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#120341 - 09/28/19 12:52 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: XiaoGui17]
samowens84 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 667
I think a narcissist with a God complex can be just as toxic as someone who to their eyes "lacks empathy."

The narcissist only mirrors, and often gets wrong, what other people's expectations are, because other people's expectations are often centered around a quality that is necessary for empathy, and that's integrity.

Glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

What kind of response were you hoping for?

It feels like you're looking for someone to challenge you in some way?

I mean, it's kinda fun to spar a few rounds, but... don't you think this is kinda childish?

Haven't we outgrown this?

It feels cathartic in one way, and from my point of view poking me to get my attention seems to be wasting valuable time you could spend adulting.

So what gives?

I mean, even my above jab feels more relevant to you three years ago. I doubt you should even be hurt by it.

So if you want lay down on the couch and tell me what's really bothering you. ;\)


Edited by samowens84 (09/28/19 12:54 PM)

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#120345 - 09/29/19 10:36 AM Re: National Socialism [Re: XiaoGui17]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3389
I agree there.

Each country has their own systems and economy in place.
What works in one country does not necessarily work in another due to economic structural and historic reasons.

"Imitation is the highest form of flattery".
Doesn't say anything about shooting in the own feet when doing so.
Just the original getting some respectable credit.

Many liberals "see" and want the advantages.
Generally being blind to the costs and fees in order to achieve that. The mentioned example of education carries the hindsight of lowering studentloans on short term but increasing the interests on these loans in order to create sufficient cashflow in order to make the thing work.
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#120371 - 10/02/19 03:23 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: Dimitri]
aeon6 Offline
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Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 287
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
What I take relatively for granted, you may consider utopian in ambition and attainability. So I'd never flatter you with even pale imitation. The economic, structural and historic reasons you mention for places are vast yet brief (paleolithically) but despite that are forces to contend with. To address education there directly, it's truly becoming the meatgrinder of the world: you love to violate your own kind...right down to the medications and services that save your lives.


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#120374 - 10/02/19 04:30 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: aeon6]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 667
 Originally Posted By: aeon6
What I take relatively for granted, you may consider utopian in ambition and attainability. So I'd never flatter you with even pale imitation. The economic, structural and historic reasons you mention for places are vast yet brief (paleolithically) but despite that are forces to contend with. To address education there directly, it's truly becoming the meatgrinder of the world: you love to violate your own kind.



Just like any other impulse.

Things can take many different manifestations depending on the context.

An addiction is just the shame that can come from a momentary act of weakness.

It's a moment where there's a potential danger of human authentic fulfillment that comes from love, kindness and compassion, and the compulsive act that false guilt can create out of shame.

Trying to make the shame acceptable by assuming that emotion has anything to do with the act that inspired the shame is what had the potential to make the act cyclical.

That shame has nothing to do with the act. Once I understood that I learned how to instantly escape a potentially dangerous cycle.

Because any effort to try and make it about someone forgiving me or finding an objective reason for the action in objective terms is a distraction from the shame mechanism inside me that wants fulfillment as a human being but found that difficult when I didn't understand the shame principle.

The illusion was that I thought I needed society to forgive me to escape shame. And the illusion can be compoumded by bad karma, and the bad karma fed the illusion that I needed the permission of society to exist.

Underneath that though, I discovered a secret.

Underneath the dirt and disapproving eyes and personal shame, my soul did dissociate because of the shame complex, but I was able to breath for a while. And beneath that I was able to be ignored as not being a "threat" because society thought I was comfortably "trapped" in karma and illusions. But not at that moment, and not now either.

I found other souls who had just as pure loving hearts under dirt that dissociation nurtured purity and love.

And I was witness to the most incredible epiphany.

I'm not alone.

And I found I was the only one in my way.

I found a collection of beautiful loving people underneath dirt who understand the impulse of it, and knew we had the power because we alone had the wisdom to understand the nature of dirt and love.

And don't require the approval of those lost in their ignorance.

Because love, God, and empathy and grace and discernment evaperates illusions, and purposes understands that wounds and communal responsibility may divide us, but they also provide clarity and discernment so that love and grace shows that hatred and illusions don't exist.

And that those who try to make it about something outside of ourselves instead of the genuine shame mechanism that it is has a connundrum.

We own our shit, which means we've escaped it through wisdom.

If you believe that any of us likes violating our own people, rather than just playing devil's advocate to bring the truth out, then you would be in danger of feeding the cycle I'm describing.

Not admitting to your own addictive tendencies so as to escape them.

That's the difference between people pleasing and karmic cleansing.

Karmic cleansing feeds my humanity and breaks the shame cycle.

People pleasing, by contrast, feeds the illusion that shame and karma has anything to do with pleasing the people I hurt, instead of doing the right thing that nurtures my humanity.

I've done cleansing and sometimes found the illusionist on the other side to sometimes just be a huckster, but the universe only allowed that equalizing knowledge once I purged myself from dirt and shame by nurturing my humanity.



Once that work was done, the equalizing information of perverted motives on the other end of that karma set me free.

Sometimes though I've also found a lot more grateful loving people than the so called CoS would have me believe.

Dirt clogged loving souls grateful for release from shame cycles were more common than ignorance.

Which challenges many ideological assumptions made by CoS.

Karma cleansing and self human affirmation is a freedom only I am able to give myself that replaced the shame cycle that made a people pleasing person eternal prey.

In that space is the eternal protection of love.


Edited by samowens84 (10/02/19 04:38 PM)

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#120375 - 10/02/19 04:40 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: samowens84]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 287
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
You speak so much of shame, it's a shame you don't live in 200 years earlier puritan era.
But wait, there are legions of you here and now. What is your theory on that?
You can mix sex and NS if you traverse the synapse.

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#120376 - 10/02/19 04:52 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: aeon6]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 667
This reminds me of a book my dad gave me called "How to beat your dad at chess."

I read some of the book and played my Uncle.



It was a simple checkmate with a bishop and a knight.

He underestimated me and just kept playing.

And in that game I beat him.

He was shocked. He was like "I thought I had them comfortably trapped back there."

And another moment I beat him when he was one move away from beating me and he threw a fake tantrum.

Some Jungian shit. Ha.

I wonder who was the priest and who was the knight?


Edited by samowens84 (10/02/19 05:04 PM)

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#120377 - 10/02/19 04:56 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: samowens84]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 287
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
What I said about NS was honest, but far be it from me to push it down your prude throat.
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#120382 - 10/03/19 01:48 AM Re: National Socialism [Re: samowens84]
Czereda Offline
senior member


Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 2118
Loc: Poland
Pray tell me what anything you've written so far has to do with the topic at hand? Did Aeon6 write anything about shame? Your associations and reactions to specific posts are really peculiar. Everything you write here reeks of insecurity and emotional problems you haven't yet worked through. Go visit a therapist. Seriously. She will be more interested in your compulsive and self-absorbed rants than random forum users.

Edited by Czereda (10/03/19 01:56 AM)
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#120391 - 10/04/19 11:23 AM Re: National Socialism [Re: aeon6]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3389
Standards and all.

Globalization only goes that far.
Imitation is the art of copy and paste.
Implementation is restructuring to achieve a common goal.

The first is dumbfounded.
The latter the knowledgeable one.
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#120568 - 10/23/19 03:28 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: Rob Taylor]
Wotanson Offline
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Registered: 10/23/19
Posts: 3
I think the idea of strength and the very early goals of the SS are noble. I however think that Socialism of any strain to be rather restricting on individuality especially in the totalitarian vein that NS came out of. It was very puritanical in it's legislation and banned many Occult schools so while the Aesthetic of the NSDAP is "cool" I can't really understand why one on the Left Hand Path would gravitate towards the ideology other than some of the more Occult leanings and the aesthetics itself.

I won't go as far as saying Mein Kampf is unreadable I rather enjoyed it.


Edited by Wotanson (10/23/19 03:29 PM)

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#120586 - 10/24/19 01:45 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: Wotanson]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 287
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
Marxism itself and NS can be mutually exclusive under ideal conditions. To extricate the first from the latter's extremes or from thin air, in order to avoid Stalin or Mao murderous pogroms executed in the name of socialist future. If there is to be justice in the future, there must have been injustice in the past- or so a fatalist would have you believe.

There is a difference between doing evil in the hope that good may come of it, and seeking to turn someone else's evil to good use. Socialists did not perpetrate capitalism and are innocent of its crimes, but since it exists it seems rational to make the best of it. All while understanding that the system breeds freedom as well as barbarism, emancipation along with enslavement.

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#120597 - 10/25/19 08:32 AM Re: National Socialism [Re: aeon6]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 667
 Originally Posted By: aeon6
Marxism itself and NS can be mutually exclusive under ideal conditions. To extricate the first from the latter's extremes or from thin air, in order to avoid Stalin or Mao murderous pogroms executed in the name of socialist future. If there is to be justice in the future, there must have been injustice in the past- or so a fatalist would have you believe.

There is a difference between doing evil in the hope that good may come of it, and seeking to turn someone else's evil to good use. Socialists did not perpetrate capitalism and are innocent of its crimes, but since it exists it seems rational to make the best of it. All while understanding that the system breeds freedom as well as barbarism, emancipation along with enslavement.


Lotta squirming in there.

Everyone had a crime before them.

And everyone can be labeled "guilty."

You either can own your actions and let the results speak for themselves, or some may attempt to try and seem less heinous by attempting to point out the crimes of others to compensate for a weak vision.

One should not start pleading their case until the results can speak for themselves.

If they can't, then it's best to just do, and wait till they can.

Or if it's a past failure one's compensating for, then accept that failure and understand that a philosophy doesn't matter as much as the results.

The artist doesn't matter as much as the creation.

Feelings of intellectual or artistic inadequacy isn't the responsibility of others.

People want to live simply. To love their families, and provide a better future and not concern themselves with crimes of the past.

Everyone has some dirt in their past, but the strong don't look for someone with the cleanest past, but with the best chance at a clean future.

Where they're loved ones are safe and have a bright future.

Arguing for who's got more blood on their hands or who deserved more blame is someone arguing for an inferior future.

That's transparent weakness.

Looking for the "bright side of defeat" isn't strong.

On the other hand, accepting a personal darkness isn't the same as defeat. It's admitting you have more work to do.

Not accepting personal darkness is a defeat.

And that's a choice.

With still no one to blame but oneself.


This is a choice some have.

To either A: Beg others to drown themselves so you don't have too, or B: Accept your personal moment under water and swim to the other side.

For someone who understands themselves well, will understand option B is the only option.

Weakness and strength isn't about having the courage to do what's right, but having the mental strength to see the options clearly and being able to accept that the "hardest" option is actually the easiest one available and being able to make the decision and take action.

The alternative is to look around for someone to convince you why you don't have too.



Edited by samowens84 (10/25/19 08:41 AM)

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#120605 - 10/25/19 05:11 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: Wotanson]
Kori Houghton Offline
member


Registered: 11/23/15
Posts: 183
Loc: East Coast USA
 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
I think the idea of strength and the very early goals of the SS are noble.


What is "noble" about bogus racial science? Trying to create a fantasy world according to some aesthetic works as entertainment, but that's not a good model for structuring society.

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
I however think that Socialism of any strain to be rather restricting on individuality especially in the totalitarian vein that NS came out of.


The NSDAP only came to power with the help of wealthy business owners (who weren't socialists). The basis of German Nationalism was always restricting individuals and cultural elements that the various nationalist groups didn't like. It was the typical bully point-of-view that you yourself will be happier when you have the power to restrict liberty of people whose pursuit of happiness heads in a different direction from yours.

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
It was very puritanical in it's legislation...


To be expected for a social standard derived from the Old Testament, by way of Protestant Fundamentalism.

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
... and banned many Occult schools...


This is surprising?

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
so while the Aesthetic of the NSDAP is "cool"...


Do you mean the stuff that was part of the Art Moderne movement happening at the time, or the bad boy Clockwork Brown Shirt dress code? Not to say that NS Germany didn't have some great designers. Allach made some fab Art Deco dinnerware I saw in an online image from one of their print catalogs.

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
...I can't really understand why one on the Left Hand Path would gravitate towards the ideology other than some of the more Occult leanings and the aesthetics itself.


If by LHP you mean the traditions of several East Asian cultures, I doubt that there was (or is) any attraction. If you refer to the so-called "Western Left Hand Path", that's a late 20th Century construct, with about as much substance as the Merry Marvel Marching Society of about the same age. You may not be aware, but people have been discussing the attraction of Hitler and his gang for the "Western LHP" online for over 30 years now! Which pre-dates access to the internet.

 Originally Posted By: Wotanson
I won't go as far as saying Mein Kampf is unreadable I rather enjoyed it.


No, not unreadable. My dad read it for a high school research paper on totalitarianism in the late 1930s, along with the Communist Manifesto. Dunno, but you might get suspended from public school these days for even admitting to having touched the book, much less read any of it.
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#120606 - 10/25/19 06:43 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: Kori Houghton]
samowens84 Offline
active member


Registered: 09/29/16
Posts: 667
Cross racial relations are often sentimental naive self-destructive relationships when children are typically the victims.

Races aren't just skin color. Even in terms of materialistic concerns, it's different family dynamics, different social concerns, and if in some cases when one race were more well off than another, just a war stratagem. When the motherhood of another race might have been targeted for unfeeling vengeful purposes.

I'll mention white/black racial relations because I've seen both sides.

When some black men talked about the black female womb having been exploited by my ancestors, and then watching some white women almost having died or having nearly betrayed their family while having had offspring from black men, had found themselves thrown under the bus when it came for a black man to choose between the mother of their child and years of cultural resentment.

I've had black men point blank tell me that splitting the father from the daughter was just a cynical war strategy, and nothing more.

Others had told me that because of what they thought was success of this kind of strategy, that love was simply a weakness, and nothing more.

This demeaned love and motherhood of both communities, while robbing black motherhood of faith in their responsibilities.

Having children by these unions makes for a hard life for them who may not know who to love when both families might conceivably if not hate each other, were at least at war.

And it worked the other way too. Black women had mentioned to me in private that they preffered white men because, in their words, were more "considerate" and acted more like a "gentleman" than the black men in their communities.

It may or may not seem harmless, but that's black women who gave up on their men and decided to jump ship and gave up trying to nurture good men.

These were things that concerned and still concern both black and white folks in terms of potentially destructive influences that cross ratial relations can nurture when both communities were still damaged and suspicious of each other.

It also invited other racial groups that came to try and exploit those differences in divide and conquer strategies.

As one black man once said, the only thing he felt changed were the clothes.

If one defines "National Socialism" as respecting and avoiding poisonous dynamics that hurt both communities, then the only point made in the above response, though it may appeal to some former popular opinions, didn't even address the legitimate concerns.

The above post is mainly a red herring that brings up abuses that implied that there was no solution, but that isn't the case.

More people agree that some racial separation is healthy, even if it goes against an ideology of doing whatever.

There's a head in the sand attitude that advocates those kind of relations that ignore painful hostilities that make such unions irresponsible.

It's one thing to address racial sensitivities with respect that helps to solve problems and compassionate understanding, and another to avoid the issue and rationalize toxic behavior.

I've seen a lot of progress on this issue also, where those who had this kind of pain owning it and taking responsibility and limiting the damage done by focusing on healing our own immediate families. And I've seen a lot of healthy healing and dialogue and the world seems better for it.

Good things happen when people care more about a better future and taking responsibility for healing pain from the past. And optimistically I've seen this have positive healing results.

And so to go against the grain of what may have been said, people seem to have taken the insights of national socialism in a way that created positive results.


Edited by samowens84 (10/25/19 06:49 PM)

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#120611 - 10/25/19 09:27 PM Re: National Socialism [Re: samowens84]
aeon6 Offline
member


Registered: 04/16/18
Posts: 287
Loc: KÝbenhavn, Denmark
You're neglecting your offspring by being here.
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