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#1734 - 11/11/07 01:01 AM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: Carme]
TornadoCreator Offline
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Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 586
Loc: No Fixed Address
I never said I was an expert on the subject of Autism however I do know a fair amount about it, considering I am Autistic and so are many of the kids I grew up with considering I went to a special school for 6 months myself.

This however is beside the point. My point is that from what I know of Autism it is difficult to find any "specialist" that knows anything about Autism. I've pulled up 3 professors at degree level on the bullshit they're saying when they teach about Autism. I'm serious, half the stuff they say they know is just made up. Now I realise I'm a different case to Sinstar's child and (via PM's which I'm not going to repeat here) I have given my account of what Autism is like and how to deal with it because I was asked for my opinion. I may not get everything exactly right, everyone is different and let's face it, if you know anything of Autism you already know that I'm not finding it extremely easy to get my point across.

Now I'm lucky. I am a higher functioning Autist which means that I am at the "smartass" end of the spectrum. Well... no not really but close. I am actually quite an intelligent person, I have a natural talent with logic and mathematics and I'm also therefore good at things such as sciences. I do however lack basic skills in the arts and language, which I have tried very hard to overcome. A lower functioning Autist is very different, they often find that they cannot cope with the world around them and although can live very happy lives, from an outside perspective will always seem disengaged from the world and alienated from it. The main thing to consider there is that they have such an uninterested and undeveloped idea of emotion that they probably prefer it that way. Emotions confuse them and numbers, mathematics, geometric shapes etc. comfort them. This is because of the way the brain copes with the deficiencies presented within it (and yes, I've actually studied Autism, I'm not basing all this on personal experience, I have qualifications to back this up).

The fact stands, and my opinion remains, special schools are a waste of time. If he turns out to be higher functioning like myself he will be dragged down by a special school, denied the chance to get proper recognized qualifications and subsequently a job or even a career that he will enjoy. Alternatively he could have lower functioning autism, in which case he'll greatly struggle in standardized school, likely only scraping a pass grade at best, in which case he has achieved his best and he should be praised for it against adversity. The alternative is he goes to the special school and gets a certificate that say "Hey! I can tie my shoe laces" and can kiss goodbye to his future.

Special schools are pointless, any employer or college will look at anything you achieve there and immediately tarnish it with the fact that it was a special school and he therefore must be employing someone with a mental disorder, thus mental defect, thus mentally unstable, thus psychotic, thus AAAAGGGHHH murder us in the cafeteria with a bread knife.... yes, it seem excessive but you know it's not that much of an exaggeration. No employer will employ anyone with "Mentally Disabled" written in the shape of the name of a fucking special school right there in black on white on the damn CV(Resume).
Even if he struggles all throughout school and his only achievement is to make it to the end capable of basic numeracy and literacy at least he can look back with pride that despite his differences he managed something that others would never expect. I would personally want to give him that chance. THAT is why I justify telling Sinstar that I think special school would be a bad idea, if it's not a good enough explanation for you Carme then fuck you, I was asked for my opinion and I gave it. It's an opinion nothing more, but at least it's one made from an informed and experienced point of view.

Oh, and I know I keep saying "I'm autistic" and most people here won't know what that means... LOOK IT THE FUCK UP DICKHEAD!!! If you don't know what something is then do some research and stop expecting someone to explain every single term they use, I'm not your bloody parent. Yes it's stupid to expect everyone to know what it means but it's not stupid to expect people to know how to download a medical journal, open a book or even just type a word into Wikipedia now is it? Even if you don't want to do that you could, politely (unlike you did Carme) PM me and ask me what the hell autism is, I'd be happy to explain it or forward you information pertaining to the subject. If you're going to attack someone based on the fact that they treated the rest of the community with respect, dignity and intellect by assuming they could work an encyclopedia then you should really think twice about making it known to that self same community, you may upset people when they notice that your effectively accusing them of being as stupid and ignorant as yourself.

And one final point. You know an Asperger's Wiccan correct? How does that pertain to any single point in this entire fucking conversation or was it just another additional piece of diarrhea that you felt like sharing with us.

Thank you and goodnight.

PS: Anyone (with the obvious exception of Carme), who was offended by my excessive tone I apologise, I've not had a particularly pleasant day and this person pissed me off.
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#1749 - 11/11/07 02:30 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TornadoCreator]
Carme Offline
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Registered: 09/29/07
Posts: 17
Hey Mr. Aspiring Satanist: you're not being rational, articulate, intelligent, or logical here. Maybe next time instead of making an ass of yourself you'll wait until you're in a clamer state of mind before responding to someone. "Thank you and goodnight?" Home fry, you have little to be proud of with this one. Strive to do better...

To put it in very blunt and simple terms: you're taking your personal experiences with what it means to be a person with high-functioning autism and applying it to "people with autism" in general. You keep saying that you're not an expert and that your opinions are just based on your experience, yet you claim to have put experts in their place and have "bested" all of these degree-level professors by pointing out their lack of true understanding. You emphasize the former yet get pissed off when I tell you it's moronic to do so?

I've worked in normal preschools. I've worked with teachers who've worked in those "special schools" you feel are a waste of time. Based on what I've learned from them there's a huge difference in how the child develops--and, much more often than not, it's a positive one. This is where my opinions come from: personal and borrowed experiences. Now, you claim to have studied autism and have mentioned "medical journals" and the like. Can you back up your assertion that specialized schools are a waste of time--you stated it as "fact" if I recall correctly--and do not positively benefit children? That's the whole basis of your argument, isn't it--that people should not place their autistic children (higher functioning or not) in environments where people are trained to meet their needs?

 Quote:
And one final point. You know an Asperger's Wiccan correct? How does that pertain to any single point in this entire fucking conversation or was it just another additional piece of diarrhea that you felt like sharing with us.


In your enlightening post on what it means to be autistic, you said that Sinstar's son will likely dislike religion and that you hadn't met someone who was autistic and not Atheist. Asperger's is a kind of autism. My good friend is quite into his religion. This was one of the ways in which I attempted to illustrate how full of crap your last post was in any kind of objective, rational sense. For someone who claims to be good with logic, that one flew right over your head.

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#1765 - 11/11/07 06:22 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: Carme]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
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Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
I hate to be piss anty, but I find it interesting that this thread started out with Tornado Creator complaining that he attracks women with mental problems, only for it to come full circle and find out he also has mental problems.

 Originally Posted By: TornadoCreator
on attracting women: Is it a coin-incidence that I have attracted multiple people of this type or is there something of my personality and lifestyle that seems to draw that kind of person towards me?


It's funny how you failed to mention your autism in the beginning. I'm not sure how many, even tempered, 'nice' girls are going to want to get into a relationship with someone that has serious emotional problems of their own. The blind leading the blonde maybe?

Maybe you should try being upfront with inteded women and ask them directly if they are wanting a monogamous relationship in the early days. Very few people can lie well when faced with a bald faced question.

Having some issues of your own, should make you realise that none of us are perfect and that you are going to have to accept some faults in a mate, probably emotional ones.

Zeph
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#1778 - 11/11/07 09:24 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
TornadoCreator Offline
member


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 586
Loc: No Fixed Address
Fair point Zeph, and one that I do generally adhere to. I've made a point of making sure people are aware of my Autism before any relationship goes on, all my long term girlfriends bar one knew of my Autism before we started dating and the one that didn't only didn't know for the first two weeks and then it came up in conversation. I'm normally friends with the girls I date for a few weeks before hand so therefore they are exposed to how I am right from the start.

There is however one small difference between mental stability and mental disorders. I would have no problem with dating someone with Autism, Asperger's (which although related to Autism is very different) etc. or someone who was Dyslexic or Dyspraxic for example. Yes it's seems like nothing compared to Autism but really all it is is another mental disorder. Mental stability is different though. Someone violently changing moods unexpectedly or someone convinced they can speak with the dead. People who blindly believe in "crystal therapy" and people who show signs of involuntary rage are not the same at all. Yes, it's a gray area, and one people will likely disagree with me on but as far as I'm concerned mental instability is something that seems to form for no good reason in what where previously normal rational people, this irks me quite a lot, and it's these people who I seem to attract.
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#1821 - 11/12/07 09:44 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TornadoCreator]
Belial 666 Offline
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Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 4
Loc: Texas
Considering this world is a virtual barrel of bad apples from which we must sift through diligently, I find it no surprise when I hear of this kind of situation.

I can relate to this as I too have experienced my share of "crazies" when it comes to female companions.

It's of my opinion that they seem to latch on to whomever appears to have any sence of direction in life in hopes of some of it rubbing off on themselves. They seem to share in the delusion that intelligence, security & stability is something to be caught like the flu rather than manifested by ones own abilities & mental development.

Most of these women have one thing in common - they've all experienced abuse in the past (be it by other persons or by thier own hand). Some put on a facade of having "thick skin" or a been there, done that attitude. They have many war stories & maybe even a few battle scars to show for these experiences yet fall flat when asked the reasons for why thier self-destructive cycle continues.

Thier naivety & masochistic ways are just as foreign to me as my honesty & clarity is to them. Sometimes by way of open & blunt conversation we can hold a mirror in front of them & get them to witness (if not completely understand) thier ways & lack of self awareness. More often though our efforts are seen as critical & maybe even selfish.

We've all heard the saying "love is blind" - yet is it? Could we possibly be looking beyond the mental instabilities which plague these women & see a ray of light at the end of the tunnel that makes this constant battle all worth while?

Something keeps us around them. Sometimes it's our lack of judgement, other times it's these hidden qualities which surface just long enough to make us think twice about giving up on them. My common sence tells me it could very well be the former, my ego suggests it might be the latter.

One has to ultimately do what's best for themselves. If a relationship (in any form) is taking a toll on your lifestyle because of being burdened with the problems of others, you have to evaluate the circumstances & eventually come to a rational conclusion.

As for why you, myself & many others experience these situations...I couldn't say exactly. It could be we go head first into these relationships with too much optimism & not enough discretion. Sometimes we grab the most attractive package only to be taken aback later on by its contents.
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#2376 - 11/28/07 03:59 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: Carme]
Circus_Hell Offline
stranger


Registered: 09/10/07
Posts: 34
Loc: Sydney Australia
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

That's quite a hostile response Carme! It seems as though TC was sharing some insight according to his "own personal experiences". and there is nothing wrong with giving support. I would like to add that I have three autistic people in my life. All completely different, I'm also a trained nurse,(although now I'm studying medicine) and I've seen Autism in many forms. It's like epilepsy, or dementia. There's no general rule because each person is an individual. It is referred to as an umbrella condition. Do they tell you that as teachers college?

As a teacher, you are required to be supportive and empathetic.You are meant to source options for special needs kids and present those options to the parents. You however, are self righteous and subjective. Probably better you find another career, the thought of you pushing your arrogance onto such beautiful minds in their purest state is quite a concern.

Do you have any of your own children, and if so are the suffering a disability of any kind?

So what if you are a pre school teacher? Hardly makes you an expert on the human race!!!! Many teachers are in teaching jobs because they can't cut it in the adult world.
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#5279 - 03/11/08 09:21 AM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TornadoCreator]
DaVinci Offline
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Registered: 02/09/08
Posts: 218
Loc: Australia
I don't think religion or preference has anything to do with it. I've been cheated on by both of the two major serious relationships I have ever had. Both girls could not handle the lifestyles I lead. And as much as I hate to bring this up, but it all comes down to the Military lifestyle -- for me it is perfect, but I move alot and can leave for up to months on end. Especially when doing duties overseas, when I could be gone for up to 12 months; though that has yet to happen, thankfully.

Both of these two girls were more then Mentally Unstable. My last ex (I've had a few since her) was raped at 13, kept the child, had a mother who was a passive liar, a step-father who had everything done for him as a teenager and can't handle the real world, a brother with whom I remain good mates with, and a sister who has had Family Services called on her more times than I can remember -- and likes to smoke pot while leaving her 2 daughters with the mentally unstable and lying mother.

My first serious relationship was with the girl I lost my virginity too. We were 13, young and fucking stupid -- and as it was my first serious relationship, I was concerned and developed trust issues. Issues that remain with me to this present day. While her boyfriend was in Perth, I was "hooking in" because I didn't like the prick as he was responsible for selling heroin to my little brother -- who, is just as stupid for buying the bloody crap, but he learned his lesson. Upon his return, she was sleeping with him behind my back. In response to this cheating I beat the crap out of him. My own fault really, but still -- he deserved it.

Ever since I have always attracted girls with fucked-up backgrounds, or those with the mental capacity of a 5 cent coin. However, the tide has turned and I have now been flirting with the check-out chick at my local IGA Supermarket, and we've been close for some time now and do plan on 'taking things further' in the near future. This has only risen because when handing her cash for cigarettes one day, I slipped a paper note underneath one of my dollar bills, which had the simple words "You're absolutely beautiful."

I think if you want a change in your romantic scene, you have to act more on instinct and less on 'feelings' -- as I've never had the courage to approach any woman like that, but little things like that can make all the difference. Surprise yourself and go for someone completely unexpected -- "Go with the wind."
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#5283 - 03/11/08 10:44 AM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: DaVinci]
TornadoCreator Offline
member


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 586
Loc: No Fixed Address
That's an interesting idea actually DaVinci. I would be interested to see what would happen if I was to actively seek relationships with girls who I normally wouldn't but the problem is my lifestyle. I am in significant debt, unemployed civvy life, part time military living in a town of 40,000 people, (which means little opertunity to meet anyone new). Few people fit into that set, especially as I would only feel confortable dating an Atheist, unfortunately the minority in the UK.
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#5293 - 03/11/08 12:23 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TornadoCreator]
DaVinci Offline
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Registered: 02/09/08
Posts: 218
Loc: Australia
I can understand that. I lived in Canberra up until I was about 15, then I joined the Army and got posted to Holsworthy. Canberra in itself is a very small place -- and while it has a population of about 300,000 -- it was still difficult in a sense to meeting anyone "new" or anyone who had not already conformed to the styles of the Nation's Capital.

Lifestyle I think is always a rather difficult problem, and while I'm no relationship guru, I've always found the best tactic is to go for someone completely unexpected. The quiet type are more what I prefer, but then your taste may differ and you may prefer the more out-going types. Like I said, just surprise yourself. Go for something totally new and unexpected, and give it your whole heart. You might be surprised what can actually eventuate..
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#5412 - 03/12/08 07:24 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: DaVinci]
TheMask Offline
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Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 130
I havent read through the thread post by post so i dont know if this has been said already. But isnt there some truth in that we acttract people similiar to ourselves by mere instinct?

You may not be the same type of mental condition as the womens you have met but you both have a mental condidition different from the majority.
Whether it is someone who is Manic Depressive or has Autism it is still a mental "defect" (depends on how you view it, there are upsides to your mental illness and others) and maybe it is this that attracts you to each other even if your conditions are far from the same.

You may not even have to know that the other person has a mental "defect", like i said it could be mere instinct and maybe the subconscious picks up things that indicate this as well.

Thats just a theory, i hope i got my point across.

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#5417 - 03/12/08 07:45 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TheMask]
DistroyA Offline
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Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 478
Loc: Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, UK
 Originally Posted By: TheMask
I havent read through the thread post by post so i dont know if this has been said already. But isnt there some truth in that we acttract people similiar to ourselves by mere instinct?

You may not be the same type of mental condition as the womens you have met but you both have a mental condidition different from the majority.
Whether it is someone who is Manic Depressive or has Autism it is still a mental "defect" (depends on how you view it, there are upsides to your mental illness and others) and maybe it is this that attracts you to each other even if your conditions are far from the same.

You may not even have to know that the other person has a mental "defect", like i said it could be mere instinct and maybe the subconscious picks up things that indicate this as well.

Thats just a theory, i hope i got my point across.


That's possibly a similar case with myself. I have a learning difficulty similar to Asperger Syndrome called Semantic Pragmatic Disorder, and I suffer from depression a bit these days. I've attracted certain individuals who seem to have certain qualities that would be considered negative in today's society.

My first girlfriend was going through a depressive stage in her life when I started dating her. The second woman I managed to attract (but not establish a relationship with sadly) seems to be somewhat unstable, and the last girl I was with was a depressive of the worst kind. No passion, no drive, a lack of compassion also. That relationship was a mistake, and I'm happier without. Another girl I managed to attract seemed quite unstable, but was constantly whining and putting herself down. And she wonders why I didn't want to be with her in a romantic sense....

Still, these people are somewhat nice people. Particularly the former two I mentioned.

I think what I'm trying to say now is that no matter what issues a girl has, the old saying of "no-one is perfect" springs to mind. We all have issues we have to deal with. So long as the issues are dealt with constructively, that's all that matters.

As for the conditions being "defects", I find that a wee bit insulting. I prefer "difficulties" personally. Thing is, people who have these learning difficulties and other mental disorders were born with them or they developed over time (depending on what you refer to...), so calling them defects is like persecuting them for being what they were born like. It's almost like giving a black man grief just because he's different looking through genes and DNA.

Sorry if you feel that I'm getting angry with you TM. I'm not. I'm just pointing certain things out for future reference.
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#5424 - 03/12/08 08:26 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: DistroyA]
TheMask Offline
member


Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 130
Yes, you are completely right. Im sorry. I dont see mental illness as a "defect", i just had a problem with finding the right words for it.

To be frank some mental illnesses have their upsides. Some Autism enables the person to learn certain things incredibly fast and be very good at them. Its not all bad.
I dont think bad about the mentally ill - In some cases its quite the opposite.


Edited by TheMask (03/12/08 08:27 PM)

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#5425 - 03/12/08 08:29 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: TheMask]
DistroyA Offline
member


Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 478
Loc: Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, UK
The funny thing with autistic people and people who have a condition similar to an autistic one are more creative in a sense.

And don't worry about it. Sometimes I can't find the right words to describe some things, so no harm done. ;\)
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"A man chooses, a slave obeys." - Andrew Ryan of Ryan Industries (Bioshock)

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#5427 - 03/12/08 08:40 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: DistroyA]
TheMask Offline
member


Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 130
Yes, i know a guy over the internet with Borderline/Bipolar syndrome and he also has periods where he is very creative with things apparently due to the condition.
Hes also very intelligent and smart, i think its a bit due to the disease. The depression of it causes you to be a bit more realistic.

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#5428 - 03/12/08 08:42 PM Re: I seem to attract the mentally unstable. [Re: Belial 666]
DistroyA Offline
member


Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 478
Loc: Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, UK
 Originally Posted By: Belial 666
It's of my opinion that they seem to latch on to whomever appears to have any sence of direction in life in hopes of some of it rubbing off on themselves. They seem to share in the delusion that intelligence, security & stability is something to be caught like the flu rather than manifested by ones own abilities & mental development.

Most of these women have one thing in common - they've all experienced abuse in the past (be it by other persons or by thier own hand). Some put on a facade of having "thick skin" or a been there, done that attitude. They have many war stories & maybe even a few battle scars to show for these experiences yet fall flat when asked the reasons for why thier self-destructive cycle continues.


You've just described my most recent ex-girlfriend's attitude to a T.

Thanks for that. I had much entertainment from it. \:\)
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