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#116961 - 09/05/18 09:06 AM Internalized racism of white women
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
I've heard this argument from white women when I discuss oppression that they're experiencing from black society in the forms of structured rape gangs and things like that, and the response that I get is "white men rape too." It then becomes this absurd numbers game. Except my point isn't about which race rapes more, genetics, etc. Its that white people have been structured to oppress themselves, and that responding by only fucking black men, or refusing to have white babies in favor of black ones is a form of racism.

When black women influence white men too naive about magic into pedophilia, and white women let them, you're saying you hate your daughters. Because of your contempt for the man too weak to see what's going on, you are exposing white girls to being violated by him. Hatred is an action. By avoiding responsibility, that's on you. And then when you awaken to that oppression, they've sent rape gangs against you, and then the solution is have black children out of fear and self-hatred. Its not about genetics, and its not a personal romantic beef. Although sometimes the pain is personal. Its watching white women apologize to their oppressors for feeling anger at being violated by the system they've tried to heal. Do what you want, but some things are bigger then me and you, and consider the possibility that your resentment has made you into the simpleton, not me.


Edited by samowens84 (09/05/18 09:06 AM)

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#116963 - 09/05/18 10:05 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2150
Loc: Poland
I've read your post five times and still don't know what your damn non point is. That some niggers rape white women? Shit happens and usually for reasons that have nothing to do with race. That some raped women choose to keep the baby? I doubt it has anything to do with race too. There was a woman in my area too who got raped and pregnant but refused to have an abortion. She then kept the baby. Who the fuck knows why? She didn't have kids, perhaps she wanted to have one. One thing is certain. The rapist was a native Pole. That some women prefer fucking black men? To each their own.

I just wonder what makes you think that black women use magic to influence white men into becoming pedophiles. How are they supposed to do this? By slicing roosters' throats? Oh that mess in your head.


Edited by Czereda (09/05/18 10:13 AM)
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#116965 - 09/05/18 11:35 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Czereda]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: Czereda
I've read your post five times and still don't know what your damn non point is. That some niggers rape white women? Shit happens and usually for reasons that have nothing to do with race. That some raped women choose to keep the baby? I doubt it has anything to do with race too. There was a woman in my area too who got raped and pregnant but refused to have an abortion. She then kept the baby. Who the fuck knows why? She didn't have kids, perhaps she wanted to have one. One thing is certain. The rapist was a native Pole. That some women prefer fucking black men? To each their own.

I just wonder what makes you think that black women use magic to influence white men into becoming pedophiles. How are they supposed to do this? By slicing roosters' throats? Oh that mess in your head.


I'm speaking truths that just simply are. Either you see it or you don't. Either you accept it or you don't. I suspect you already know, and are just playing dumb through pride or plain stubborness.

If you have any real doubts I suggest you ask whatever black woman you may feel you trust and be open to whatever your intuition tells you. That would be all the convincing you need. Perhaps one might resist this fact to avoid feeling foolish, but that's the point.

Like you said, if it was a "none issue" why respond? Its not to me. You don't even know me. Likely its that voice inside your head that suggests that what I said is true and you don't want to accept it because of what it may cost you emotionally.

And I've seen things consistently and yes, there are rape gangs out there. They aren't random. They're power plays against women they've considered a threat. Beyond that I have nothing but compassion regarding what you said about pregnancies that happened as a consequence of rape. Not that has anything to do with my situation right now with anyone I know, but I have sympathy and get it intellectually, though I won't pretend to know what that pain is like. That would be an insult.

Regarding "keeping the baby" isn't what I was discussing. I was discussing about some situations regarding women deliberately procreating with black men as a form of self-repudiation. Some have expressed that plainly. Although personally I consider anyone taking advantage of Stockholm syndrome to make babies with vulnerable white women to be a form of rape. Beyond that I'm just being open about things I've seen and hope some discussion actually helps with healing. I'm not casting any judgment.

As far as what makes me think certain things, I've just been on the front lines regarding certain situations and because of my unique perspective I might know things you don't. Perhaps you find merit in that, perhaps you don't. I don't care except I have a vague and likely vain hope you or someone else might do some personal investigating in their own lives to find out if I'm right or not. But maybe that's too much to hope for, judging by your reaction.

But bottom line is that my point is that it seems to me that many "opinions" or "sexual preferences" are engineered that way socially, and that many white woman hold opinions regarding these situations that they think are individualistic and unique, but are strategically designed so that white women can oppress themselves. Consider that my Marxist analysis of this situation.

Many white women have been culled into destroying themselves and their children, act as slave catchers for any white men who may dare think for themselves, and unwittingly offering up their daughters as sex slaves, all in the name of "social justice." Thats the unfortunate reality of the mindset many white women found themselves in, all the while thinking they are so clever and making their own decisions, when as in the case of any slave, someone made those decisions for you.

If you ever were a white woman bounty hunter let me ask you. If you think it isn't about race, how many bounties have you collected on black men versus white men? Answer that and then tell me race has nothing to do with it.


Edited by samowens84 (09/05/18 12:19 PM)

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#116969 - 09/05/18 02:45 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2150
Loc: Poland
You're really fond of writing a lot without actually saying anything. I don't have to investigate into things that exist in your head. If you claim something, then it's up to you to prove it.

But let's assume that the majority of gang rape perpetrators are blacks. How does it correlate with consensual sexual acts between white women and black males? If some women prefer black partners, then do you think it must be a result of self-loathing and social indoctrination? If so, then it's a fallacious reasoning on your part.

Let's say I want to have sex with one particular nigger. In your opinion, I shouldn't because some other niggers like raping white women. Therefore, I should only fuck with white males. This is dumb.

Races mix and interbreed just like various breeds of dogs... or cats. There is nothing unnatural in it, even if you find it abhorrent personally.


Edited by Czereda (09/05/18 02:58 PM)
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#116970 - 09/05/18 04:47 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Czereda]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: Czereda
You're really fond of writing a lot without actually saying anything. I don't have to investigate into things that exist in your head. If you claim something, then it's up to you to prove it.

But let's assume that the majority of gang rape perpetrators are blacks. How does it correlate with consensual sexual acts between white women and black males? If some women prefer black partners, then do you think it must be a result of self-loathing and social indoctrination? If so, then it's a fallacious reasoning on your part.

Let's say I want to have sex with one particular nigger. In your opinion, I shouldn't because some other niggers like raping white women. Therefore, I should only fuck with white males. This is dumb.

Races mix and interbreed just like various breeds of dogs... or cats. There is nothing unnatural in it, even if you find it abhorrent personally.


Do what you want. I really don't care to be honest. Either you know it or you don't.

Fuck those who wish to fuck themselves. Good motto to live by. Just not a role model I'd want for my daughter. Do what you want. Its your life.

I'm just very selective about my company and what poison they bring into my circle. Lol why not just ignore me? Who are you trying to convince anyway?

I still say you're playing dumb. I said a lot more then what you're selectively responding too.

Probably too painful to admit you've been used and betrayed by people you thought were your friends. They're fake friends trying to block you. Its so transparent its laughable. Like a female being cuckholded by her lesbian lover.

Everyone can see it but you. How cliche is that?

And who brought biology into it? Arguing with arguments I never made. They call that a straw man last I checked. But what do I know. You're the expert on logic right?

And regarding the consensual acts, I call it Stockholm syndrome. To me a lot of times its about as consensual as a pimp having sex with his prostitutes. Like women dyeing their skin black and having automatic sexual responses to those around her because she's been conditioned to feel inferior. Like black men in the 19th century.

"White people are mean and we deserve to suffer." Some of the shit I hear out of the mouths of some women talking just like you, and then claiming their attraction to black men is just "neutral." An unfortunate socially engineered delusion,unfortunately.


Edited by samowens84 (09/05/18 05:03 PM)

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#116971 - 09/05/18 05:08 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2150
Loc: Poland
And what arguments have you made? Sorry but I don't see any. All I figured out from your post is whining about white women being used by blacks while being unaware of it.

And making assumptions about my life and friends is funny. Projecting your own thoughts and problems onto other people and making gross generalizations seems to be your modus operandi.
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#116975 - 09/05/18 07:09 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Czereda]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
Its weird when I'm playing a chess match with a friend, and no matter the outcome, we all win. Just a general sentiment or whatever. Today I got bettered by a friend of mine. Got a t-shirt for me to sign? Lol and yet I'm better for it. You'd think we were married or something if I didn't know better. I'm speaking in simile of course ;).

Edited by samowens84 (09/05/18 07:45 PM)

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#116979 - 09/06/18 12:32 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dimitri Offline
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Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
Racial preference on sexual level might be a thing.
It has something to do with "fetishizing the forbidden".
A sexual trigger it is.

And most women in Western countries want a raw and confident man.
Which is generally associated with blacks.

Racism confirmed, but everyone is to a certain extend.
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#116980 - 09/06/18 05:24 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2150
Loc: Poland
Yeah. You know what I think? That no matter how smart or how lame our arguments are, we can all feel like winners here. This is the beauty of forum debates. It would be worse (or better) if we started to think we are too clever for this forum. Fortunately (or unfortunately), we haven't yet reached that high level of self-congratulatory delusion. That would be like peeing from the heights of a skyscraper and we are too modest for that.
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#119772 - 08/14/19 10:08 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Czereda]
SinisterNeophyte Offline
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Registered: 08/14/19
Posts: 4
Loc: England

[/quote] Races mix and interbreed just like various breeds of dogs... or cats. There is nothing unnatural in it, even if you find it abhorrent personally. [/quote]

The breed of a dog would be equivalent to ethnicity not race, as the dog belongs to the Canine family. Just like an Englishman or woman and a German Herr or Frau belongs to the Teutonic family.

The mixing of two races (non-European ethnicity and European ethnicty or of mixed European ethnicity in this scenario) would be equivalent to a wolf and a lion mating. The wolf and the lion belong to entirely different geographical locations with totally different environments. Just as a sub-Saharan African and an Italian do.

Had it not been for inventions of mobility (boats, planes, automotive vehicles etc.) other races would never have known about each other. Nature did not build those inventions we did. So it is safe to say that the mixing of races in in fact not natural because we created the conditions necessary for it to occur.
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#119773 - 08/14/19 10:11 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Czereda]
SinisterNeophyte Offline
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Registered: 08/14/19
Posts: 4
Loc: England
 Originally Posted By: Czereda

Races mix and interbreed just like various breeds of dogs... or cats. There is nothing unnatural in it, even if you find it abhorrent personally.


The breed of a dog would be equivalent to ethnicity not race, as the dog belongs to the Canine family. Just like an Englishman or woman and a German Herr or Frau belongs to the Teutonic family.

The mixing of two races (non-European ethnicity and European ethnicty or of mixed European ethnicity for "White" Americans) would be equivalent to a wolf and a lion mating. The wolf and the lion belong to entirely different geographical locations with totally different environments. Just as a sub-Saharan African and an Italian do.

Had it not been for inventions of transportation (boats, planes, automotive vehicles etc.) other races would never have known about each other. Nature did not build those inventions we did. So it is safe to say that the mixing of races in in fact not natural because we created the conditions necessary for it to occur.
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#119774 - 08/14/19 12:07 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: SinisterNeophyte]
Kori Houghton Offline
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Registered: 11/23/15
Posts: 206
Loc: East Coast USA
 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
 Originally Posted By: Czereda

Races mix and interbreed just like various breeds of dogs... or cats. There is nothing unnatural in it, even if you find it abhorrent personally.


The breed of a dog would be equivalent to ethnicity not race, as the dog belongs to the Canine family. Just like an Englishman or woman and a German Herr or Frau belongs to the Teutonic family.


The various ethnicities of modern humans with different eye shapes, body shapes, skin tones, hair textures, etc. are the same thing as dog and cat "breeds". All modern humans are the same species, mostly. The small percentage of differences among modern humans is the amount of DNA we may have inherited from other human species that no longer exist except for these tiny bits that survive in us.

 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
The mixing of two races (non-European ethnicity and European ethnicty or of mixed European ethnicity for "White" Americans) would be equivalent to a wolf and a lion mating.


Nope. It is the equivalent of a Persian cat and a Siamese cat mating, or a Beagle and a Pit Bull. Because, like, a wolf and a lion can't "mate" -- produce offspring. While modern humans whose ethnic origins are on opposite sides of the planet can, and certainly do, have healthy human children. You. Stupid. Fuck.


 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
The wolf and the lion belong to entirely different geographical locations with totally different environments. Just as a sub-Saharan African and an Italian do.


Geographical location has nothing to do with it. My next door neighbor's front door key won't fit my front door lock, even though the doors are 3 feet apart.


 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
Had it not been for inventions of transportation (boats, planes, automotive vehicles etc.) other races would never have known about each other.


But we are all the same "race". How did humans wind up populating 6 continents? Have feet, will walk. Have brain, feel curious and go exploring. You're right, before modern travel none of us knew exactly what surprises the planet held in terms of distant land masses and their inhabitants. But that doesn't mean a native Australian and a native Alaskan aren't the same "race".

 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
Nature did not build those inventions we did. So it is safe to say that the mixing of races in in fact not natural because we created the conditions necessary for it to occur.


Wait...what? Humans could always walk from the southern tip of Africa to Norway or to China without building any device for transportation. So, of course, they did! And here we are.
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#119775 - 08/14/19 02:16 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Kori Houghton]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
"Nope. It is the equivalent of a Persian cat and a Siamese cat mating, or a Beagle and a Pit Bull. Because, like, a wolf and a lion can't "mate" -- produce offspring. While modern humans whose ethnic origins are on opposite sides of the planet can, and certainly do, have healthy human children. You. Stupid. Fuck."

Not necessarily. Not when mixing races is just an excuse to avoid responsibilities and dilute animal love and care.

The difference between animals and humans is that humans have more memories and regard for past hurts then animals do, and can potentially influence humans to care more about evening some imaginary score and avoiding responsibility.

Interracial relationships I feel express that.

People don't seem in those cases to be running to something as much as away from the hurt in their own communities.

To compare humans to animals is an insult to animals.

Animals aren't nearly so irresponsible and petty. They simply love as unconditionally as nature intended, without constantly indulging in past hurts to distract themselves from love and survival.

Thats the flaw I perceive that bonds interracial relationships. Two people just trying to escape taking responsibility for their own communities and using each other's wounds and experience to mirror their excuses and rationalizations for doing so.

What they tell their communities given the circumstances that they don't deserve their help and love and.that they'd given up on them.

Wouldn't anyone feel hurt and angry and abandoned?

That lack of understanding from those attempting to engage in interracial relationships implies a lack of empathy that likely would eventually carry over into even their interracial relations, as they may wake up and find out it was only their pain that got married, and the two of them only came along for the ride.

Pain and trauma has the potential to heighten intimacy and protective instincts. But when parts of the world are fucked up, that protective insinct seemed to have the side affect of protecting human trafficking and exploiting innocent people.

That's what I find racist about interracial relationships.

It seems to drag both communities down rather than lift them up.

Just saying.

And none of what I'm saying or describing manifests any of these things, it's just my observations of Dynamics with the hope that some will listen and take more responsibility.

Love and Peace.


Edited by samowens84 (08/14/19 02:23 PM)

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#119776 - 08/14/19 02:30 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: SinisterNeophyte]
Czereda Offline
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Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2150
Loc: Poland
No matter what ignorant people, like you, think, mixing of races is natural because there is no biological obstacle that would prevent interbreeding. The genetic material is so similar that people of different human races can and do produce a healthy and fertile offspring. Now, that cannot be said about a wolf and a lion. Are you for real?
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#119778 - 08/15/19 03:28 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: SinisterNeophyte]
Dimitri Offline
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Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
I suggest you look up Taxology once more.
Race is defined as "sharing particular characteristics, belonging to a shared group".

Your comparison between lions and wolves is incorrect by reason they are two different species.

The mixing of races is, in all actuality, natural. It happens in different species but is more rare. I even daresay that interbreeding has been around since the dawn of life. Sadly enough will the resulting offspring have lower chances of survival in general.

If you do not believe me, search for different dogbreeds and their evolutionary tree.
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#119780 - 08/15/19 11:47 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
Part I: Get Sober. Get Help.

 Originally Posted By: samowens84
I'm speaking truths that just simply are. Either you see it or you don't. Either you accept it or you don't. I suspect you already know, and are just playing dumb through pride or plain stubborness.
Take a look in the mirror on the "stubborn pride" front.

Your first paragraph was clear enough, but then you started in on crap about being "too naive about magic" and referred to black women making white men pedos (?) as if this were so self-evident it needed no explanation. Then you start ranting in broad abstractions, an incoherent mess that reads like ramblings induced by heavy deliriants.

The only statement you've managed to articulate is six words: "Mudsharks miscegenate due to self loathing." That's it. As for the rest, nobody's playing dumb or pretending not to understand because they're so offended by your harsh truths that they're in denial. They can't read it because it's a sloppy pile of inarticulate gibberish.

Were this your first post, I'd report you to the mods for failing to make coherent sense. You might not be the most brilliant wordsmith the board has ever seen, but I know you can do better. Please lay the fuck off whatever drugs you're on.

Part II: Addressing your thesis: "Mudsharks miscegenate due to self loathing."

Mostly disagree. Here's why.

I've never hooked up with or dated a black guy. But I've dated some real losers. I'd like to think I've developed some self-awareness over the years, so here's my analysis of what I learned.

My primary reason for doing so wasn't self-loathing; it was conceit. In my mind, I was an angelic savior, and I could heal these poor troubled souls with the power of my panacea pussy.

(As it turns out, no. Pussy is a recreational drug, not a medicinal drug. It makes you feel good, but it ain't gonna fix what's wrong with you.)

The "sad bad boy" in every franchise is always a hit with the female audience because he has dual appeal. The dangerous, violent side of him gives him a sexual allure, a rush of adrenaline. But the tragic backstory that explains why he's so twisted rouses the mushy maternal side that just wants to cradle and nurture his poor, troubled soul. In fiction, it's panty-wetting material for tween girls. In real life, it drives real young women like moths to the flame. Some learn their lesson. Some don't.

There are other factors, of course. Some women just can't do any better because they're a hot mess themselves. Some women might actually have a bit of the white guilt as a contributing factor. But I think what I described is the main reason.

Sociopolitical movements aren't going to substantially alter patterns of sexual attraction.* That groove is well carved by millennia of evolution. It's not going to suddenly change course due to a recent fad of a "social movement." Fat acceptance certainly hasn't increased the number of men that want to smash landwhale ass, has it? Are any more men interested in lifting up a skirt to find a dick despite all the whining about how rejecting transwomen is discrimination?

No. The dick wants what it wants, and the pussy wants what it wants, and political correctness has no votes.

*At most, they'll alter how socially acceptable it is to act on sexual attraction that was already there.

Part III: About that Mirror...

So what's your problem, dude? Why are you on the internet, whining about mudsharkery? Who hurt you?

I suspect you're avoiding the revelation that women don't like thirsty doormats like you. You could come to grips with that and grow a spine, but you'd have to do some unflattering introspection first. Who wants to do that when you can blame society?

So you've convinced yourself those darned black Chads are hoarding all the white pussy. You'd have your white wife and your white picket fence in a wholesome affirmation of white community, if only it weren't for LeBron cockblocking you!

Blame everybody but yourself, dude. Whatever it takes to stave off the painful truth that you are responsible for your own unfuckability.
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#119782 - 08/16/19 12:13 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: SinisterNeophyte]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: SinisterNeophyte
The breed of a dog would be equivalent to ethnicity not race...The mixing of two races (non-European ethnicity and European ethnicty or of mixed European ethnicity in this scenario) would be equivalent to a wolf and a lion mating. The wolf and the lion belong to entirely different geographical locations with totally different environments. Just as a sub-Saharan African and an Italian do.
You are aware there are certain breeds of dog that originate in specific regions of the world, right?

 Quote:
So it is safe to say that the mixing of races in in fact not natural because we created the conditions necessary for it to occur.
"Unnatural" doesn't necessarily mean bad.
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#119783 - 08/16/19 01:10 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: SinisterNeophyte]
CanisMachina42 Offline
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Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
 Quote:
The mixing of two races (non-European ethnicity and European ethnicty or of mixed European ethnicity in this scenario) would be equivalent to a wolf and a lion mating. The wolf and the lion belong to entirely different geographical locations with totally different environments. Just as a sub-Saharan African and an Italian do.


I choose to view this as dry humor as it is less painful, but given the handle...

So let us identify why this is so wrong, starting from a taxonomy standpoint.

Lion:

Kingdom:Animalia
Phylum:Chordata
Class:Mammalia
Order:Carnivora
Family:Felidae
Genus:Panthera
Scientific Name:Panthera leo
Common Name:Lion
Other Name(s):African Lion

Wolf:

Kingdom:Animalia
Phylum:Chordata
Class:Mammalia
Order:Carnivora
Family:Canidae
Genus:Canis
Scientific Name: Canis Rufus
Common Name: Wolf

All Persons:

Kingdom:Animalia
Phylum:Chordata
Class:Mammalia
Order:Primates
Family:Hominidae
Genus:Homo
Scientific Name: Homo Sapiens
Common Name: Human

Start at around 70,000 BCE. The Toba Supervolcano caused a population bottleneck reducing breeding pairs down to less than 10,000.  From that point you have the first natural hybridization of the human genome thanks in part to interbreeding with other hominids, so much so they were bred out of existence.  With traces of Neanderthal in all Europeans, and denisovan for  all Papua New Guinea weirdos.

At this point a few things happened...

1. Inbreeding out of necessity
2. Migration and environmental -> physical changes. - Melanin and afro hair wasn't really important in northern Europe.

It is inaccurate to compare dog breeds to anything natural, or races to apples and lions. Dog breeds are the equivalent of the Alien OG cannabis strain at 35.5% THC. A deliberate type of eugenics/selective breeding. So consider a dashhound a canine indica variant.

Humans were a result of geographical and environmental differences which change physiology relatively quickly on a grand scale, but without intelligent interdiction. It doesn't take long for the proverbial Darwinius Masillae to be born with lighter skin in a place where the sun shines less. 

What you are seeing with humans is if the wolf lost its fur, started walking upright, and began spreading throughout the world without fur.; As the loss of protection to ultraviolet radiation is the main differences in all races.

Evidence still exists. You can follow  complexion, facial formation, and language transitions around the world. Meaning as you travel everyone looks or behaves progressively more a certain way.  Crazy how it blends.

Take white people out of the Americas and follow "mongoloids" (bullshit term) around the world.  Start in Southeast Asia and follow it through Mongolia, which has a language sounding similar to vietnamese, and on to Alaska which has a language that sounds similar to Mongolian, and then down to the southwest and the Navajo that have a language that sounds Inuit.

You can literally follow this around the globe. Even technologically enhanced migrations leave trails.

There are no different breeds of human just evolutionary gradients of a single species. The Master Race is a lie, scentless apprentice.
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#119784 - 08/16/19 01:18 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: XiaoGui17
Part I: Get Sober. Get Help.

 Originally Posted By: samowens84
I'm speaking truths that just simply are. Either you see it or you don't. Either you accept it or you don't. I suspect you already know, and are just playing dumb through pride or plain stubborness.
Take a look in the mirror on the "stubborn pride" front.

Your first paragraph was clear enough, but then you started in on crap about being "too naive about magic" and referred to black women making white men pedos (?) as if this were so self-evident it needed no explanation. Then you start ranting in broad abstractions, an incoherent mess that reads like ramblings induced by heavy deliriants.

The only statement you've managed to articulate is six words: "Mudsharks miscegenate due to self loathing." That's it. As for the rest, nobody's playing dumb or pretending not to understand because they're so offended by your harsh truths that they're in denial. They can't read it because it's a sloppy pile of inarticulate gibberish.

Were this your first post, I'd report you to the mods for failing to make coherent sense. You might not be the most brilliant wordsmith the board has ever seen, but I know you can do better. Please lay the fuck off whatever drugs you're on.

Part II: Addressing your thesis: "Mudsharks miscegenate due to self loathing."

Mostly disagree. Here's why.

I've never hooked up with or dated a black guy. But I've dated some real losers. I'd like to think I've developed some self-awareness over the years, so here's my analysis of what I learned.

My primary reason for doing so wasn't self-loathing; it was conceit. In my mind, I was an angelic savior, and I could heal these poor troubled souls with the power of my panacea pussy.

(As it turns out, no. Pussy is a recreational drug, not a medicinal drug. It makes you feel good, but it ain't gonna fix what's wrong with you.)

The "sad bad boy" in every franchise is always a hit with the female audience because he has dual appeal. The dangerous, violent side of him gives him a sexual allure, a rush of adrenaline. But the tragic backstory that explains why he's so twisted rouses the mushy maternal side that just wants to cradle and nurture his poor, troubled soul. In fiction, it's panty-wetting material for tween girls. In real life, it drives real young women like moths to the flame. Some learn their lesson. Some don't.

There are other factors, of course. Some women just can't do any better because they're a hot mess themselves. Some women might actually have a bit of the white guilt as a contributing factor. But I think what I described is the main reason.

Sociopolitical movements aren't going to substantially alter patterns of sexual attraction.* That groove is well carved by millennia of evolution. It's not going to suddenly change course due to a recent fad of a "social movement." Fat acceptance certainly hasn't increased the number of men that want to smash landwhale ass, has it? Are any more men interested in lifting up a skirt to find a dick despite all the whining about how rejecting transwomen is discrimination?

No. The dick wants what it wants, and the pussy wants what it wants, and political correctness has no votes.

*At most, they'll alter how socially acceptable it is to act on sexual attraction that was already there.

Part III: About that Mirror...

So what's your problem, dude? Why are you on the internet, whining about mudsharkery? Who hurt you?

I suspect you're avoiding the revelation that women don't like thirsty doormats like you. You could come to grips with that and grow a spine, but you'd have to do some unflattering introspection first. Who wants to do that when you can blame society?

So you've convinced yourself those darned black Chads are hoarding all the white pussy. You'd have your white wife and your white picket fence in a wholesome affirmation of white community, if only it weren't for LeBron cockblocking you!

Blame everybody but yourself, dude. Whatever it takes to stave off the painful truth that you are responsible for your own unfuckability.


This was entertaining defensive gibberish.

What, exactly, is your point?

Is this like your parody of Zach?

Like, are you drunk?


Edited by samowens84 (08/16/19 01:23 AM)

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#119790 - 08/16/19 09:09 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dark Light 444 Offline
member


Registered: 08/02/17
Posts: 402
Meth is a helluva drug, huh, Sam? I remember when I used to do meth decades ago, I used to write a bunch of gibberish much like you, thinking Iíd hit upon all these revelations, when really it was just useless crap. I still write useless crap, I just donít go on and on about it anymore. My bullshit is much more succinct now, and my body isnít being destroyed in the process by street urchin poison.
_________________________
K.I.S.S.

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#119792 - 08/16/19 10:38 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dark Light 444]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: Dark Light 444
Meth is a helluva drug, huh, Sam? I remember when I used to do meth decades ago, I used to write a bunch of gibberish much like you, thinking Iíd hit upon all these revelations, when really it was just useless crap. I still write useless crap, I just donít go on and on about it anymore. My bullshit is much more succinct now, and my body isnít being destroyed in the process by street urchin poison.


I don't agree that what I said was gibberish.

But if youre saying that you used to do meth but dont anymore, then I'm genuinely relieved.

The things I've written that was responded too wasn't useless. It was a moral imperative and it was clear and strong.

To try and make it look otherwise suggests a moral weakness and failing on their part.

The question is, when they're smart enough to know that, why?


Edited by samowens84 (08/16/19 10:52 AM)

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#119793 - 08/16/19 02:29 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dark Light 444 Offline
member


Registered: 08/02/17
Posts: 402
Well, thanks for trying to save my soul. It didnít work, but hey, you do you.
_________________________
K.I.S.S.

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#119795 - 08/16/19 05:46 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dark Light 444]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
I give people the opportunity to save their own soul. Of course, it might be that someone like you might rather have counter productive prid rather than admit to yourself that I helped you. But hey, you do you.
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#119799 - 08/17/19 12:51 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
CanisMachina42 Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
 Quote:
I give people the opportunity to save their own soul. Of course, it might be that someone like you might rather have counter productive prid rather than admit to yourself that I helped you. But hey, you do you.




And I thought I had delusions of grandeur. Your writing is also sliding towards the unintelligible at the same time your self image trends towards Jesus.

This really does lend towards methamphetamine or some other underlying mental condition deteriorating.

Are the angels/spirits getting screwy?

It is my experience meth users on Satanic forums are quite frequently in contact with one or several of these, and on a personal basis.
_________________________
Spiritual : Abstraction ::

D. Scientific : Quod erat demonstrandum

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#119825 - 08/19/19 01:12 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: GrandChampMayday]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
Even though you are banned now and probably won't read this...

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Everyone has a voice and the capability to voice an opinion.
That is anyones freedom.

You can ignore others and leave them to their value.
Asking others to not give attention to an opinion you do not like is misplaced entitlement.

As such it is more correct to remove those instead of the others.
_________________________
Ut vivat, crescat et floreat

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#119828 - 08/19/19 02:20 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dimitri]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: Dimitri
Even though you are banned now and probably won't read this...

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Everyone has a voice and the capability to voice an opinion.
That is anyones freedom.

You can ignore others and leave them to their value.
Asking others to not give attention to an opinion you do not like is misplaced entitlement.

As such it is more correct to remove those instead of the others.


This is hypocritical. People have a right to voicw their opinion, and a right to voice their opposition.

The above just looks like tjonly disguised put up or shut up tyranny that seems more abrahamic than satanic.

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#119830 - 08/19/19 02:47 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
CanisMachina42 Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
Oh shut the fuck up you whiny bitch. XG just trashed your ass into the ground and all you could muster were stuttering one line responses that made you look somewhat sad.

It's all a matter of how you respond to such on point criticism, and (don't I know) there are several ways to respond to such things.

You have chosen to little bitch nitpick anyone that sides with the person that just dismantled you.

This must be guidance counselor Satanism in action.
_________________________
Spiritual : Abstraction ::

D. Scientific : Quod erat demonstrandum

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#119837 - 08/19/19 06:27 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: CanisMachina42]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
 Originally Posted By: CanisMachina42
Oh shut the fuck up you whiny bitch. XG just trashed your ass into the ground and all you could muster were stuttering one line responses that made you look somewhat sad.

It's all a matter of how you respond to such on point criticism, and (don't I know) there are several ways to respond to such things.

You have chosen to little bitch nitpick anyone that sides with the person that just dismantled you.

This must be guidance counselor satanism in action.


Lol then don't stalk me.

If you actually feel that way. ;\)

But I doubt it.

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#119847 - 08/20/19 04:26 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dimitri]
MaydayMayday Offline
Banned Troll (again)
stranger


Registered: 08/20/19
Posts: 11
 Originally Posted By: Dimitri
Even though you are banned now and probably won't read this...

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Everyone has a voice and the capability to voice an opinion.
That is anyones freedom.

You can ignore others and leave them to their value.
Asking others to not give attention to an opinion you do not like is misplaced entitlement.

As such it is more correct to remove those instead of the others.


im entitled to my opinion

I think that nobody should let that damn hoe xiaogui17 get up in their feelings

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#119859 - 08/20/19 12:25 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
And yet people have the ability and inherent freedom to act and move how they see fit.

If, for one, I decide to put you on "ignore" you have no say in that.

You still retain your value. And I retain a more qualitative experience by muting out the gibberish.

As for MayDayMayDay.
I am perfectly capable of judging people on their merit on my own terms. Thusfar she has shown much more of it than you have despite having points of disagreement with her.


Edited by Dimitri (08/20/19 12:28 PM)
_________________________
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#119866 - 08/21/19 10:46 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dimitri]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 740
There are unfortunately some black women who don't realize that so-called "generational curse structures have been inverted. When I'm discussing hopeful things with a family member we are investing in hope honesty and strength, and God rewards that.

A black man out front may be someone you think is there too intimidate me, but is actually respectful of my boldness, honesty and humanity, and is hoping secretly that the black women would look to me as an example and invest in reconciling with their men, or try to avoid that responsibility and hoping we fail, thus investing curse energy on themselves by avoiding being human and responsible for theiren and nurturing them instead of abandoning them and showing through their actions that they believe that they are hopeless.

Believe you deserve grace and love and work for it in your community, or believe you don't.

Either way, God will agree with you.

My self interest is only in speaking this truth out loud so that I'm not holding your salvation hostage by secrecy

My conscience is clean. And I hope for the best


Edited by samowens84 (08/21/19 10:47 AM)

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#119867 - 08/21/19 10:55 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dark Light 444 Offline
member


Registered: 08/02/17
Posts: 402
Praise Jesus. Sniff.
_________________________
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#119868 - 08/21/19 01:42 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
Yeah. You are an idiot.
And I am being most sincere here.

The entire premise of your argument hinges on "some".
As in "theoretical", as in "assumed".

You hold no truths or facts.
Merely opinion.
Only that.
Remember that.
Always.
_________________________
Ut vivat, crescat et floreat

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#119870 - 08/21/19 06:15 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: samowens84]
CanisMachina42 Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
While this a hell of a glass house for me to throw a stone in, you seem scattered and disturbed and appear to be making bizarre statements and deteriorating in lucidity. 

Remember, the pigeons only move when you shoot at the little girl...

 Quote:
A black man out front may be someone you think is there too intimidate me, but is actually respectful of my boldness, honesty and humanity, and is hoping secretly that the black women would look to me as an example and invest in reconciling with their men...


Lol. What are you from Minnesota?

It's like you look at black people like A Mutual of Omaha narrator.

Here we are now in Detroit. You'll notice how the males will congregate in the front of one the few remaining liquor wells on the block. Being firmly south of 10 mile road we are in the land that the world forgot. 

Look as white boy from Ann Arbor approaches to hydrate at the local well. He has strayed far outside his home territory.

This is the leader of this gang, notice the gold vestments and red markings indicates these are a subclassification of gansta called 'bloods'. He see's the blue of the hat and the moon reflecting of his melanin free skin. A confrontation approaches.

The Alpha male postures himself, notice how he puffs out his chest and looks down his nose at the invader.  The first warning cry, "youll notice the repetitious use of a single two syllable vocalization."

The white male freezes, he doesn't know what to do. Startled, he tries to respond in kind but fails to intimidate. He tries to understand the aggressor, but he is now confronted by others. He starts to stutter and attempts to diffuse the situation, this  response is common with ineffectual white males in hostile territory.

They approach.  He urinates on himself as an involuntary self defense act.  Ahhh, there it is, he is offering his iPhone 10, and all the money in his wallet if they don't hurt him.  The gang accepts, and also take his shoes or "kicks" as they are called by local language.

He should have fed in Deerborne.


Seriously though, what the fuck are you talking about?
_________________________
Spiritual : Abstraction ::

D. Scientific : Quod erat demonstrandum

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#121105 - 12/21/19 02:55 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Dimitri]
Fringe Wizard Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
Those who think the definition of a species are "they can't mate and produce viable (fertile) offspring" are wrong. Otherwise sheeps and goats are the same species, most Cichlids are supposedly one species, etc. with many cases of what are recognized as different species and sometimes even different genus being able to mate and produce offspring that are themselves fertile.

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheep%E2%80%93goat_hybrid

So those who say because blacks and whites can reproduce and the offspring of them can reproduce they are one species... you are wrong as concerns taxonomy.

To give an example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labidochromis

Probably every species in here can be crossed and produce fertile hybrids. This does not happen in nature but it does in the aquarium, an artificial environment.

When a previous poster mentioned the different human races were originally separate and the circumstances we are in now living beside one another is artificial, it makes me think of Cichlids kept together in an aquarium.

There is likely greater genetic distance between Africans and Europeans than many of what are recognized as separate species by taxonomy. I would also like to see how great the genetic distance is between the various archaic hominids and have that compared. Neanderthal etc.

However when digging up old human skeletons from millions of years ago there is no controversy so it seems every time it happens a new species is declared. With the various human races today there is a concerted effort to deny biological differences and to prevent any measures of racial conservation.

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#121106 - 12/21/19 05:27 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
XiaoGui17 Online
veteran member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
Those who think the definition of a species are "they can't mate and produce viable (fertile) offspring" are wrong.
If you meant, "They can mate and produce fertile offspring," then that is literally the definition of the term "species."

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
Otherwise sheeps and goats are the same species, most Cichlids are supposedly one species, etc. with many cases of what are recognized as different species and sometimes even different genus being able to mate and produce offspring that are themselves fertile.

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheep%E2%80%93goat_hybrid
Your own link said the overwhelming majority of sheep-goat hybrids aren't even born alive, much less becoming fertile as adults.

While there might be the occasional fluke in inter-species breeding, it's safe to say any two groups that can consistently produce fertile offspring are of the same species. No, sheep and goats do not meet that definition.

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
So those who say because blacks and whites can reproduce and the offspring of them can reproduce they are one species... you are wrong as concerns taxonomy.
Taxonomy didn't have any scientific basis when it was first developed. It was based on superficial appearance. Two different sexes of the same species might have been categorized as separate species for no other reason than sexual dimorphism combined with ignorance. Our understanding of what constitutes a "species" has become refined since we developed an understanding of genetics.

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
To give an example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labidochromis

Probably every species in here can be crossed and produce fertile hybrids. This does not happen in nature but it does in the aquarium, an artificial environment.

When a previous poster mentioned the different human races were originally separate and the circumstances we are in now living beside one another is artificial, it makes me think of Cichlids kept together in an aquarium.
So? What does artificial proximity have to do with the scientific definition of "species"?

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
However when digging up old human skeletons from millions of years ago there is no controversy so it seems every time it happens a new species is declared. With the various human races today there is a concerted effort to deny biological differences and to prevent any measures of racial conservation.
Since we have evidence that interbreeding between certain hominids eventually became impossible, yes.

Just as there was more of a time lapse between the stegosaurus and the T. rex than between the T. rex and man,


...so there's far more of a morphological and genetic gap between the old species of hominid fossils than there is between modern races of homo sapiens.

That's not to deny the biological and morphological differences between the living races of humans. But to say said races aren't the same species is to cling to an outdated and unscientific understanding of what a species entails.
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I am on nobody's side, because nobody is on my side

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#121107 - 12/21/19 08:29 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
CanisMachina42 Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
 Quote:
There is likely greater genetic distance between Africans and Europeans than many of what are recognized as separate species by taxonomy.


What, melanin? Knotty dreads?

There is such an insignificant difference it can be lost (or heavily diluted) in one generation.

I once asked google what the opposite of an albino was:



Melaninism was my answer. What started out as wanting to see the blackest person ever ended with learning about nigga squirrels.



But apart from from things that became recessive away from the desert belt and the sun there is not much difference. 

People in Ethiopia are really really black and people in Sweden are really really white.  But if you go into the arctic circle you transition to leathery Inuit characteristics which can be drawn back across the land bridge to Mongolia. Even the language sounds similar.



In fact the greatest points of genetic difference is the 2% Neaderthal DNA in Europeans and Asians and 6% Denisovan DNA in Polynesian/Melanesian. Africans are actually the purest Homo sapiens in that respect.

For fun the following make some funny genetically valid chimeras. Most are mix and match.

Horse - Donkey - Zebra

Elk - Moose - Deer - Reindeer - Antelope

Brown Bear - Black Bear - Grizzly Bear - Polar Bear (Most common wild land hybrids)

Whales - Dolphins - Porpoise - Narwhal

* A Narwhal/Whale hybrid naturally occurred

Lion - Tiger - Jaguar - Cheetah - Leopard - Mountain Lion - Ocelot - Bobcat - Lynx - *Domestic Cats

* = More likely to be eaten, but they can make hybrids.

Wolf - Coyote - Dingo - Jackals - Domestic Dog

Human - Chimpanzee (Not that anyone's tried it...)

And many many more I could spend a while listing.
_________________________
Spiritual : Abstraction ::

D. Scientific : Quod erat demonstrandum

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#121108 - 12/21/19 08:43 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: CanisMachina42]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 362
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
It seems contrary to nature that Africans would have turned soot black. Black absorbs more rays and heat instead of reflecting it, making a scorched habitat even more unbearable. I am white but what am I reflecting? The skies are often grey.
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#121109 - 12/21/19 10:35 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fringe Wizard Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
I'm not going to make this post more elaborate than it has to be to make my point.

The fact is, if your definition of a species is "they can not cross and produce fertile offspring" you have to eliminate a tremendous amount of different species now and this Earth should be regarded as having only a fraction of the number of species it is currently considered to have. Look in pretty much any genus and usually the different species listed under any given genus can be crossed and produce fertile offspring.

Even if your definition is adjusted to "they don't readily cross and produce fertile offspring" you still have to pretty much declare a ton of different species in each genus to be all one species because they often do in artificial environments or times of stress and habitat depletion end up crossbreeding.

I would also like to add that if you do regard the different human races as merely equivalent with a subspecies that biological conservation ethics dictates in every circumstance I've ever seen that efforts should be taken to prevent the accidental crossbreeding of subspecies. There have been cases of different subspecies of wolves mixing due to their habitats coming together and conservationists frown on it.

Consider this article: http://labs.russell.wisc.edu/peery/files/2011/12/29.-Hybridization-and-Genetic-Extinction.pdf

Note it talks about how hybridization has wiped out about 50% of Cichlid species (yes, I have studied these fish a lot, and applied the principles of nature to humans).

In short I have two points I want understood and acknowledged:

1. The definition of a species as "they can not [readily] cross and produce fertile offspring" eliminates most of the diversity of species on this planet. Suddenly we have far less species.
2. Regardless of whether we're speaking of a genus, a species, a subpsecies, or a breed; the push to mix these together is an attack on biological diversity and contrary to conservation ethics.

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#121110 - 12/22/19 01:41 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
CanisMachina42 Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/10/13
Posts: 1664
Loc: Ca
Race equivalent to subspecies is debatable.

When I think subspecies I think Bengal vs. Siberian Tiger, and just because they are different colors doesn't make it equivocal either.

For example how does one truly subdivide everything?

The amount of adaptive variation is too gradient and diverse to differentiate races from one another.

Like European White vs South American White? Italian Brown vs Mexican brown? They're both that way via different mechanisms. One from European colonialism or immigration during WWII.

Had they arrived at that color through the same mechanism. But some moved away from the sun to the North and went strait to white. Some went east through the desert/savannah belt (depending on earth's tilt) which made the change less abrupt. With asians it was through India and a trek through olive skin first.

The same gradient differences you see in language you see in race.

You would have as many subspecies as language dialects.

Thought Experiment:

What if a mad scientist took control of a country and had a full array of genetics to work with?

If he decided to make minis he would selectively breed proportional dwarves. If he wanted them ginger, he would favor redheaded dwarves.  Call 'em "Gingarves"

Suppose he wanted to race people. He could find long lanky barefoot Eritrean and breed them for speed, especially cheetah like bursts. "Eritrean Sprinters" They could be like greyhounds.

Those are just two, but the possibilities are endless.

If you wanted exotic features you could prefer syndactyly and a vestigial tail. You could even combine that with ocular albino traits in petite asians.

Webbed footed asians with pigmentless eyes and stubby tails, which could be selectively grown longer. What would you call them?
_________________________
Spiritual : Abstraction ::

D. Scientific : Quod erat demonstrandum

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#121111 - 12/22/19 11:47 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: CanisMachina42]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 362
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
Hybridization in the wild may be the ecology's last attempts at survival where successful. Human attempts at it buy time but for an artificial diversity.

Will we need to tap into the Svalbard doomsday vault sooner than expected?

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#121112 - 12/22/19 12:34 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: CanisMachina42]
Fringe Wizard Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
>The amount of adaptive variation is too gradient and diverse to differentiate races from one another.

There exist these gradients among non-human species and we readily differentiate them.

Also I agree with the language dialects. In Europe there are 81 recognized ethnic groups and in Africa there's thousands. I believe we can consider these all different subspecies. I also think the idea that we're a planet of hundreds or thousands of different human species is a better way to view the world than to pretend there is only one variety of human. Forget about traveling to distant stars to find other sentient life; Earth is full of it already.

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#121113 - 12/22/19 12:44 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
XiaoGui17 Online
veteran member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
I would also like to add that if you do regard the different human races as merely equivalent with a subspecies...


 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
In short I have two points I want understood and acknowledged:
1. The definition of a species as "they can not [readily] cross and produce fertile offspring" eliminates most of the diversity of species on this planet. Suddenly we have far less species.
2. Regardless of whether we're speaking of a genus, a species, a subpsecies, or a breed; the push to mix these together is an attack on biological diversity and contrary to conservation ethics.
I understand the points you're trying to make. I just think they're both dumb.

1. "If X were the case, it would change our understanding of science" does not prove X false. The whole point of the scientific method is that our understanding of science changes in light of new data.

2. Species and subspecies have been going extinct since time immemorial. It's a relatively recent phenomenon that humans started wringing their hands over what's a perfectly natural process.

The planet only has the capacity to sustain so many critters. If every subspecies that ever lived were preserved, it'd quickly exceed that capacity and someone would have to go.

We can't preserve everything and it's folly to try.
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I am on nobody's side, because nobody is on my side

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#121114 - 12/22/19 12:49 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: aeon6]
Fringe Wizard Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
 Originally Posted By: aeon6
Hybridization in the wild may be the ecology's last attempts at survival where successful. Human attempts at it buy time but for an artificial diversity.

Will we need to tap into the Svalbard doomsday vault sooner than expected?


This part is very moving and a testament to the need for biological conservation:

You donít need to look far to discover the sacrifices made to keep these kernels of reproduction safe. One of the most historically significant deposits of seeds inside the vault comes from a collection in St. Petersburgís Vavilov Research Institute, which originates from one of the first collections in the world. During the siege of Leningrad, about a dozen scientists barricaded themselves in the room containing the seeds in order to protect them from hungry citizens and the surrounding German army.

As the siege dragged on, a number of them eventually died from starvation. Despite being surrounded by seeds and plant material, they steadfastly refused to save themselves by eating any of it, such was their conviction about the importance of the seeds to aid Russiaís recovery after war and to help protect the future of humankind. One of the scientists, Dmitri Ivanov, is said to have died surrounded by bags of rice.

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#121115 - 12/22/19 12:52 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fringe Wizard Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
 Originally Posted By: XiaoGui17
2. Species and subspecies have been going extinct since time immemorial. It's a relatively recent phenomenon that humans started wringing their hands over what's a perfectly natural process.

The planet only has the capacity to sustain so many critters. If every subspecies that ever lived were preserved, it'd quickly exceed that capacity and someone would have to go.

We can't preserve everything and it's folly to try.


So you think seed banks and all the various conservation efforts of plants and animals are worthless? Extinction happens naturally but the rate of extinction is considered to be much higher than the background rate right now. That should be cause for concern.

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#121116 - 12/22/19 02:55 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 362
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
A rice-laden funeral sounds hilarious, but I'm sure he would appreciate the humor since he stood his justified ground. It speaks to early ferocity on the topic but could now be linked to Svalbard and ELF (Earth Liberation Front) when it comes to militant preservation.

Right about now, Africa and Asia should be tilting the Earth's axis more. Compounding that is the impending magnetosphere flip which will leave many moaning for their phone which is glued to their face. This has everything to do with extinction.

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#121117 - 12/22/19 05:53 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
So you think seed banks and all the various conservation efforts of plants and animals are worthless? Extinction happens naturally but the rate of extinction is considered to be much higher than the background rate right now. That should be cause for concern.
You're conflating two separate issues.

The survival of life-on-earth-in-general, or humanity-in-general, is one matter.

The preservation of each-and-every race or subspecies is quite another.

You're resorting to the motte and bailey doctrine. Your bailey, your ideal position, is essentially racialism. There are many arguments you could make for that position, but you've chosen an ecological one.

Yet when you're attacked, you retreat to the motte of "ecological preservation in general."

You're no different from the feminist who wants to argue for asinine concepts like the pink tax, or the wage gap, or banning "manspreading" and other "microaggressions" (the bailey), but when criticized insists that she's only arguing for women to have equal rights to men (the motte).

Conflating your strongest position with your toughest sell isn't making the case for the tough sell. It's showing that you're either too dumb to see the vast chasm between point A and point B, in which case it's a waste of time to argue with someone so dense, or you're playing dumb and hoping others won't notice that you've conflated two very different positions, in which case it's a waste of time to argue with someone so intellectually dishonest.
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#121118 - 12/23/19 12:03 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fringe Wizard Offline
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Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
I've wrote like three replies and now just wiped each one out.

I don't know what to say to you XiaoGuy17.

What is your point?

Is not the preservation of each-and-every race or subspecies an aid to the survival of life in general and humanity in general or do you see some conflict of interests here?

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#121121 - 12/23/19 05:20 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
aeon6 Offline
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It's helpful to expect that the pathology of civilisation allows plenty of room for naysayers. You see, they unwittingly perpetuate the self-fulfilling "prophecy". Like the manifest destiny that the U.S. had in assimilating a continent. Now they are ironically first in line for tipping the Earth's axis yet farther.

Earth is what we make of it... it forms and reforms. All of humanity may be a specialised tissue, a disperse cycloptic organ through which it narcissistically checks itself out in the depths of space. Remember that naysayers have bleak futility to cope with, and therefore are at the mercy of their own allegiances.

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#121122 - 12/23/19 07:14 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
Is not the preservation of each-and-every race or subspecies an aid to the survival of life in general and humanity in general...
No, it isn't.

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
...or do you see some conflict of interests here?
Yes, I do.

I've already answered your question, but since you ask, I'll repeat myself.
 Originally Posted By: XiaoGui17
The planet only has the capacity to sustain so many critters. If every subspecies that ever lived were preserved, it'd quickly exceed that capacity and someone would have to go.

We can't preserve everything and it's folly to try.
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#121123 - 12/23/19 07:35 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
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It might help your case if you weren't from the capitol of executions and largesse as big as your lone star state. No wonder the vitriol.
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#121124 - 12/23/19 08:35 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: aeon6]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
How does being from Texas relate to what I've said about the earth's carrying capacity?
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#121125 - 12/23/19 08:53 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
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If you need me to confirm the obvious, you belong there among daft compatriots.
Suppose Texas were much more progressive than it now is, a folly to entertain. Would you reconsider the realm to which you've become accustomed? Or maybe you are fond of the brutality.

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#121126 - 12/24/19 07:31 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: aeon6]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
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Loc: Austin, TX
The earth's carrying capacity is a concrete fact. Facts don't care about feelings, and certainly don't change based on what I am fond of or accustomed to.

If you have any evidence that the earth's carrying capacity is such that every subspecies could be indefinitely sustained, by all means share it. Resorting to ad hominem attacks just indicates you haven't got any facts to back up what you're saying.

I'm almost reluctant to disavow you of your rather cartoonish concept of Texas. "The brutality"? You make me sound like such a badass, toughing it in the harsh, cutthroat wilderness. What a letdown it'd be if you saw Texas for what it is.

Were I a stereotypical Texan, I'd be a hardcore Jesus freak. Yet here I am. Clearly, there's something aberrant about me as a "Texan."

But it's easier to write me off as some backwoods hick than it is to address what I've said, so I suppose enjoy taking the easy road and burying your head in the sand.
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#121127 - 12/24/19 10:24 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: aeon6]
Kori Houghton Offline
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Registered: 11/23/15
Posts: 206
Loc: East Coast USA
 Originally Posted By: aeon6
It might help your case if you weren't from the capitol of executions and largesse as big as your lone star state. No wonder the vitriol.


Are you saying that a statement of scientific fact is more or less correct based on the geographic location of the individual making the statement? It's not annoying enough to deal with identity politics, so you are invoking identity science?
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#121128 - 12/24/19 12:50 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Kori Houghton]
aeon6 Offline
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Scientific facts are universal to location, but take into account that the person interpreting them is naturally a product of given environment with unique filters. Mine happen to be more humanitarian than the militarised nihilism being exported. Annoying identity science has become necessary to distinguish friend from foe, on a grander scale than I suspect you are imagining.
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#121129 - 12/24/19 03:17 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
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Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
Face it: nothing I say will satisfy your nationalistic belligerence, especiallly from that corner. You conveniently gloss over capital punishment. I find that very telling.
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#121130 - 12/25/19 01:07 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fringe Wizard Offline
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Registered: 12/21/19
Posts: 7
"We can't sustain every subspecies so we shouldn't even try to preserve any of them at all."

What a non-argument.

Here's a concrete fact for you: Every species and subspecies that currently exists on Earth right now is by definition being sustained by the Earth's carrying capacity.

Also the carrying capacity is not a fixed quantity. If we modify the soil in some regions to make it more productive (something that has been done over large areas in the US), the carrying capacity increases. As biological diversity increases in a region also, the overall carrying capacity typically increases. If we turn more areas into monocultures for agricultural crops or pave over them, carrying capacity decreases. If we create artificial environments with grow lights and other technology used, we might be able to increase carrying capacity in a region. If we poison large areas of land like in China, we'll decrease carrying capacity.

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#121133 - 12/26/19 01:36 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: aeon6]
XiaoGui17 Online
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Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1417
Loc: Austin, TX
 Originally Posted By: aeon6
You conveniently gloss over capital punishment. I find that very telling.
Yes, I happen to live in a state known for capital punishment.

So?

I don't support capital punishment (for reasons of both principle and practicality), but no one ever asked me what the state's policy should be.

 Originally Posted By: aeon6
Face it: nothing I say will satisfy your nationalistic belligerence, especiallly from that corner.
What a convenient excuse to say nothing.

If you'd made every argument to be made and I hadn't budged without any decent reason to reject your arguments, you'd be within your rights to write me off as a mule-headed waste of time. But not making a single argument because you preemptively predict that I won't consider them is putting the cart before the horse.

"I have a winning hand, but you wouldn't concede that I'd won even if I laid it down, so I'm not going to lay my hand down" is a transparent bluff.

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
"We can't sustain every subspecies so we shouldn't even try to preserve any of them at all."

What a non-argument.
What a strawman. Literally no one ever said anything remotely along those lines.

 Originally Posted By: Fringe Wizard
Here's a concrete fact for you: Every species and subspecies that currently exists on Earth right now is by definition being sustained by the Earth's carrying capacity.

Also the carrying capacity is not a fixed quantity. If we modify the soil in some regions to make it more productive (something that has been done over large areas in the US), the carrying capacity increases. As biological diversity increases in a region also, the overall carrying capacity typically increases. If we turn more areas into monocultures for agricultural crops or pave over them, carrying capacity decreases. If we create artificial environments with grow lights and other technology used, we might be able to increase carrying capacity in a region. If we poison large areas of land like in China, we'll decrease carrying capacity.
I appreciate that someone is finally making an actual argument.

Yes, technically every creature alive now is managing to eke out an existence for the time being. But because we can reach a certain peak does not mean that peak can be sustained indefinitely over a prolonged period.

Additionally, merely surviving is not thriving, and quality of life for those that do live matters as well. Would you rather have eight children scrape by or three children prosper?

ETA: Yes, we can adjust a habitat's carrying capacity somewhat. But it would be unwise to bank on a nebulous possibility.


Edited by XiaoGui17 (12/26/19 01:40 PM)
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#121146 - 12/28/19 10:47 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: XiaoGui17]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 362
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
Please forgive the insolence, I get you now and have put it to rest.
The cart before the mule is apropos.

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#121214 - 01/09/20 05:05 AM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
Dimitri Offline
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Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3410
Taxonomy is a frickle thing.
Classification (and the various systems behind it) is a hot topic in biology and ecology.

Sex is not a necessary prerequisite (and is even a bad factor) to differentiate between species and sub-species.

There are (sub-)species who cannot intermingle even though they are classified as "equal" (monotypic vs polytypic).
Rationality would imply further discernment based on "Race".

Humans are Polytypic as the different races can intermingle and produce (fertile) offspring.



The studies you speak of are generally kept behind closed doors. Too much political sensitivity and stupidity from the general public trying to invalidate or ignore hard facts.
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#121567 - 02/09/20 07:03 PM Re: Internalized racism of white women [Re: Fringe Wizard]
fiendish Offline
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Registered: 02/27/16
Posts: 654
Are you serious? The profit-seekers provide where there is more profit, not where there's need. Production of food is number one , making more money is what most people care, mostly due to having a good-paying job in a large corporation, or to a smaller company that exists through the large company.

Nobody cares. About earth's carrying capacity.
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