature of that relationship is.

So going through life without compromise is pretty easy. It takes a really long time to know someone well. At some point you may realize the relationship is a dead end, so why continue it?

If you keep compromising, you learn fairly quickly that you have lost a step each time. Some people get so lost, they forget who they really are. All in the name of the 'relationship'. Fuck all that noise.
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#112857 - 05/22/17 12:36 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: SIN3]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
There are different levels of compromise. In my experience sometimes yielding raises my standards. Sometimes "undefiled wisdom" means acknowleging someone sees something you dont.
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#112858 - 05/22/17 01:58 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: when7iseleven]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 4001
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
Look, the fact that what I said is completely alien and unbelievable when compared to how you see the world and your place within it says all that needs to be said.

Do you really think I'm gonna sit here and explain to some little beta how being a man works? That just isn't something I, or anyone, can talk into you.

Maybe SIN can help, she seems to get it, and I'd bet money her(metaphorical at least) balls are twice the size of yours.

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#112859 - 05/22/17 03:33 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: Dan_Dread]
Creatura Noptii Offline
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Registered: 01/02/16
Posts: 950
Loc: Oregon
 Originally Posted By: samowens84
There are different levels of compromise.


Some show truth, others, no.

 Quote:
In my experience sometimes yielding raises my standards.


In context of the current discussion, it is safe to say there lies a difference between yielding and retaining.

 Quote:
Sometimes "undefiled wisdom" means acknowleging someone sees something you dont.


Quite the way to make a fool of yourself.
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#112860 - 05/22/17 03:44 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: Creatura Noptii]
samowens84 Offline
member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
 Originally Posted By: Creatura Noptii
 Originally Posted By: samowens84
There are different levels of compromise.


Some show truth, others, no.

 Quote:
In my experience sometimes yielding raises my standards.


In context of the current discussion, it is safe to say there lies a difference between yielding and retaining.

 Quote:
Sometimes "undefiled wisdom" means acknowleging someone sees something you dont.


Quite the way to make a fool of yourself.


Every path can lead to self-deception. Listening to others doesnt mean that the responsibility doesnt stop with me. However, I look at self-deception the same way I look at curses: the more you think you are immune, the more vulnerable you are. But hey, do what you like.

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#112861 - 05/22/17 03:53 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: samowens84]
Creatura Noptii Offline
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Registered: 01/02/16
Posts: 950
Loc: Oregon
I'm poking fun at your last sentence because its poorly constructed. I think I know what you mean, so let's be clear:

You can tell me you saw a ghost, but until I see it, your on dugs. The wisdom is comes in knowing what is.

I can tell men that sex is often a different experience from what is advertised. They might acknowledge it, but still not know. This is not a raised standard nor is it wisdom.

I acknowledge the probability that my martial arts master knows things I do not. This is only because I have obtained reasonable, and often painful evidence to it being so.

There are many beta bitch males infesting the group, while there are also strong refined men. The same goes for Satanism, and the world for that matter.
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#112862 - 05/22/17 03:59 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: Creatura Noptii]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
 Originally Posted By: Creatura Noptii
I'm poking fun at your last sentence because its poorly constructed. I think I know what you mean, so let's be clear:

I acknowledge the probability that my martial arts master knows things I do not. This is only because I have obtained reasonable, and often painful evidence to it being so.

Take someone just on word alone? No. You can tell me you saw a ghost, but until I see it, your on dugs.


Thats pretty much it. I acknowledge that there are deeper principles that I value that I refuse to compromise. In that way, there may be scenarios where listening to others is the best way not to compromise oneself. However, to take it further, just because I can learn from someone does not mean I trust them. I find if I know what boundaries I refuse to cross, it doesnt matter what kind of pseudo "reasonable" bullshit you can tell me.

However, I think this is a rigid defensive approach to "truth." I can seperate my mind from my emotions so that I may emotionally "believe" something to better sell a deception, and cognitively know that the emotional perspective is bullshit.

I dont think that wisdom about deciding what is, or isnt. Sometimes Ill just suspend judgement about a persons claim without making any assumptions about a persons state of mind, but that doesnt mean I wont ask them of they were on any hallucinogenics lol.


Edited by samowens84 (05/22/17 04:21 PM)

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#112863 - 05/22/17 04:28 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: samowens84]
Creatura Noptii Offline
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Registered: 01/02/16
Posts: 950
Loc: Oregon
Personal values are more vulnerable than you might think. When self preservation is in demand, you either fight or flight. This is when you know what you're made of. People mostly hold to their principles because they want to fit in. Those who can't adapt often fail in the progression of change.

In one way, every conclusion is a judgement. Deciding how to respond is often pre-programmed in order to defend or apprehend one's own best interests.

If you ask if they were on hallucinogens you have already judged that as a likely case.

*As per going solo, you make up what you do along the way and if you live and apply enough of your own faculties, you find what works and what doesn't, what's true and what's not.

Far as I can tell, it all depends on your personal situation. The world is both adversarial and harmonious.

To each their own.
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#112864 - 05/22/17 04:33 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: Creatura Noptii]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
As I said before, all roads can lead to self-deception. Im even willing to admit that self-preservation may be the only justification necessary. Recently I cut a lot of social ties pretty abruptly. A person called me and said that it was pretty cold, so I told him that I can be a cold-blooded narcissist and that it can be necessary to burn the old world down to build a new one. He respected that more I suspect than if I pretended that I was still being kind or considerate of them.

Sometimes people disguise self-preservation with cozy sounding "principles," but to me the test of a persons metal is when they are willing to seperate from others for what works for them. And what constitutes a "dealbreaker" is up to the individual.

However that last line was facetious. Most the time I wont even ask, cause unless it harms me I really dont care. I wont even question their mindset if they try to impose it on me, cause those types are fun to mock and play with.


Edited by samowens84 (05/22/17 04:48 PM)

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#112865 - 05/22/17 04:46 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: samowens84]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
 Originally Posted By: samowens84
There are different levels of compromise. In my experience sometimes yielding raises my standards.


There are also different levels of slave morality.

 Quote:
Sometimes "undefiled wisdom" means acknowleging someone sees something you dont.


Like a weakness you have? Just sayin'
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#112866 - 05/22/17 04:56 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: SIN3]
samowens84 Offline
member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
I suppose Im supposed to pretend that I have no weaknesses lol. So what?

Ill show you mine if you show me yours ;\)

And yes, "compromise" can enslave you. Whats your point?


Edited by samowens84 (05/22/17 05:13 PM)

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#112869 - 05/23/17 10:44 AM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: samowens84]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
No. Just pointing out the obvious. A person that wants something from you will exploit them. If you're amicable to that through compromise, you will only resent your own lapse in judgment.

Maybe you grow from it. Maybe you don't and end up a jaded retch of a person.

Choices, we all have the ability to make them.
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#112870 - 05/23/17 11:05 AM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: SIN3]
samowens84 Offline
member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 504
 Originally Posted By: SIN3
No. Just pointing out the obvious. A person that wants something from you will exploit them. If you're amicable to that through compromise, you will only resent your own lapse in judgment.


I agree with this, but to be honest Im usually the one doing the exploiting. And I had reached that point where I am pretty rigid about my desires and speak my mind pretty freely, which gets me into trouble because it sometimes lacks tact and offends people Id rather not offend. At this point though, I have liberated myself from resentment from that. However, being free from resentment has also meant being free from being emotionally attached to being right all the time, which is really the point I was trying to make.

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#112871 - 05/23/17 11:55 AM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: SIN3]
CanisMachina42 Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1427
Loc: Ca
An inverted hypothetical:

Imagine you're presented with vague possibilities of a reward being possible.

Then someone points out that your valuation of morality is wrong, and you're equally enslaved if you buy into the more "sinister" stuff, including moral transgression? What if they try to impress that you seeing certain values as an absolute is necessary for this vague reason by yelling at you like they've attained the privilege. Even playing on a relationship dynamic.

Still they make it seem like the way you think is hampering you some how, until it just sort of stops and goes away. Wouldn't you be then left to think that it was your LACK of compromise that was the problem...

 Couldn't that make you jaded and bitter?

Do 4th walls only break through compromise?
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#112875 - 05/23/17 02:11 PM Re: Satan The MGTOW [Re: CanisMachina42]
Creatura Noptii Offline
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Registered: 01/02/16
Posts: 950
Loc: Oregon
 Originally Posted By: CanisMachina42
Do 4th walls only break through compromise?


There is always some level of compromise in any relationship or action. Yes, even being true to yourself means the same. Those positive and negative outcomes to every action always play out. Self refinement breeds self-awareness. This is the best way to understand what's best for you in your life, but it will almost always be met with opposition. Overcoming one challenge means facing yet another.

That's life.
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