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#12095 - 10/01/08 12:13 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: Nemesis]
Fist Moderator Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 1453
Loc: B'mo Cautious MF
All good points!

I think in the past we have been too quick ban users and lock threads of this type.

I am also curious as to how Lux came upon our little group here. Perhaps Xear could ping his IP address. I have my suspicions that he is not in the UK and may be another 352 type deiest doing a sociology experiment.

A good friend of mine growing up worked for the Catholic Church. I was married Catholic and both my kids were baptised in The Church. My son also goes to Catholic School. You might say I know quite a bit about The Church. As a student of the comparative religion, I find Lux to be rather ignorant of the Catholic catechism.
_________________________
I am the Devil and I am here to do the Devil's work.

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#12097 - 10/01/08 12:49 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
Fist Moderator Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 1453
Loc: B'mo Cautious MF
Sorry to pile on, but I am waiting at the airport and I have some time to kill. So, I wanted to clear up a few things.

 Quote:
I think either you or I have our wires crossed, I always believed the “Morning star” refered to Jesus.


Trust me, it's you. Have faith my son.

As is everything in Christianity, Xtians simply co-opt pagan traditions to suit their own purposes. Venus was a Roman goddess long before anyone thought of calling Jesus the morning star. In Roman poetry the planetary body is also referred to metaphorically as Lucifer - bringer of light - The Morning Star.

If you retarded ass had been paying attention in Latin class you would know that 'lux' is the root for 'bright' or 'shining.' Thus, luxuria is 'shiny thing.' Lux lucis is a clearly lit condition. Lumen is lamp/light/a condition sans darkness, or it can mean understanding. Lucifer is one who produces light, brings light, or gives understanding/clarity. Get it?

In other news, even the Xmas shopping festival is a rip off of of several Roman and other pagan holidays that celebrated the end of the winter solstice. In fact, The Church does not have one holiday that does not mirror an ancient pagan holiday.
_________________________
I am the Devil and I am here to do the Devil's work.

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#12099 - 10/01/08 02:32 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: Fist]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1646
Loc: Orlando, FL
"Lucifer" is just a title, not a proper noun... it can mean anything from Satan to Venus to Jesus to the Morning Star or what have you.

So it does not EXCLUSIVELY mean one single thing, just as the Pentagram has multiple meanings in different contexts. Both Jesus and Satan can accurately be called Lucifer because it is a title identified with both of them.

However, due to the popularity of the medieval legend of the "rebellion in heaven" and whatnot, Lucifer is PRIMARILY identified with Satan in modern western culture.

Just wanted to clear that up....
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«Recibe, ¡oh Lucifer! la sangre de esta víctima que sacrifico en tu honor.»

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#12100 - 10/01/08 02:58 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: The Zebu]
lux Offline
Banned
pledge


Registered: 09/26/08
Posts: 64
Loc: Newcastle UK
“Paganism does not equate to Satanism, for it is it's own religion. Atheism and Humanism are not religions, but they certainly aren't Satanism.”

Your mixing up your definition of Satanism, with mine there is no absolute truth regarding what Satanism is, is there?

I Refer to idiologys that I regard as “Satan’s promotion tools” those things that have elements of Satanism in it.

“Perhaps it is not that we don't WANT to believe in God, but that some of us are physically UNABLE to believe in God.”

Do you want to believe in God?

“I still find the idea of the supernatural to go against all of my ideas of logic and reason”

Your asking yourself “does God exist” instead of asking yourself, how does it benefit mankind, (not me personally) if God exists?


“Politically, I define myself as an anarchist. I don't see anarchy as Tyranny”

Tyranny is the logical conclusion of Anarchy, you must of heard the term “order out of chaos”

“What would then happen to the Satanists Community in such a situation? They would live in peace with pacific people (the Xians for instance). They don't take the initiative of hurting others. But if some evil guys would come steal or harm the community, then there'll be vengeance. I think he'll think twice coming again anoying us. I suppose he'll find the Xians better candidates for being their victims.”

Such a shame you did not believe in the Christian philosophy for the world even if not for yourself.

“But think about the weaks who take on their shoulders a responsability, a commitment they'll not be able to respect”

Confession, Forgivness, Mercy

Christianity protects the weak from the strong, Christianity builds weak people up, makes them believe in themselves through hope in God. Have you seen the pro life movement in the united states, it has made such massive in roads that an issue once rarely discussed is on almost everyone’s lips from people on welfare right upto the senate, congress and the president. Being pro life or pro choice can decide your political future. Little ordinary people, an organisation I was involved with “the helpers of Gods precious infants” started in New York with a washed up old priest and five old grandmothers, praying outside an abortion clinic, there organisation has gone around the world, from New York to Newcastle UK From America to Africa… simple, weak people, who believe in the power of God and that the power of God is working through them and even if you don’t believe in a god or gods, you can see the power of God or at least the power of the concept of God working in them. Your religion takes you away from God and reduces you to nothing more than an animal, our religion raises you up to a supernatural being.

You believe in your own strength, you set yourself up as your own god, you’re an individual…We believe in a God who Is not mortal, we believe in his strength, it is what unites us… divided we fall, together we stand.

“Yes we do what we want, but not in the "barbarian" sense you imagine.”

Maybe not you, maybe not these on the board, but what of those with real power, real wealth, what about traditional Satanists who believe in human sacrifice etc or just mad men? Satanism or satanic philosophy will enable these “Demons” to be released from their prison that is the Christian moral standard.

“You said Jesus was God, not the son of God”

Jesus is the son of God, Jesus is God.

For someone who was a “true” Christian you don’t seem to have the basic knowledge of the holy trinity.

“I personally don't find it rational to believe in the supernatural”

Because your looking at it the wrong way, if a man hears the fun fair is in town, does he simply stay in the house saying, its lies, all lies, I see no concrete proof, I find no rational to believe the fun fair is in town, its not logical for me to believe it is in town, therefore I am going to reject the whole thing out of hand. Or does he say to himself there might be and head off down the road, he will not know for sure if it is really there until he reaches his journeys end, but he has faith that it is there otherwise he would not have left his house.

“Good golly and gee wiz, wouldn't it be nice to believe in Xtian fairy tales”

Do you want to believe in God?

“But yet you are arguing as if it is fact”

Because I believe in it, I believe it is the right way, I believe it is good for humanity, I believe it is good for the weak, the marginalised, the oppressed, I believe in it, and I hope for an eternal life.

1 Corinthians 15

If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are to be pitied more than all men

St Paul understood the Power of God. The power of belief in something higher than ourselves.

If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching (philosophy) is useless and so is your faith (in that philosophy).

For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile (you can not be raised to anything higher than the natural self) you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost(those who have died for their faith have died for nothing). If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are to be pitied more than all men.

Man needs God, Men need God

“So you are saying that we should all do what the weakest of us want?”

No I am saying that the weak should be protected from the strong.

“However in answer to your question, it's not that I don't WANT to beleive in God, it's that I don't NEED to beleive in God”

And what if other people needed you to believe in God?

“I am also curious as to how Lux came upon our little group here”

I typed into google… Satanic forum


You all seem to forget that Christianity is a religion of the heart not so much the head


Edited by lux (10/01/08 03:09 PM)

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#12101 - 10/01/08 03:36 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: blackdragon31560]
blackdragon31560 Offline
pledge


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 74
Loc: Hell Paso, TX
 Originally Posted By: blackdragon31560
i read this thread last night, and couldn't help wounder why people are arguing with lux. It's a waste of time, using logic against someone that doesn't believe in it or use it (aka faith)........

............

trying to argue or explain this to Lux, is like talking to a wall.


Just like i was saying, yeah bible thumping

 Quote:

You all seem to forget that Christianity is a religion of the heart not so much the head


i would have thought a Mod or admin would have locked this thread, this is kind of like watching a dog chase its tail, fun but point less.

 Quote:
Christianity protects the weak from the strong, Christianity builds weak people up, makes them believe in themselves through hope in God.


Rrright, just like the jews in WWII, when pope turned them away. They might as well have walked them in to the concentration camps, just to make sure they got there safely.

as for the pro-life movement, it doesn't seem so pro-life in the US:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion-related_violence


Edited by blackdragon31560 (10/01/08 03:42 PM)
Edit Reason: spelling and rewording
_________________________
Hatred is gained as much by good works as by evil.

~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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#12102 - 10/01/08 04:03 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: blackdragon31560]
coelentrate Offline
member


Registered: 07/07/08
Posts: 164
Loc: Dundee, Scotland
My answer to the original question.

That humanity is animalistic is not a new idea. See E. O. Wilson's "Sociobiology". And it is not a satanic idea. It's only a scientific idea. The only thing that Satanism has to do with this is to recognize the foolishiness of ignoring and trying to supress this.

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#12103 - 10/01/08 04:12 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
Fabiano Offline
member


Registered: 09/06/08
Posts: 374
 Quote:
“Politically, I define myself as an anarchist. I don't see anarchy as Tyranny”

Tyranny is the logical conclusion of Anarchy, you must of heard the term “order out of chaos”
1st, It's your conclusion, without any kind of logical argumentation.

2nd, you abruptly truncate my words :
 Quote:
Politically, I define myself as an anarchist. I don't see anarchy as Tyranny. Anarchy is the abscence of authority, so just the opposite.
Being Stronger does not mean being nasty or evil. Satanists are kind with their friends, hard with their ennemies.

So I think that in such an anarchical society, where the nature is free to operate its magic, that society will auto-organise. Groups and associations can be created and disolved as necessary, as needed. I see the stronger taking the lead of such group, as "situational leadership".


Again you extract sentences from the context when you write only the underlined extract:
 Quote:
We do not promote "imperfection", we're indulgent. The issue with abstinence is not with people who accept it freely (like some true christians or Satanists).
The problems comes when a Church, an authority imposes such abstinence. For the strongers, it'll not be an issue : or it will make it (as true Xians) or they will rebel against it (as true Satanists).
But think about the weaks who take on their shoulders a responsability, a commitment they'll not be able to respect. Those to weak for admitting their sins, thos too weak for rebelling and says "it's not a sin"?
We do not promote "imperfection", we're indulgent. The issue with abstinence is not with people who accept it freely (like some true christians or Satanists).
The problems comes when a Church, an authority imposes such abstinence. For the strongers, it'll not be an issue : or it will make it (as true Xians) or they will rebel against it (as true Satanists).
But think about the weaks who take on their shoulders a responsability, a commitment they'll not be able to respect. Those to weak for admitting their sins, thos too weak for rebelling and says "it's not a sin"?
Then they'll build a respectable façade and will commit their "sins" secretly.
Or like Torquemada, they'll will play the malignant, the Evil-minded, twisting his own bible for justificating their actions. They will argue & convince others that all these evil actions are justified by some good/God reason.


Your answer : "Confession, Forgivness, Mercy"

How those who're too weak for admitting their sins could confess ?
(I suppose I don't need to explain what power the confession gives to the priest & the church)

 Quote:
Maybe not you, maybe not these on the board, but what of those with real power, real wealth, what about traditional Satanists who believe in human sacrifice etc or just mad men? Satanism or satanic philosophy will enable these “Demons” to be released from their prison that is the Christian moral standard.


That's the point. You entered here for "knowing about Satanism". We repeated that we're Modern Satanists. And you continue to mix us up with all kind of "mad mens". We're not responsible for them. We're in favour that each individual takes his responsabilities.

2nd, what about the one with real power who went to war in Iraq. Was he a Satanist? What about Protestant vs Catholic war in the UK? Is you christian moral really able to keep these "Demons" in "prison" ?

But at least you admit the Christian moral is a prison. Well!


 Quote:
“You said Jesus was God, not the son of God”

Jesus is the son of God, Jesus is God.


You don't answer the question! So how can Jesus ignore something if he's God?


Fabiano

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#12107 - 10/01/08 06:14 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

Oh what the heck… Why not…

 Originally Posted By: lux
Your asking yourself “does God exist” instead of asking yourself, how does it benefit mankind, (not me personally) if God exists?

It gives man an external being to blame unexplained happenings on… It also gives them a scapegoat to blame rather than admit that ones own laziness is the main reason they cannot get what they want, or why it is they do the things they do… God wanted it so or it was not gods way is so much easier to swallow… ;\)

 Originally Posted By: lux
Christianity protects the weak from the strong

Does it really?

 Originally Posted By: lux
Christianity builds weak people up, makes them believe in themselves through hope in God.

Oh ok… So they are not just hoping for better after this life?

 Originally Posted By: lux
Have you seen the pro life movement in the united states

simple, weak people, who believe in the power of God and that the power of God is working through them and even if you don’t believe in a god or gods, you can see the power of God or at least the power of the concept of God working in them.

I present to you a few men who felt the power of god working through them…

Eric Robert Rudolph - The Christian Identity movement
E. Rudolph

James Charles Kopp - The Lambs of Christ, AKA-Victim Souls of the Unborn Christ-Child
J._C._Kopp

Peter James Knight – pro lifer
P. J. Knight

Can you dig the power of god working in these people…

 Originally Posted By: lux
Your religion takes you away from God and reduces you to nothing more than an animal, our religion raises you up to a supernatural being.

Religion? The philosophy I follow teaches one to only blame themselves for acting out on such urges… No need to blame God, Satan, Santa, or the Easter bunny…

 Originally Posted By: lux
Maybe not you, maybe not these on the board, but what of those with real power, real wealth, what about traditional Satanists who believe in human sacrifice etc or just mad men? Satanism or satanic philosophy will enable these “Demons” to be released from their prison that is the Christian moral standard.

Your religion is a breeding ground for many of the worlds monsters… From doctor killers to pedophile priests being protected from the weak by the rich…

 Originally Posted By: lux
Because your looking at it the wrong way, if a man hears the fun fair is in town, does he simply stay in the house saying, its lies, all lies, I see no concrete proof

Your grasping at straws, your comparisons are not logical…

 Originally Posted By: lux
Do you want to believe in God?

No… Do you want to believe in Xenu?

 Quote:
“But yet you are arguing as if it is fact”

 Originally Posted By: lux
Because I believe in it, I believe it is the right way, I believe it is good for humanity, I believe it is good for the weak, the marginalised, the oppressed, I believe in it, and I hope for an eternal life.

For many years mankind believed the world was flat and that dragons and sea creatures killed any who traveled too far… Death is guaranteed eternal life is nothing but a hope to calm the fear of the ultimate end…

 Originally Posted By: lux
You all seem to forget that Christianity is a religion of the heart not so much the head

I would say quite the opposite Christianity is a religion based on blind faith… This is all in the head and nowhere near the heart…

Peace

~T~
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#12109 - 10/01/08 07:46 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: ta2zz]
lux Offline
Banned
pledge


Registered: 09/26/08
Posts: 64
Loc: Newcastle UK
“Rrright, just like the jews in WWII, when pope turned them away. They might as well have walked them in to the concentration camps, just to make sure they got there safely.”

You know the pope and the church took a lot of sh*t over that even to the point where a number of popes have apologised but when a vatican document from the time was finally approved for access to historians,(eairlier this year) it was found that many of the accusations came from (I think it said) communist circles to try to discredit the church.

I am sure if you google it and have the patients of sifting through all the crapolla you will the news report. The point being that catholics have many enemies who try to discredit the church with over exagerations and fabrications.

Catholics died along side their jewish bretheren, a lot of Jews were baptized catholics in order to get them out of eurpoe, You have to remember the pope had to think of protecting his flock, he could not speak out too much.

Read about Maximilian Kolbe

http://www.catholic.org.sg/cn/wordpress/?p=2472

“That's the point. You entered here for "knowing about Satanism". We repeated that we're Modern Satanists. And you continue to mix us up with all kind of "mad mens". We're not responsible for them. We're in favour that each individual takes his responsabilities.”

I am not mixing you up at all. I know your different, ah I just don’t think you get what I am saying… if this Satanist philosophy is promoted in society via whatever means under the guise of Atheism, materialism or whatever, it will be used by the most unscrupioulous men to enslave the population.

“2nd, what about the one with real power who went to war in Iraq. Was he a Satanist? What about Protestant vs Catholic war in the UK? Is you christian moral really able to keep these "Demons" in "prison" ?”

As for GW Bush, we have all heard the rumours of Bohimian Grove.

Protestant v Catholic in uk, your talking of either the reformation in uk or the trouble in Ireland, first was about political upheaval, King Henry wanted to do what he wanted and marry another woman, he was thinking about himself, yes that is Satanism. Ireland about land and trade, not religion. Well lets put it this way, we can severely hinder them, you have to remember we live in a post Christian society, there is no real Christian morality left except in the people who are Christian and in certain laws of the land, otherwise our morality is starting to be ridiculed.

“But at least you admit the Christian moral is a prison. Well!”

A prison for the demons yes.

“How those who're too weak for admitting their sins could confess ?
(I suppose I don't need to explain what power the confession gives to the priest & the church)”

What about them, their sins are between God and themselves, I would encourage them to go to confession, confess they have sins they feel they can not expand upon but that they do repent of these sins and receive absolution.

“We're not responsible for them. We're in favour that each individual takes his responsabilities.”

And if the philosophy you promote enables them to “do as they will” you do not take any responsibility for this?

“It gives man an external being to blame unexplained happenings on… It also gives them a scapegoat to blame rather than admit that ones own laziness is the main reason they cannot get what they want, or why it is they do the things they do… God wanted it so or it was not gods way is so much easier to swallow… “

Yes it can do that, but whats the problem with that, but there is much more it does for the human race, your talking of individuals, we are not centered on ourselves, we Catholics… i.e Universalists….

“Oh ok… So they are not just hoping for better after this life?”

Historically the Catholic people have very focused on the here and now

St Paul, had to correct the Christians early on to keep hope in the next life because so many were centred on this life.

Again from 1 Cor 15

If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching (philosophy) is useless and so is your faith (in that philosophy).

For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile (you can not be raised to anything higher than the natural self) you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost(those who have died for their faith have died for nothing). If *only* for *this life* we have hope in Christ, we are to be pitied more than all men.

“I present to you a few men who felt the power of god working through them…

Eric Robert Rudolph - The Christian Identity movement

James Charles Kopp - The Lambs of Christ, AKA-Victim Souls of the Unborn Christ-Child

Peter James Knight – pro lifer”

While the catholic church has not sanctioned it, and proclaims a peaceful approach to the holocaust and those who act outside of this proclamation, exact immediate excommunication, I also present you with this.

From Catholic Answers:

"THE ROOTS OF JUST WAR DOCTRINE

In the Beatitudes, Jesus tells us "blessed are the peacemakers" (Matt. 5:9). Elsewhere in the Sermon on the Mount he tells us "if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also" (Matt. 5:39). From such verses some have concluded that Christianity is a pacifist religion and that violence is never permitted.

But the same Jesus elsewhere acknowledges the legitimate use of force, telling the apostles, "let him who has no sword sell his mantle and buy one" (Luke 22:36). How are these passages to be reconciled?

In broad terms, Christians must not love violence. They must promote peace whenever possible and be slow to resort to the use of arms. But they must not be afraid to do so when it is called for. Evil must not be allowed to remain unchecked.

Added weight is given to this realization when one recognizes that Scripture -- all of Scripture -- is inspired by God (2 Tim. 3:16). This means that the Old Testament is just as inspired as the New Testament and thus an expression of the will of Christ.

The Old Testament acknowledges frankly that there is "a time to kill" (Eccles. 3:3). At various times in the Old Testament, God commanded the Israelites to defend their nation by force of arms. Yet it was always with the recognition that peace is the goal to be worked for. Thus the psalmist exclaims, "how good and pleasant it is when brothers dwell in unity!" (Ps. 133:1). Peace is the goal, but when it cannot be achieved without force, force must be used.

In the same way, the New Testament sets forth the goal of peace but acknowledges the legitimate use of force. It does so by John the Baptist's acknowledgment that Roman soldiers, whose job it was to enforce the Pax Romana, or "Peace of Rome," could keep their jobs (Luke 3:14) and by Paul's observation that the state "does not bear the sword in vain" but is "God's servant for your good" (Rom. 13:4).

As long as Christianity remained a minority religion in the Roman Empire, it was not forced to put these insights together into a formal theory of when warfare could be used. But as Christianity grew predominant, more attention had to be devoted to this subject. By the time of Augustine (A.D. 354-430) the need for a theory of when warfare was just was keen, and Augustine provided one, crystallizing biblical principles into what is now known as just war doctrine. In the intervening centuries the theory has been refined, but its framework remains as he gave it.

JUST WAR DOCTRINE TODAY

The most authoritative and up-to-date expression of just war doctrine is found in paragraph 2309 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It says:

The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
• there must be serious prospects of success;
• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. The power of modern means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.

These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the "just war" doctrine. The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good

In the case of abortion the Aggressor is the state itself, the lasting effect of abortion is underpopulation in Europe, it is grave in its potential to cause collapse in the economy… but it is not certain as yet.

There are many avenues now being persued, they have by no means failed, however it does not stop people believing that they will.

The pope called abortion an intrinsic evil, the primary evil in todays society. What wepons used could be graver than this except a nuke?

I do not condone what these men did, but I understand, I am a sympathiser, my only real objection is the killing of the abortionists, it should be pro choice legislators.

Another line from the catechism states regarding legitimate defense

"Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility"

Who has more authority than God's own Church, the whole world is entrusted to the magestirum of rome... I would take up arms if the vatican would decalre a just war on abortion.

“Religion? The philosophy I follow teaches one to only blame themselves for acting out on such urges… No need to blame God, Satan, Santa, or the Easter bunny…”

Blame, what you talking about blame?

“Your religion is a breeding ground for many of the worlds monsters… From doctor killers to pedophile priests being protected from the weak by the rich…”

Doctor killers, you mean killer doctors?

Regarding the cover up, they were protected by their bishops, not the rich. BTW most of those men were homosexual infiltrtors. But still the numbers are insignificant compaired to teachers.

“No… Do you want to believe in Xenu?”

I don’t know who xenu is and i have never heard his philosophy.

So how could i possibly answer?


Edited by lux (10/01/08 07:55 PM)

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#12110 - 10/01/08 07:47 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1646
Loc: Orlando, FL
I Refer to idiologys that I regard as “Satan’s promotion tools” those things that have elements of Satanism in it.

Wait... WHAT? Many forms of paganism are "white-light" varieties that promote morality, altruism, and love. How could these possibly be the tools of an evil being? To quote the "good book", a house divided against itself cannot stand.

Do you want to believe in God?

Whether I want to or not is irrelevant. Sure, I'd like to believe in Santa Claus, but that wouldn't make any difference over whether or not he exists.

Christianity protects the weak from the strong, Christianity builds weak people up, makes them believe in themselves through hope in God... etc

It's not just religion... people find strength in all sorts of ideologies, not just ones based around "God". What ideologies do is give people hope and inspiration, and a sense of "purpose". I've met a few people who could be considered "born again Pagans" for how big a deal they make over how their religion bettered their lives.

Your religion takes you away from God and reduces you to nothing more than an animal,

"Nothing more" than an animal? That's what we are, and we're not ashamed to embrace the reality of it.

what about traditional Satanists who believe in human sacrifice etc or just mad men? Satanism or satanic philosophy will enable these “Demons” to be released from their prison that is the Christian moral standard.

Only one or two whackjobs believe in crazy shit like human sacrifice.... and they are certainly outnumbered by murderers and other madmen who believe they are doing the work of Jesus.

Man needs God, Men need God

No, the proper statement would be "MOST men need RELIGION".

Someone posted a link explaining how the human behavioral desire for "something more" leads us to religion. To say that mankind is only drawn to Yahweh is ridiculous- look at the multitude of other gods throughout history! People have found meaning and satisfaction in those gods as well.

Wiccans find meaning and inspiration in the Mother Goddess.

Asatruar find meaning and inspiration in the Nordic Gods.

Followers of Hindu find meaning and inspiration in the Hindu Gods.

We find this meaning and satisfaction in our idea of Satan.

However there are some atheists who are fine and happy with no religion. We respect their decision. Who are you to say that they are unfulfilled?
_________________________
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#12112 - 10/01/08 08:12 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: The Zebu]
lux Offline
Banned
pledge


Registered: 09/26/08
Posts: 64
Loc: Newcastle UK
I dont get it, you seem to be missing the point on every thing i post, your keep going back to the individual instead of looking at humanity as a whole, its like i am saying one thing and your hearing something totaly different. I have been more open and direct with you lot than i have with any other group, but despite my directness your still on a entirely different wavelengh, my words seem to mean something differnet to you than they do to me.... its bizzar and its doing my head in.

I started off being cryptic, you didnt get it, I started getting less and less cryptic but you could only see in my posts the things you wanted to see... it makes me wonder if you really do understand but you just try to discredit it be turnining it into something its not.... or perhaps the saying is right, there are non so blind as those who do not want to see.

I refer you to a book that will explain Christian philosophy better than I. But you will probably so hung up on "but there is no proof of a god" and on yourself and your own ability to reason, that you will fail to see it dosnt matter.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM


Edited by lux (10/01/08 08:14 PM)

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#12114 - 10/01/08 08:42 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
paradise lost Offline
Idiot: Banned
stranger


Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 11
with all do respect what kind of god tries to change us think about it.

ur god is unjust fowl countless of countries fight over the same name of god.

if it wasnt for us.

human beings of higher capabilities like us.

ur thread of interwoven hypocracy also known the bible,coran,etc...

would not exist!

our work is the work of the living!

your work is dead Xian.

our bible changes through time ur "good bible" stays the same and has been the same just different wording for the ages before the age of set.

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#12117 - 10/01/08 09:34 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
Fabiano Offline
member


Registered: 09/06/08
Posts: 374
Lux,

I have that same feeling to be in a "deaf dialogue". We must admit that we have radically opposed positions. And there are few chances one of us changes his position. All what we can do is to try to understand better the other's point of view, the stranger, the alien's point of view.

I want to thank you for your book, but I already read the bible and made my own opinion about it.
Regarding the churchs, as I sayed in an imaged way, trying to "enter your world", I was the man John complained about because he wasn't part of the church. I always considered my faith, my religion was regarding only my God and myself.
I can explain my point of view and debate, this sometime makes me understand something more. But I was distrustful to those telling me that they better understand the bible than myself, telling me how I should think. So, I hope you'll understand your book does not interrest me a lot, sorry. I would like to spend my time in digging in Satanism...

A already debated with Catholics, Witesses of Jehova, and other kinds of Xians. They're always trying to convince you that your soul is lost unless if you go with them.
Satanists are far less proselitic! If you ask we give our opinion, but only if you ask...

What I retain from our exchanges, is that we're probably not very "evil". Neither me, neither you. They're are good and evil men in any group, so in any church... I hope you now know better what is moderm Satanism and saw that it's not so "evil".

I appreciated debating with you. But we're just on two different paths, you're on the Right Hand one and I'm on the Left Hand Path.

I sincerely wish you good luck, Lux.

Fabiano


Edited by Fabiano (10/01/08 09:40 PM)

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#12118 - 10/01/08 10:26 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: lux]
Nemesis Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2175
Loc: US
 Quote:
You know the pope and the church took a lot of sh*t over that even to the point where a number of popes have apologised but when a vatican document from the time was finally approved for access to historians,(eairlier this year) it was found that many of the accusations came from (I think it said) communist circles to try to discredit the church.

Sorry, we're gonna have to see this validated. If you can provide a link to a scan of the document, that'd be great.

 Quote:
I am not mixing you up at all. I know your different, ah I just don’t think you get what I am saying… if this Satanist philosophy is promoted in society via whatever means under the guise of atheism, materialism or whatever, it will be used by the most unscrupioulous men to enslave the population.

 Quote:
your keep going back to the individual instead of looking at humanity as a whole, its like i am saying one thing and your hearing something totaly different.

Now I know that the above two posts were directed at different replies, but do you see how you're being a bit hypocritical, comparing your statements? You have pinned down this way of thinking that humanity needs Christianity, yet still think of Satanists and their philosophy as individuals or isolated cases.

What would the world be like if the coin was reversed, and we lived in a majorally Satanic society? Feel free to compare it with your own ideals:

Rape would be outlawed.

Murder of innocent animals such as pets and endangered species would be outlawed and enforced.

Appeals in the court system would not exist, nor would there be such a thing as "Death Row". Once you are convicted of a capital crime like murder, rape, intentional maiming or anything that compromises safety of innocents, you would be taken out back and shot in the head.

There would be incentives for familes to have no more than two children, instead of rewarding families with welfare checks for popping out kids to "be fruitful and multiply", thereby depleting our resources.

Welfare would not exist, because everyone would have a job to do unti they could get back on their feet.

Programs to aid people in job loss recovery would be available, as well as a limited time span in which one would have to get the fuck back on their feet and start earning a living again. Otherwise they risk deportation to Mexico.

Self-defense, provided there were witnesses, would never have to be justified in a court. Also, all legal citizens 21 and up have the right to carry, as long as they take a thorough concealed carry class and carry a permit on them at all times.

There would be no tax benefits for married couples, nor any legal hindrances to couples who elect not to get married. Marriage would be strictly a personal commitment, without any religious connotations.

A woman has the right to choose, but if the father is present, he might also have a say if he accepts full responsibility and compensates the mother for her expenses and effort to bear the child. Deadbeat dads would be a thing of the past, as these men would be found and persecuted immediately, their bank account drained and assets liquidated to compensate the family he left. Unless he filed for being in absentia with the government (for example if the mother was a shrew or he had violent tendencies and couldn't be around the kids), he could leave but would have to pay out the ass for it.

Drugs are legal and heavily regulated and taxed to provide income for the states.

Education is mandatory, and would be held up to the highest standards, competetive with countries who tend to do better than us.

There would be no such thing as "sexual deviation", because there would be no taboos to rebel against.

No affirmative action--you're hired or fired depending on your level of skill, not what color or gender you are.

Everyone would be taxed a certain percentage, no matter how much you make. If you were smart and created a successful business, you shouldn't have to be penalized for it.

Prisons like Guantanamo Bay would not exist, because these people convicted of carrying out or planning attacks on innocents would be executed.

 Quote:
And if the philosophy you promote enables them to “do as they will” you do not take any responsibility for this?

In case you haven't understood the whole gist of Satanism, and us, to put in Peter Gilmore's words, "Satanists follow the letter of the law". Above I gave you some examples of how things would work under a Satanic governing principle (although many here might disagree with me on a few points or have ones of their own to add). They might seem harsh to you, but they are clear, they are civilized, and they are humane. As Satanists, we wouldn't be enacting laws that went against our human nature, to fuck, to drink, to hunt, to enjoy ourselves as we see fit. We would not need an onslaught of laws to reign us in, as do the Christianized and Islamic countries.

For example: What if it was illegal to smoke on the sidewalk? It's a stupid law, and many would be caught breaking it. What if it was illegal to fuck someone in the ass? A law that has no business telling people what to do, and yet millions will break it. In both cases, there is no harm befalling anyone, both laws are governed by a twisted sense of morality.

A Satanic world would be freer yet harsh compared with what we have now. It would cull the weak (note, not necessarily kill, but these kinds of people would not succeed in life and would not be encouraged to stay).

 Quote:
For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either.

Well there you go! Finally, something you've said that is logical and makes sense.

 Quote:
if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also

Only if it's my right ass cheek, because I love a nice spanking. Spices things up a little, you know?

 Quote:
From such verses some have concluded that Christianity is a pacifist religion and that violence is never permitted.

Only those who have not read the Old Testament and learned of what a vicious god you serve. While it may cancel out some of the laws that governed the tribes, the New Testament does not erase god's atrocities visited upon the human race through the ages.

 Quote:
The Old Testament acknowledges frankly that there is "a time to kill" (Eccles. 3:3). At various times in the Old Testament, God commanded the Israelites to defend their nation by force of arms. Yet it was always with the recognition that peace is the goal to be worked for. Thus the psalmist exclaims, "how good and pleasant it is when brothers dwell in unity!" (Ps. 133:1). Peace is the goal, but when it cannot be achieved without force, force must be used.

Mwhahahahahahahaha!!!! That's a good one! How many other neighboring tribes were annihilated just under the leadership of Joshua at God's instruction? As the aggressors, not the defenders?

 Quote:
In the case of abortion the Aggressor is the state itself, the lasting effect of abortion is underpopulation in Europe, it is grave in its potential to cause collapse in the economy… but it is not certain as yet.

That has to be one of the most ignorant things I've ever heard. Europe's population loss is mainly due to young people seeking a better education and future which is not to be found in their native countries. That, and parents who are living longer and better lives, and who elect to have fewer children than in previous generations.

 Quote:
Doctor killers, you mean killer doctors?

You sympathize with one, we the other. They are both murderers. Here you go, putting value on one person's life over another...hmmm, funny how you accused us of that when it came to fetuses vs mothers.
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#12119 - 10/01/08 11:12 PM Re: Modern Satanism isnt it just.... [Re: Nemesis]
fakepropht Moderator Offline
Big Slick
active member


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 990
Loc: Texas
One thing you touched on briefly, though indirectly, is that stupidy would be punished. There would be no million dollar rewards given to the dumbass that spilled hot coffee in her lap and burnt her cootchie. Don't expect a helping hand because you can barely speak the language, even though you were born here. Stupidity, to me, should be punished to the fullest extent. It's an overused quote, but for good reason, "Stupidity should be painful".
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