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#21977 - 03/13/09 04:37 PM Re: The political illusion [Re: Kenny Lane]
Happy Birthday Euronymous Offline
stranger


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 46
Loc: san diego, ca
You are correct we live in a society that is based on the 'illusion' of "freedom'. I would definitely say that our society is indeed fueled by mindless consumerism and policing the 'herd' into believing contrived 'truths' that is sold as 'news' but hey, this is the world we live in. As a Satanist I choose to manipulate the outer world to my advantage for the own betterment of my life.
_________________________
" And in the secret caves of my wisdom, it is known that there is no God but Me. "

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#32470 - 12/02/09 05:49 AM Re: The political illusion [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
seed Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 7
Evolutionists have stated long ago that living beings are capable of adapting to their habitats in order to survive. A group of hamsters were put into a fish tank with paper and they did paper houses, in sand they did holes. I wonder what humans will do in a couple of decades of exposure to high tech and democratic systems.
_________________________
Francis Hutchinson, An Historical Essay Concerning Witchcraft (London, 1718)

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#32474 - 12/02/09 11:50 AM Re: The political illusion [Re: seed]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
I noticed that this reply was addressed to me and upon going back and re-reading what I have said in this thread I still can't figure out what you are replying to. Yes, things adapt in order to survive. And your point is what exactly?
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No gods. No masters.

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#32475 - 12/02/09 04:11 PM Re: The political illusion [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
CJB Offline
member


Registered: 10/12/09
Posts: 125
Loc: Virginia Beach, VA
 Quote:

Evolutionists have stated long ago that living beings are capable of adapting to their habitats in order to survive. A group of hamsters were put into a fish tank with paper and they did paper houses, in sand they did holes. I wonder what humans will do in a couple of decades of exposure to high tech and democratic systems.


Well I'm not too worried about all that exposure to technology, but those crazy democratic systems...man! I'm afraid for my life what the democratic system will do to the evolution of mankind! The whole rest of the physical environment doesn't really matter nearly as much as the effect that a particular approach to politics and social structure does in and of itself!
I mean, if people start thinking about stuff, or even just have the illusion of being able to think about stuff...Jesus Christ on a pogo stick, do you realize what that would mean?
Madness! Madness everywhere! There would be people walking down the street with a three arms, four legs, and eighteen different variances of sexual reproduction organs! It would be a walking nightmare orgasm of Lovecraftian proportions!
We simply can't have that! Abolish democracy, return to feudalism, to the bygone days of aristocracy, I beg of you!

...ok, asshole mode off.

You are confusing "evolution" with something else, or mixing and matching different meanings of evolution. Hamsters making homes out of sand and paper? That's not biological evolution...that's adapting without evolution. Has nothing to do with evolution! Now if a thousand generations of hamsters all lived in a big paper pit, than they might have evolved to better be able to use paper...but a single generation does not evolve over time.
Their thoughts can evolve, in a manner of speaking! They can think of greater, better ideas, or whatever...but they themselves don't evolve. They can figure out how to live in a giant paper pit in a single generation. I wouldn't imagine that it's exceptionally hard for about any animal to go from paper to sand to grass to butthole (...we are still talking about hamsters, here) and back again. Whoever thought of that experiment has way too much time and too few good ideas.

After a few generations of modern and future technology, I'm sure humans will have evolved in some ways. Maybe we'll finally, as a species, get rid of that pinky toe. Who knows? Predicting random mutations is about as easy as picking a number between one and some twenty five thousand, and then guessing another number after that between one and N, where N=the number of mutations possible to the aforementioned guessed number.

Democracy? Nothing really to do with biological evolution.

Going with what you meant...what will humans be like after all this high tech stuff? Well, if I were to guess...I would say pretty much across the board the potential of a single human will be higher than today, but the average human will probably be fatter and lazier.
As for the democratic systems? That really depends on what kind of democratic systems...going with the ones we have now, probably pretty much the same prognosis as above.

(...not sure why I bother, other than that I feel like having a mild rant. "Posts: 1". I'll be surprised if I ever see him again...)
_________________________
~~CJ
"To say 'I love you' one must know first how to say the 'I.'"
-Ayn Rand

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#33314 - 12/28/09 05:31 AM Re: The political illusion [Re: CJB]
seed Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 7

Quote:
You are confusing "evolution" with something else, or mixing and matching different meanings of evolution. Hamsters making homes out of sand and paper? That's not biological evolution...that's adapting without evolution. Has nothing to do with evolution! Now if a thousand generations of hamsters all lived in a big paper pit, than they might have evolved to better be able to use paper...but a single generation does not evolve over time.

Response:
Excuse me, for the improper use of the term evolutionist, if I should say that the term itself has been patented by the Darwinian school of thought.

Quote:
Madness! Madness everywhere! There would be people walking down the street with a three arms, four legs, and eighteen different variances of sexual reproduction organs! It would be a walking nightmare orgasm of Lovecraftian proportions!

Response:
I guess that the perverted mind will always choose the extremes when applying their heads to anything they touch.

Quote:
I noticed that this reply was addressed to me and upon going back and re-reading what I have said in this thread I still can't figure out what you are replying to. Yes, things adapt in order to survive. And your point is what exactly?

Response:
Good thinkers have always stated that good thoughts are the product of once own capacity of brain surfing and the time invested in it. Democracy is not old enough to satisfy the requirements of a control experiment.
Humans under democracy
Since we know humans have been self-adoring creatures that divided the planet in a variety of different kingdoms with the porpoise of not adoring what they don’t like. Even in their own kingdoms they have had problems adoring the dominating males. Having such a problem, the human organization evolved (not Darwinian) in governing systems such as monarchies, communism, socialism, totalitarianism, anarchism, oligarchies, etc. With the porpoise of controlling and giving something to adore, other than themselves, to this otherwise self adoring beings.
No need to explain that democracy (in its most primitive and superficial form of the term) in contrast with the old systems substitutes the adoration of others for self adoration.
Each man under the laws of perfect competition “are allowed to achieve their dreams” I recall: That is in the primitive most superficial form of the term democracy. Healthy nutrition for self-adoring beings, but demonstrated illusive in its live application.
After a period of exposition to the aforementioned, the control group started demonstrating its side effects. Using a theoretic number of 500,000,000 individuals exposed to the condition of self-adoring-freedom produced:
A high rate of discomfort once the available positions were taken.
A drastically marked substitution of the old customs for more fancier ones. (ex. Instead of calling it slave, will call it illegal alien).
A generation of super-egos trying to live a long with who they don’t like.
An increased investment in armament and technology to control this wild herd.
An auto destructive race for the control of the machinery that supports a democracy by the different dynasties or groups inside the self adoring-freedom.
And more…
Having the leading males in the control group seen, where all this was going to lead, marked the evolution of what was the primitive most superficial form of the term democracy, into the new and bettered “illusive state of democracy”. The most modern and futuristic kingdom with all the features of old monarchies, oligopolies, and oligarchic systems; with the difference of giving the individual the sensation of been, a self-adoring being.
About humans exposed to tech and democracy, I guess the answer rest in my definition of the new state of democracy: “Illusive democracy”. Then if is illusive, or just a most comforting image of the old monarchies, oligopolies, and oligarchic systems; the result (in an overall view of all the departments of a kingdom) will be the same as in the old kingdoms presented in a more fashionable way.

Or as some individuals concept monarchies = places where you can
dispose the rats.
_________________________
Francis Hutchinson, An Historical Essay Concerning Witchcraft (London, 1718)

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#33316 - 12/28/09 10:33 AM Re: The political illusion [Re: seed]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3119
Adaptations of the envirronement for the benefits of (or by a certain) specie can in a post-darwinian view lead to certain mutations for all life-forms being influenced and/or connected to this adaptation in a broad sense. These "mutations" can be bad or good, it depends on how you look at it or how beneficial they are in time (ie, if they have a certain value for the benefit of survival in it's broadest sense).

Adaptations can on long term have an influence on the evolutionary steps of a specie (if the adaptation is long-lasting), or it can have no effect at all.
It would be wise to keep the terms "adaptation" and "evolution" seperated, a connection can be made but the specific definition of these 2 words imply a seperation. I advice you to read Darwins' work a bit more thoroughly, together with a few works of Lamarck to get an idea of the idea of evolution. Post-darwinism is a term which SHOULD be looked up concerning this issue.


To continue, humans are a specie whose brain is used in finding parallels and/or similarities and structures in it's envirronement. Various examples of this are the people who have claimed to see elvis in your nearest supermall, to see the face of Jesus on a freshly toasted sandwich, and so on.

Humans, just like other animals, are self-organising. Trough time several ways of organisation have been used, found, thrown-away, adapted... .
Democracy is yet an other (untill now) succesfull way of political and hierarchical organisation. This is, untill another ideology and way of thinking is being promoted and implemented.

As you said, "real democracy" is but an illusion. Just as there is no "real capitalism", no real "technocracy",..
A political and/or philosophical ideology all looks nice and perfect in BOOKS and on PAPER, but it is NOT and CANNOT be implemented perfectly in the REAL world.
_________________________
Ut vivat, crescat et floreat

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#33626 - 01/07/10 04:52 AM Re: The political illusion [Re: Dimitri]
seed Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 7
The fact of democracy been a political illusion resides on that primitive roar, of unintelligent and desperate people (back in the 1800’s and beginnings of the 1900’s) that wanted more than anything to solve their present state and not to achieve an ultimate governing system. Is possible to detect this same example in today’s governing period, as the government makes a reversal to that old desperate scream of individuals fighting for fixing their present state when the real solution is far from the abundant crowds and is found in lesser.
Destroying in their way everything that was positive about other systems like monarchies, is naïve and is illusive.
Democracies have made adaptations from past systems, which is positive. For example a substitution for the old and violent dethronements of the governing monarchs is elections. When people disagree with the monarch they should go and dethrone him, through voting. (Different from the past poisoning of the king, or hanging him in the middle of the town)
A consistent event in past governing systems, but omitted in the present, and is the cause of exposure to Democracy and Technology, is the modern methods of colonizing, conquering, or invading countries. This was a frequent and common reality in the past, which as history can retell was confronted in many different ways.
In the present, after exposure to new technology, the invaders have been in the need of making adaptations, like substituting the old “lets battle at the doors of the city”; for a “Trojan Horse technique” or lets conquer them from the inside out. Invaders on high exposure to Democracy have learned and perfected, by natural adaptation and by expertise, ways of substituting what was a violent upraise in the past for a more technical one. A city of 9000 citizens (woman and children included) with the majority of strong man out in a foreign mission, was able to be taken with at least 2000 armed with spades, knifes, and bows, strong man already inside; by disabling the guards first, and capturing by intimidation the woman and children. In Democracy language a city of 9000 citizens (woman and children included) with the majority of strong man out in a foreign mission, can be taken with at least 2000 armed with money, visas, and citizenships strong man already inside, by disabling the man voters first, and capturing by intimidation the woman and children.
We should look in to the past, and see in systems like the ancient Chinese Empire, where names and titles where kept but the dynasties who overruled them were moved.
_________________________
Francis Hutchinson, An Historical Essay Concerning Witchcraft (London, 1718)

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