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#115974 - 03/07/18 03:29 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: SIN3]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
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Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2720
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
SIN3, "by geoge you've got it" with regard to your use of "personality", which is one of those generalizations we grew up with. MS zeroes in on such vaguenesses, because they can be made much less so, though this is increasingly unnerving to "accepted" authority.

For instance, as MS & others discuss, your MS [I don't like "soul" either] is not within your brain; it's an external find which just uses it, much as you would drive a car. Also, as the Egyptians realized and detailed, there are 8 of you, not just 1. Again discussed in the book. [It was scary stuff like this that terrified AMORC, as recounted in IlluminAnX.

The easy part is that anyone with initiation-capable intelligence can see all of the above personally & easily, once knowing that it's there to be found. Ouspensky is a good jump-start in his Psychology of Man's Possible Evolution, and Schwaller's Symblolism as simplified in Isha S.' Her-Bak. John Lilly's work was also invaluable when I was really on this quest in the 1980s, as well as the Ahnenerbe-SS and later Soviet stuff from the Natiopnal Archives, Michael Murtphy, et al.

If my body hangs together long enough, I'm thinking of doing a 2nd Edition of MS to go into several of the included topics in more detail. In my concept books it's always a challenge as to how far you can go with the "average intelligent" reader without MEGO. Raghavan Iyher and Rene Schwaller are two brilliant theoreticians whose writings managed MEGOd. RS at least had Isha and John Anthony West to "translate" him!
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#115975 - 03/07/18 03:45 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: samowens84]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
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Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2720
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
 Originally Posted By: samowens84
To use Sartre here, at what point does spirituality itself become bad faith and instead a form of egotism?

Many "movements" (not an inappropriate term) are woefully sloppy with regard to the "realty" premises they assume, but rarely address head-on. JPS is one of these; he wrote for a postwar French intelligentsia who'd been through all the psychomania of Expressionism & neo-Romanticism that culminated in WW2 and etc. Today's generations simply don't have that perspective, unless they've gone after it. Hence those extensive historical summaries in MS, each of which is just a glimpse, for which the Bibliography is background. Today of course there is also the Internet, which is a wonderful resource once you carefully filter out the "unicorns".
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#115978 - 03/07/18 11:34 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 459
 Originally Posted By: Michael A.Aquino
 Originally Posted By: samowens84
To use Sartre here, at what point does spirituality itself become bad faith and instead a form of egotism?

Many "movements" (not an inappropriate term) are woefully sloppy with regard to the "realty" premises they assume, but rarely address head-on. JPS is one of these; he wrote for a postwar French intelligentsia who'd been through all the psychomania of Expressionism & neo-Romanticism that culminated in WW2 and etc. Today's generations simply don't have that perspective, unless they've gone after it. Hence those extensive historical summaries in MS, each of which is just a glimpse, for which the Bibliography is background. Today of course there is also the Internet, which is a wonderful resource once you carefully filter out the "unicorns".


In my experience it might be important to know the history for various reasons, although I've noticed that it often seems to be used as a smokescreen. Not that that is the case here.

I've found one useful truth about Sartre that seems practical in my personal experience. I'm willing to qualify it and say perhaps I found a useful misinterpretation and application to avoid arguments regarding the subject's authority, which I will concede you as the obvious winner for such a waste of time. The nothingness separating a person from a task, job or application, even spirituality, has been vitally important for me to claim a space between myself and others for reasons of power and choice. In what he may or may not call the filter of non-being between myself and the roles I'm expected to play in any situation. This filter even allows me to ignore your historical analysis from a pragmatic perspective so as to discard anything that might not be practically useful. Even Sartre is irrelevant. It could have been written by the Easter Bunny and it wouldn't affect my personal power in applying it.

However at this point I view it as a necessary stepping stone. One that was necessary at a personal stage of development that I no longer need. To put it bluntly it seems useful as a deconstructive tool in my case until I was able to find greater personal truths.

*I would qualify it though that bubbles still happen and it still provides useful tools to avoid having the old graveyard re-imposed on me.


Edited by samowens84 (03/07/18 11:57 PM)

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#115979 - 03/08/18 03:43 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: samowens84]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
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Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2720
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
Understood. Pre-CoS 1969 I was an Eist because it was still the "in" thing to be, and very much synched with the pre-hippie Beats, of course. But ultimately it was a rejection of purpose, of reason, of Telos, in favor of mere bouncing off the sensation of the moment without looking for pre-meanings. Hence JPS' Nausea wherein Rouquentin, between sexual urges, is horrified by his own existence because of the sheer absence of reason for it, and of course his fit about the chestnut tree. I wondered whether Orwell named the ominous cafe in 1984 the CT as a sardonic comment; I'd have to check the publishing dates.

I ultimately became impatient with Eism because it makes a virtue out of being deliberately blind to meaning, whether inherent (Telos) or assigned (by god/s or humans). And of course the defining characteristic of the personal divinity which Satanism/Setian initiation seeks is the prerogative to assign meaning, which is what happened from lunch in the Garden of Eden and etc.

Although Fowles asserts Eism in Aristos, his Magus is certainly not an example of it, because Conchis asserts divine prerogative of reality definition, what Fowles calles the "god game" in Aristos.

Lesser Black Magic (detailed in TOS) is an application of god gaming, as is MindWar. The danger here is that once you assert this prerogative, it's all too easy to get carried away by it, either externally if you are Napoleon or Hitler, or within your own mind if you are Dr. Mornius.

It's for this reason that I do not recommend the LHP for most people, and why I wrote IlluminAnX to outline a good RHP alternative.

For noninitation I don't recommend Eism, for the reasons above. My preferred recommendation for most nIs is Stoicism, for which an excellent manual is this. I'm also gruntled by Marcus Aurelius Meditations.
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#115987 - 03/08/18 09:41 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 459
I ordered the book. A part of me has always been somewhat attracted to stoicism. My personal feelings with it is that it's a way to keep personal peace within the storm. To care about peace is to value meaning and purpose, and without getting too sentimental that has been vital to my survival and joy.

As far as the Left Hand Path is concerned I view the battle aspect as a battle for my soul. Not to conquer the world as much as to conquer my world. Personally I find it intuitive that it begins that way in a kind of Napoleon or Hitler kind of style, but the gravity of opposition pulls a person closer to his or her core until it becomes more personal gratifying and meaningful apart from others. The opposition is like a spiritual dojo. The strip club is like Luke going into the cave. There is dark spiritual wisdom to be found there. Having that knowledge makes it easier to discern love from power. Not that love is divorced from power. But to put it simply in finding a mate it makes it easier to be able to identify a threat when I see it and defend myself. To put it simply the game has become more subtle and purposeful the farther down the maze I get. The journey has personally felt less intrusive to others the more spiritually enriched I become. Where power is no longer empty, but joyful and personally enriching and satisfying.

I appreciate the book suggestion. I just ordered it. Although I do have a long list to go through already it will definitely be something I'll want to engage with when it arrives. Thank you.

"But ultimately it was a rejection of purpose, of reason, of Telos, in favor of mere bouncing off the sensation of the moment without looking for pre-meanings"

Was this perhaps vital for discarding bullshit so as to find your true self? Seems that for me in order to find true meaning and purpose it became necessary to assume there was none and let it find me. Fortunately I found it has.


Edited by samowens84 (03/08/18 09:50 AM)

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#115991 - 03/08/18 10:19 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
 Originally Posted By: Michael A.Aquino
SIN3, "by geoge you've got it" with regard to your use of "personality", which is one of those generalizations we grew up with.


I don't think it's a generalization at all, it's actually quite specific.

 Quote:
MS zeroes in on such vaguenesses, because they can be made much less so, though this is increasingly unnerving to "accepted" authority.


It may be your forum articulations of it but the impression I get is that much like the small volume of writing by Crowley, you seek to immortalize the nuances of Michael Aquino through your recent books. Even LaVey was guilty of this. Insulting that endeavor while doing precisely the same thing.

You do tend to speak in split tongues. What I find the most odd, is that you have a habit of insulting Atheists while calling us rude.
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#115996 - 03/08/18 05:42 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: SIN3]
Obitus Offline
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Registered: 07/20/17
Posts: 45
 Originally Posted By: SIN3
. . . much like the small volume of writing by Crowley . . .


Was that meant tongue-in-cheek or something? There's no way anyone actually familiar with even half of Crowley's output could seriously refer to it as a "small volume."

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#115997 - 03/08/18 06:52 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 459
 Originally Posted By: Michael A.Aquino
Understood. Pre-CoS 1969 I was an Eist because it was still the "in" thing to be, and very much synched with the pre-hippie Beats, of course. But ultimately it was a rejection of purpose, of reason, of Telos, in favor of mere bouncing off the sensation of the moment without looking for pre-meanings. Hence JPS' Nausea wherein Rouquentin, between sexual urges, is horrified by his own existence because of the sheer absence of reason for it, and of course his fit about the chestnut tree. I wondered whether Orwell named the ominous cafe in 1984 the CT as a sardonic comment; I'd have to check the publishing dates.



Forgiven me, I'm always a bit scattered. Just felt like clarifying some of my personal approaches which understandably you obviously didn't seem to appreciate, nor would I in your place.

I couldn't have exactly put this into words, but I wanted my experience to be mine, and the surest way seemed to be to approach it from a naive perspective that for me provided ceaseless wonder as I tracked my steps backwards and was amazed how in line they were and how precisely "Jungian," at the risk of sounding pretentious. I had an intense craving to know, and found some certainty that gives me peace I never thought possible. This is just insight into my drive and my personal psychology, if that should interest you.


Edited by samowens84 (03/08/18 06:54 PM)

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#116000 - 03/09/18 05:52 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: samowens84]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
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Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2720
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
Just to show you what you missed during the Existentialist heyday of the Beats in the 1950s, this is a pretty good example of what I'd find at any North Beach coffee house. \:D
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#116003 - 03/09/18 10:05 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Obitus]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
 Originally Posted By: Obitus
 Originally Posted By: SIN3
. . . much like the small volume of writing by Crowley . . .


Was that meant tongue-in-cheek or something? There's no way anyone actually familiar with even half of Crowley's output could seriously refer to it as a "small volume."


I was speaking particularly to the specific writing in his legacy that covered the issue of immortality through legend and influence.


You should know better, especially if you are as well versed as you let on. There was only a few works that focused on that specifically.
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#116076 - 03/18/18 04:15 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: SIN3]
Creatura Noptii Offline
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Registered: 01/02/16
Posts: 950
Loc: Oregon
SIN3 tells me some time back, she doesn't want to chat with me about the same shit over and over.

So my question is this, what exactly are you still doing here...?

A serious study of Satanism...

Ah, yes, because nothing of that sort has ever been debated.

Maybe you'll have better luck at peganspace, you can dress up like elves and get drunk of Druid fruit juice.
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#116080 - 03/18/18 10:28 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Creatura Noptii]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
Better luck with what specifically ? You would do better to pay attention, rather than focusing on me and my intentions.
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#116082 - 03/19/18 02:43 AM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: SIN3]
Dimitri Offline
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Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3314
Self-reflection by seeing the opinions of others and contrasting those with your own. Let's not indulge too much into idolatry of and about the past, those were people to.

Serious study does not imply archive-digging to find supposed gems or "originals". There's plenty of raw material to work with, and built upon, from scratch.
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#116106 - 03/20/18 12:30 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: Dimitri]
SIN3 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/13
Posts: 7190
Loc: Virginia
It's all repetition. What's new under the sun? Seems to me that lamenting over a lack of 'serious study' misses the mark of what's actually going on currently.
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#116107 - 03/20/18 03:11 PM Re: Serious Study of Satanism [Re: SIN3]
Czereda Online
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2092
Loc: Poland
Oh how postmodern of you.

"Nothing is original. Steal from anywhere that resonates with inspiration or fuels your imagination."

So what's currently going on, in your opinion?
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