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#149 - 09/06/07 12:24 PM Politics and the economy.
woreloque Offline
stranger


Registered: 09/03/07
Posts: 8
What is YOUR outlook for the economy in relation to the candidates for President and the effects of China on our economy?
There seems to be a parade of political appointees trying to convince that there is nothing really wrong with the domestic economy (US). Are politics truly being displaced by corporate dominance over society?

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#151 - 09/06/07 01:49 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: woreloque]
daevid777 Offline
active member


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 951
Loc: Hell's Pisshole, Texas
Yes... we are fascists.

China just seems to do a better job. As for the "tainted" imports - I am just a little skeptical on their origin.
_________________________
Where we're going, we don't need roads.

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#160 - 09/07/07 01:20 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: daevid777]
ballbreaker Offline
member


Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 134
Loc: Toronto, Canada
The issue of China and the US economy seems to be playing second fiddle to the problems of illegal immigration and the conflict in Iraq; I don't think there are any candidates ready to tackle the China Question so early, but the issue might very well come up later in the presidential race. We're only in the primaries, are we not?
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#440 - 09/18/07 02:04 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ballbreaker]
MCSA TEK Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 97
Loc: Orlando Fl USA
My thought is that the economy is diseased, or very soon will be.

The china thing, and any other media extravaganzas are only there to distract us from the theft going on around us. Most factories are overseas and the middle class is dying at an alarming rate. The banks are in desperate trouble and home foreclosures are epidemic.

No president can fix this. This was done by design in order to force a change. A new AmeriKa with a new curacy, an uneducated, transient workforce, and an enforcement force.

On the old board I had a link to one of Bushes "state of the union" addresses in which he talked about forming a "volunteer" army of indentured workers that would be sent to foreign countries to rebuild and provide support.

Now, several years later, that statement makes sense. When the dollar becomes worthless and the economy collapses, service industry jobs will disappear. The masses of unemployed people will find this volunteer slavery to be a godsend.

Schools graduating illiterate students only makes sense if you never intended for them to do more than push a shovel. I am completely convinced that this has been planned for a very long time.

Chris

My vote will be for Ron Paul. Although he cant win.
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#4424 - 02/21/08 01:46 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: MCSA TEK]
woreloque Offline
stranger


Registered: 09/03/07
Posts: 8
"On the old board I had a link to one of Bushes "state of the union" addresses in which he talked about forming a "volunteer" army of indentured workers that would be sent to foreign countries to rebuild and provide support.
Now, several years later, that statement makes sense. When the dollar becomes worthless and the economy collapses, service industry jobs will disappear. The masses of unemployed people will find this volunteer slavery to be a godsend."

The above reminds me of stories of the Depression Era with the Civilian Conservation Corps: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Conservation_Corps
This may be a case of history repeating itself this time on a global scale.

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#4589 - 02/27/08 04:10 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: MCSA TEK]
Jeseth Offline
pledge


Registered: 02/24/08
Posts: 91
Loc: California
 Originally Posted By: MCSA TEK
My vote will be for Ron Paul. Although he cant win.

I also voted for Ron Paul in the primaries, but was very disappointed to see how poorly he did overall. He is one of the only candidates with a realistic approach to economics, and his Libertarian views are as close to Satanic as you can get.

I think the economy will recover if a Democrat takes office. If John McCain takes office, we can pretty much kiss our economy goodbye. A continued war in Iraq (regardless of the rationalization behind it) will drain our nation's resources and leave all but the richest Americans in precarious financial situations. There are no if, ands, or buts about it.

_________________________
"Life is of no value but as it brings us gratifications."
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#4868 - 03/06/08 09:20 AM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: Jeseth]
LUCIFERIFIC Offline
active member


Registered: 02/01/08
Posts: 629
Loc: CA
 Originally Posted By: Jeseth
 Originally Posted By: MCSA TEK
My vote will be for Ron Paul. Although he cant win.

I also voted for Ron Paul in the primaries, but was very disappointed to see how poorly he did overall. He is one of the only candidates with a realistic approach to economics, and his Libertarian views are as close to Satanic as you can get.

I think the economy will recover if a Democrat takes office. If John McCain takes office, we can pretty much kiss our economy goodbye. A continued war in Iraq (regardless of the rationalization behind it) will drain our nation's resources and leave all but the richest Americans in precarious financial situations. There are no if, ands, or buts about it.



I agree with you Jes, but there is no way the ''stablishment'' will let Ron Paul be prez. The guy wants to get rid of taxes?

I think in my opinion that large corporations have always had a large influence on the government thru lobbies, and thru senators and congressmen that own large shares and stock in these corporations. I'm not saying its a conspiracy thoe.

As for China, they're kicking our asses. in 10 years they will have a bigger and better highway system; anybody who has money is putting it into chinese corporations; we're borrowing millions from them daily to fund this war. It seems that as China grows more, we (USA) all going to hell in a hand basket.

I'm learning Chinese.
_________________________
Lux Ex Tenebris
Lux Lucet Ex Orientis


~~352~~


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#7188 - 04/04/08 04:10 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: LUCIFERIFIC]
JakeShill Offline
lurker


Registered: 04/04/08
Posts: 2
Loc: New York City, Connecticut
It is appearing to me that the economy is in worse condition then I thought it was. a few months ago I was in favor of Obama, and Hillary, until I notist that there voting record in congress was the exact opposit of what they were saying in there campaigns. MaCane I think will be another Bush. So it looks like I'll be voting for Ralph Nader.
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#7191 - 04/04/08 04:49 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: JakeShill]
LUCIFERIFIC Offline
active member


Registered: 02/01/08
Posts: 629
Loc: CA
 Originally Posted By: JakeShill
So it looks like I'll be voting for Ralph Nader.


Ralph Nader!? You mean the Green party?
Thats like pushing an elephant that doesn't want to move up hill. It's a waste of energy to contribute to a cause or anything that will obviously not have any real affect in the real world.

Its more productive to pick either, Obama, Hilary, or McCain based on points of commonality and agreements you share with them.

Ralph Nader, lol, you might as well vote for Ron Paul or Ross Perot. Maybe in a decade, when our world has gone to shit and the mob begins to see things in a Green way your vote for nader will be productive; but not now.

Just don't vote for Hilary please. The last thing we need in the oval office is a post-menopausal lady who was weak enough to take her husband back for cheating...

I mean, what if Bin Laden came to President Hilary one day 2 years from now and said - 'hay Hilary, you know those two towers, sorry about that, i was just thinking about it, i feel like an idiot, friend?'

K


Edited by LUCIFERIFIC (04/04/08 04:50 PM)
_________________________
Lux Ex Tenebris
Lux Lucet Ex Orientis


~~352~~


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#8026 - 04/20/08 03:00 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: LUCIFERIFIC]
Cipher Highwind Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/17/08
Posts: 7
China is not participating in free trade, instead manipulating its currency, subsidizing exporters, and generally engaging in unfair trade practices. The US, on the other hand, deserves what it gets for remaining inside the WTO, NAFTA, and GATT.

This freshman engineering student has had to do multi-continental networking since he does not want to be taxed to death to finance all these welfare-state entitlements...no way I will be denied a return on my investment of tuition, and time.

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#8031 - 04/20/08 09:20 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: Cipher Highwind]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Quote:
The last thing we need in the oval office is a post-menopausal lady


What exactly does 'post menopausal' have to do with anything?

 Quote:
I mean, what if Bin Laden came to President Hilary one day 2 years from now and said - 'hay Hilary, you know those two towers, sorry about that, i was just thinking about it, i feel like an idiot, friend?'


Oh please, that's the most ridiculous piece of propergander I've ever heard.

It looks to me, like Hilary not leaving Bill was a very smart move. She didn't let her emotions get in the way of her goals. If you think it was a weak move to keep her marriage together after infidelity, then you really have no idea of how tough marriage really is.


Zeph


Edited by ZephyrGirl (04/20/08 09:24 PM)
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8399 - 05/05/08 07:05 AM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
SatanicCSG Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 11
Loc: Staten Island, NY
I voted for Ron Paul in the primaries. He's the only candidate that seems to have a grasp of what the true problems are. I'm a registered Republican, but ashamed of the party the last few elections. I'm more of a Constitutionalist than a Neo-con. It'll pain me to have to vote for McCain but he's still better than the other options.

As far as Hillary, it's a matter of self respect. You forget, her husband did this more than once. I'm married and you know what? Marriage is what you make it. If someone's marriage is tough, then deal with it or get a divorce. I will never have respect for infidelity and it's pathetic to make excuses for it. If someone can't handle the rigors of what a marriage entails, don't do it! End of story.

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#8414 - 05/05/08 09:04 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: SatanicCSG]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
I don't forget that her husband did this more than once. Who is to say what Hilary is willing to turn a blind eye to? It is after all HER marriage. And whilst I too, do not except infidelity within my relationships, it isn't exactly a pre-requisite of marriage. Each to their own.

Her choosing to keep the marriage going, has enabled her to be running for Presidant. It would take an aweful lot to convince me that she would still be where she is politically if they were divorced. And I actually think that BC will make a great First Gentlemen (if that's not the term you know what I mean).

Lets face it, he is charismatic and charming, two of the most important character needs of the First Spouse.

I'm not saying that I think Hilary should be president, so don't misunderstand this post either. But I think it's wrong of you to assume that she doesn't have self respect because she choose to continue with her marriage instead of divorcing.

I also disagree with your remark about not getting married if you can't handle the rigors of what it entails.

Why not? I think marriage and divorce like any other happiness or hurdle in life are learning experiences. There is a time to grow and a time to go and they will be completely different for each person on this earth.

You black and white views my be right for you, but they are not going to be right for everyone.

Zeph
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8416 - 05/05/08 10:02 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: LUCIFERIFIC]
PigFeeder Offline
member


Registered: 03/17/08
Posts: 294
Loc: Near Montreal, QC
 Originally Posted By: LUCIFERIFIC

I'm learning Chinese.


Looks like I've gotten a bit of a headstart. ;D

But in all seriousness I regret the fact that I have to say, I don't know who to vote for. I haven't had much time for politics lately but what I have been seeing, hasn't been so good.

I have however, been paying attention to what some of the OTHER countries have been doing. China has been doing amazing given the improvement seen in such a short time. There nation is doing quite well and I'm find myself curious to see what lies in it's future. There social structure and general attitude, and as well technological advances will I'm sure, be something of awe soon enough. Considering the fact that China was a country we as a "higher class" nation laughed at for the longest time, I find it ironic in the least that we are the ones digging our own holes, whilst China sits aside, grows, and laughs at us. I don't know about you guys, but I am definetly teaching my children Chinese.

I see catastrophe; and China being a country coming out on top. But I'm also interested in seeing how there immense population will play a role in there developement and there future. I'm guessing it could either make them or break them. I guess we will see.

~~Snow~~.
_________________________
For all murderers, I am the leader.
Forever, Rob, The 49 PigFeeder.
NecroMantic Sin.

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#8417 - 05/05/08 10:03 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
SatanicCSG Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 11
Loc: Staten Island, NY
I don't see any correlation between getting married and accepting infidelity because the marriage isn't where it's meant to be. That's just a cop out. My point about not being able to handle the rigors of marriage is clearly pointing to infidelity. Why even get married then if it's something that's beyond one's capacity? It seems unnecessary. If people used their common sense more, then perhaps these incidents wouldn't occur as much. It took me 31 years to finally decide to get married and I was wise enough to wait until I knew it was the appropriate time and I had most of my capricious behavior out of me. Perhaps people shouldn't make such irrational decisions just to be accepted by societies norms.

Hillary, on the other hand, lacks that common sense. It's apparent in her political stand and her personal choices. I wouldn't want to spend my life with someone who would constantly put me in a position to make such choices. It's apparent she has only one thing on her mind and if that is enough to forsake her decency, then she isn't someone I'd want running my country.

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#8422 - 05/06/08 01:23 AM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: SatanicCSG]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Quote:
Why even get married then if it's something that's beyond one's capacity? It seems unnecessary.


Can you honestly tell me that you can't see any benefit to a man that has the propensity to be unfaithful, in getting married? Marriage provides huge benefits to men. The nubmer one being that married men live longer even if they are in a bad or unhappy marriage.

What you want isn't in question. But saying what you want is what she wants is guesswork at best.

Why does forgiving someone their infidelity mean that you have foresaken your decency? Moving forward with a marriage after infidelity is alot harder and takes more work and dedication then simply getting a divorce.

IMO,

Zeph
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8450 - 05/06/08 11:04 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
fakepropht Moderator Offline
Big Slick
active member


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 990
Loc: Texas
All my opinion of course....

It was a marriage of convenience. Both had early political aspirations. He was the charismatic, leadership type. She was the ride the coat tails, woman in charge in the closet type. She fed him agenda, he pushed it through with his charm and charisma. It's a marriage on paper only. Even their kid shills for them(her). This marriage was nothing more than each person seeing the bigger picture and grasping at political gain. No wonder Bill had to go outside the marriage for a little nookie. Seriously, she is as cold as ice. Besides, how could you, as a man, get turned on having those cow ankles wrapped around your head while "making the beast"? Ack. I have never logged a vote for a Clinton, and I never will.

If you as an American feel China is ahead of us in the game politically, well then by all means cast your vote for Hillary. You will see Socialism applied to our political process. Enjoy smoking, drinking, owning a gun, eating a Big Mac? Not on Hillary's watch. Like a little sodium in your food? Her socialized health care program would penalize those that aren't in perfect health and partake of only the strictest of health regimens. After all, we the people pay for you to eat that artery clogging Big Mac, or own that gun. Which statiscally is used in crimes against known persons more so than against total strangers. So when you need to get some meds for your high cholestoral, there will be no co-pay. It all comes out of your back pocket. They will run a list of all registered gun owners and jack up policy rates for them. The list will go on.
_________________________
Beer, the reason I get up every afternoon.

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#8461 - 05/07/08 07:06 AM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
SatanicCSG Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 11
Loc: Staten Island, NY
 Originally Posted By: ZephyrGirl
Can you honestly tell me that you can't see any benefit to a man that has the propensity to be unfaithful, in getting married? Marriage provides huge benefits to men. The nubmer one being that married men live longer even if they are in a bad or unhappy marriage.

What you want isn't in question. But saying what you want is what she wants is guesswork at best.

Why does forgiving someone their infidelity mean that you have foresaken your decency? Moving forward with a marriage after infidelity is alot harder and takes more work and dedication then simply getting a divorce.

IMO,

Zeph


I do see the benefits of marriage leaning more towards the masculine side. One would have to be blind not to. My problem is that I find it immoral and pointless...in my opinion of course. I guess I'm more conservative when it comes to marriage and think that one should always be faithful no matter what the circumstances and without laying justification for deviance.

As far as forgiveness, I am not an easily forgiving person. So I just can't see how someone would want to be a part of something so untrusting. Some people say forgiveness makes a marriage stronger. I say having to forgive something so drastic as infidelity makes the marriage weaker. Someone is losing out as result of the situation and to me it's just unnecessary.

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#8462 - 05/07/08 07:23 AM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: SatanicCSG]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
To be honest SatanicCSG, the only reason I even made a comment in this thread, was because I couldn't ignore the terrible reasons Luciferific gave for not voting for Hilary. I didn't think they had any place in a realistic and intelligent political discussion and were just trying to push peoples buttons. I much prefer FakePropht's, whether I agree with them or not, at least they are serious points, not just attacking someone for their life stage and marriage.

I'm not an easily forgiving person either, but I have seen for a few years now, that that actually might be to my detriment. I guess I'm trying to look at everything from as many different perspectives as possible and question my usual responses to ethical questions. After all, it's all about questioning or inner status quo, no?

Zeph
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8463 - 05/07/08 12:14 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: ZephyrGirl]
SatanicCSG Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 11
Loc: Staten Island, NY
 Originally Posted By: ZephyrGirl
To be honest SatanicCSG, the only reason I even made a comment in this thread, was because I couldn't ignore the terrible reasons Luciferific gave for not voting for Hilary. I didn't think they had any place in a realistic and intelligent political discussion and were just trying to push peoples buttons. I much prefer FakePropht's, whether I agree with them or not, at least they are serious points, not just attacking someone for their life stage and marriage.

I'm not an easily forgiving person either, but I have seen for a few years now, that that actually might be to my detriment. I guess I'm trying to look at everything from as many different perspectives as possible and question my usual responses to ethical questions. After all, it's all about questioning or inner status quo, no?

Zeph


I always question my inner status quo. There won't be much improvement if one is always content with mediocrity. \:\)

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#8491 - 05/07/08 10:16 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: SatanicCSG]
PigFeeder Offline
member


Registered: 03/17/08
Posts: 294
Loc: Near Montreal, QC
Commitment issues? How long it takes someone to get marries has no relation as to how well the marriage will actually turn out. I don't favour Hilary but no one is perfect. Everyone makes mistakes, it just happens that humans in generla have nothing better to do then publisize the mistakes of this person..

~~Snow~~.
_________________________
For all murderers, I am the leader.
Forever, Rob, The 49 PigFeeder.
NecroMantic Sin.

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#8518 - 05/08/08 06:46 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: woreloque]
Xaulamyn Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/03/08
Posts: 32
Loc: Indiana
So, you guys are mooning over the glorious accomplishments of the Chinese? What accomplishments? I don't see any. All I see is a third-world Communist, totalitarian dictatorship and regime being perpetuated by the dead "legacy" of Mao Zedong. I suggest you guys actually research what China actually IS and HAS, and juxtapose that against what the United States really IS and HAS. Once you do that, then you'll find out that China doesn't even make a freckle on the United States' ass. China is in the Dark Ages compared to the United States, as are most countries. Is our economy perfect? No. Is the Chinese economy perfect? Definitely not! They don't even have an economy once you compare ours to theirs. When I look at China, I see nothing but an example of everything that shouldn't be done.

Like most States like that, the only reason that they've been able to perpetuate themselves this long and continue to function is because they're able to loot, mooch, blackmail, extort, pirate, commit trafficking, and just generally operate on a State-mafia level. All would have to be done is to no longer allow China and those types to continue to commit these crimes. "Evil" cannot exist unless you let it. We need to simply not allow it to exist. Every time we "help" these people it's nothing except handing our guns to our enemies and disarming ourselves.

For us, what we need is a complete separation of State and economy, and any other talk except that is simply superficial and a waste of time. We need an end to welfare, an end to mandatory taxes, an end to redistribution of the wealth, an end to Social Security, and so on. The Judaic-Christian twin of "Democracy" must be thoroughly eradicated, along with its symptoms of which are signs of this deadly, terminal disease. No more being our brothers' keepers, no more egalitarianism, no more altruism, and no more "for the sake of the common good." Traditions must cease, skepticism must die, "morals" must desist, and socialisms, collectivizations, and also any forms of totalitarianisms and all the rest must be vanquished. The non-essential, inconsequential, and completely worthless and useless hairsplittings and "Big Thinks" and triangulations known as the liberalisms in all of its forms, conservatisms, neo-conservatisms, and all the rest of the day-to-day politics, affiliations, and dross ideologies of make-believing distractions must become foregone.

The biggest problem with the United States is that it isn't Capitalist, despite the claims to the contrary. It isn't Capitalist. To claim otherwise is simply to claim ignorance or simply the use of lies. We have a mixed economy, not a Capitalist one. It's simply socialism and a faint "glimmer" of "capitalism", not Capitalism. It's just simply socialism with window-dressing.

We need a truly free market.

You know, as long as people keep trying to "fix" things by introducing more of the same, which would be more socialism, and more government, then it's only going to break more and more. Take health care for example, there used to be a time when health care in the United States was perfectly fine. What happened? More socialism and more government, that's what happened. Health care used to be a free market commodity, and was available in the exact same way that food and clothes are available today. It was a "problem" that didn't need "fixed."

Everything needs to be privatized, except the military, law enforcement, and the courts (everything else is ejected).

All I feel like saying at the moment about that.

Oh, except this - that the only purpose for government is to protect its citizens from physical force, and the initiation of physical force. The government has NO OTHER purpose - period.

Read this (a bit dated of an article now, but still just as applicable): http://www.forbes.com/2008/02/14/yaron-economy-regulation-oped-cx_ybr_0214yaron.html

Now, you might also want to take note that China is the ultimate evolution of government intervention (in all aspects of life, not just economic), and it's the path we slowly progress toward. We need to be going in the OPPOSITE direction.

Now, on illegal immigration. There should be no such thing as "illegal" immigration in the first place. Everyone should be allowed to freely come into the United States as fast as possible and limitlessly, and we need to make it easier, faster, and more accessible for them to do so. They do, of course, need to know English and all of that, however. The only exceptions for people - reasons why they would be denied immigration, besides not knowing English, would be if they carry a disease or if they've been convicted of a crime, and also there must be an exclusion of terrorists. Anyone who tries to sneak across the border and evade the simple process of learning English and getting a background check and tested for disease must be executed on the spot the moment their foot crosses the border, in order to protect the United States and its citizens from such persons.

The more immigration we have then the more people that we have, and the more people that we have the more production that we have, and the more production that we have, then the more the standards of living go up.

And now, concerning the Clintons.

The first thing I'd like to recommend you all read is No One Left To Lie To: The Values of the Worst Family by Christopher Hitchens. It's the only look at the Clintons that one need.

In any case. Bill Clinton - what is he? A liar and a rapist, for starters. A disbarred lawyer. A pardoner of radical terrorists who killed innocent people. An all-around career criminal, political opportunist, confidence man, huckster, and a man of no conscious, no inner voice, no personality, of no consequence, and someone who has never had anything good to offer either in terms of ideas or in contributions. Everything he and his wife touches turns to shit. They have the shit touch. His wife is his partner-in-crime, his female Himmler. Everything she says is a lie, everything she says after that lie contradicts that lie, and so on, she's a master orchestrator of everything Orwellian, fraudulent, and disgusting. She's just a plain nasty person. This woman must be stopped from becoming President at all costs - even if it means putting Barack Obama in office, which would still be fairly bad, but not as bad.






Edited by Xaulamyn (05/08/08 06:58 PM)
_________________________
Xaulamyn A'Baddruh

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#8559 - 05/09/08 08:09 PM Re: Politics and the economy. [Re: Xaulamyn]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
Once again, why did you change and your name, and where is your 352 number bit.

Its kinda silly we all know who your are and your pathic games are sad. One of these days someone is going to knock on your door and ask you to stop being such an asshole.....

Your school project should be over by now. Unless you failed the class and have to take it over again..

Besides, from your writings your not even american born, and your parents dont even speak english clearly.

America was founded by outlaws, prostuitues, religious zelots, and other criminals who had nothing to lose. It was a place to go for those who had nothing else to lose. American could make you rich or kill you in the process. In 300 years nothing has changed.

China and other countries have a longer history and tradition. To downplay their accomplishments since ww2 is stupid. At this point, you just look stupid with your one thin view of what is going on in the world and this country today.

M
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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