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#25184 - 05/31/09 09:17 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: NDawg]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3887
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
 Quote:


Whatever you want to name it, God, Satan, Thor, Bast, Zeus, whatever. These names are just ritual aids to help get us into contact with our subconcious, where all these abilities are stored. The dogma is what trips people up.

This is truth on a level most never get to. Kudos.

However,

 Quote:

When you bring Satan into physical manifestation, he may not be standing there with a body all his own, but he's there. In your mind, you know that he's there.

Still, the word physical necessarily implies a level of, well, physicality not provided by even the most ardently believed delusion. I wouldn't say choosing this word is necessarily willfully deceptive on the part of the OP(or yourself), but it is misleading all the same.

I would also suggest that someone that someone that believes very strongly in a falsehood does not in fact KNOW anything by virtue of doing so.

 Quote:

I don't see them, but just because you can't see or touch it doesn't mean it isn't there.

This is the same reasoning agnostics like to use to justify their cozy little seat on jehovahs fence. In actuality, if you can not see or touch (or otherwise detect something either by human senses or other instrumentation) something, it is for all intents and purposes, nonexistent. After all, why favor one unevidenced proposition over any other?

The fact is, the little pink elephants may actually exist, but if they can't be tested for then it doesn't matter.
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#25189 - 06/01/09 12:30 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: NDawg]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
 Originally Posted By: NDawg
Other people's beliefs can affect you, even if you don't want them to. The Inquisition is a perfect example of this.


Yes, in the extreme other people's beliefs can affect you. I was referring more to the average joe. If my neighbor wants to believe in god it doesn't really affect me. Now, if they were to come over and try to force me to believe like they and were threating violence I would shoot them.


 Originally Posted By: NDawg
a wise man said absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


I too am familiar with critical thinking. However, it is also said that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

 Originally Posted By: NDawg
The burden of proof does lie with those trying to prove it, but the inverse is also true. What is your proof these entities don't exist?


Actually the inverse isn't also true. To put the burden on me to prove something I don't believe in doesn't exist is asking me to prove a universal negative.
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#25194 - 06/01/09 04:26 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Dan_Dread]
dragonballr Offline
lurker


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 2
If I am my own god then. If I choose to be satan or gave myself another name, me being a physical being would make that god or satan or other name a physical reality,correct?
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#25195 - 06/01/09 04:41 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: dragonballr]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
Of course not. You are juggling with different concepts of god. What you suggest is like when saying you are Napoleon, would it make you really Napoleon or would you end up in an asylum, even when you wear a funny hat and speak French?

The satanic own god should not be confused with assuming satanists really think they are god. That would be a laughable idea in itself. It only implies that you are the controlling force in your life responsible for your own actions and their consequences, and not some imaginary friend out there.

If you call yourself Satan, you would just be a guy calling himself Satan.

D.

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#25196 - 06/01/09 04:57 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Diavolo]
dragonballr Offline
lurker


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 2
Maybe I jumped the gun on this topic,being that this being my first time posting.thanx for your bluntness.I shall educate myself further and do better nxt time to be more relevant to the topic
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#25197 - 06/01/09 05:00 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Diavolo]
Jake999 Offline
senior member


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
 Originally Posted By: Diavolo

If you call yourself Satan, you would just be a guy calling himself Satan.

D.


AND in doing so, you would become laughable or pathetic, two things that are the very antithesis of "satanic." The only thing you could expect is less respect from anyone and scorn from those who would see it as the act of someone ignorant and/or attention seeking.
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#25203 - 06/01/09 07:02 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Jake999]
Nemesis Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2175
Loc: US
Indeed. And in times like these, those who make such claims are labeled as Jake described. Our society is much more educated and skeptic than it was, even as recently as the 60s. Aside from the nutters who still push for pro-life (what an oxymoron THAT is) policies, Creationism in schools, and this recent flap over gay marriage, our culture as a whole is very much based in the scientific frame of mind. If it's not there and can't be proven and uploaded to our Blackberry--then fuck it.

I rather like the direction our society is in/headed. It's the crazies (Muslims and Evangelicals) that tend to rise up in opposition that disturb me. All the more reason to defend what rights we have now. Lock and load.
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#25206 - 06/01/09 10:01 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Nemesis]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
I'm living two to three decades in your future and I can't say I am too pleased with how things are going at a societal level. Culture here is based upon egalitarianism and leftism, almost enforced upon us. Sure, we don't have creationism at school, Jack and Joe can marry and smoke some weed at their party but overall, even with our scientific frame of mind, the worst of 2000 years of Christianity is doing a magnificent job.

D.

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#25208 - 06/01/09 11:39 AM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Diavolo]
Nemesis Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2175
Loc: US
But do you think those trends will persist? This leftist streak rampaging through Western countries will have to end at some point. A global catastrophe, another terrorist attack, North Korea finally getting the balls to use a nuke on Seoul or Japan, something will occur that will shift attitudes more towards the right. Just as the right-wing had a stranglehold on US policy for half a dozen years, we saw it do a 180 in the elections last year. People who originally voted for the lefties will get sick of the kind of garbage they elected into office, and once again, the sands will shift to the other side. Palin 2012!

I tend to blame the spread of technology for facilitating the current state we're in, much more so than Christianity. With people able to communicate instantly across the globe (like what we're doing here ;\) ), mobilizing taskforces and meetings and discussing issues tends to bring a sense of inclusiveness to the involved parties. Someone whose pet died can get sympathy from people in London, Sydney and Lima. A concept unimaginable 20 years ago.

Culturally though, it takes something much greater than elections to shift the perspectives of entire nations. I think the egalitarianism we see today will come to a head in the next decade, after which a more moderate approach to social policies will be instated. I just don't see it going to back to how it was 50 years ago. Not unless there's a nuke holocaust and technology is wiped out.
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#25216 - 06/01/09 02:12 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Nemesis]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
No, I think the trend is stopping. It's about time after 60 years of sliding into this. Next week are European elections here and many are worried that the extremists will make it in, especially because most are anti-European to begin with. I will be worried when they don't make it in, not because I am so much in line with their party material but because extremism is what is needed to get rid of egalitarianism.

I don't think a more moderate approach is the solution. Moderate approaches generally lead nowhere, simply because humans rarely are moderate creatures. If Europe wants a future, I do think it has to gather up and start to think more imperial. But that might take a cataclysmic event.

D.

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#25294 - 06/03/09 06:22 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: Dan_Dread]
NDawg Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/05/09
Posts: 30
Loc: Da South
"This is the same reasoning agnostics like to use to justify their cozy little seat on jehovahs fence. In actuality, if you can not see or touch (or otherwise detect something either by human senses or other instrumentation) something, it is for all intents and purposes, nonexistent. After all, why favor one unevidenced proposition over any other?

The fact is, the little pink elephants may actually exist, but if they can't be tested for then it doesn't matter."

I'm actually between religions. I got out of christianity, tried to be Atheist, thought about it a while, read a few books, and now, I don't know what the fuck to believe. I figure I'll just go with whatever works for me. I'm very grateful for the e-books here, one I didn't know about, and one I've wanted to read for a few years now.

Maybe we don't have the proper equipment yet to find the little pink elephants. They might not respond to anything that we know about. But then, this is all just speculation, and I'm just talking cross-eyed badger spit based off of disjointed information. So you're right, it doesn't matter.
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#25305 - 06/03/09 11:09 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: NDawg]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1646
Loc: Orlando, FL
If you don't know what to believe- implying you don't believe in anything at the moment- that still lumps you in with the Atheist category.

You don't "try" to be an Atheist. It's not a specific lifestyle, doctrine, or system of religious devotion. If you don't believe in a God, then you're an Atheist. If you "don't know" if there's a God, then you're an Atheist too, because you can't believe in a God that you don't know (or feel you know) exists.

Nowadays Atheism is associated with the Dawkins-Hitchens school of "blast organized religion to hell and be extremely loud about it". That's anti-religion, which is associated with- but by no means inherent to- Atheism.

You don't "need" to believe in anything. Years ago when I grew disenchanted with my native Catholic beliefs, I still felt a need to "believe" in something. I toyed with the idea of Theistic Satanism for about a week before I realized it was completely unnecessary - I realized that I simply had no reason to believe in the supernatural, and that Satanic philosophy didn't need any kind of supernatural validation.

Again, great claims require great evidence. Yes, saying "there MIGHT be an invisible pink unicorn flying around in the sky" is technically a logically sound statement, since science is open to all possibilities.... But it still makes you look like an idiot for bringing up the idea in the first place.
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#25338 - 06/04/09 07:24 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: The Zebu]
NDawg Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/05/09
Posts: 30
Loc: Da South
Actually I'd say I more believe everything. Well, not quite everything, some things are too rediculous for even my mind to admit the possibility of. (Scientology or mormonism anyone?) I'm more of on a search for a belief system that I feel comfortable with. I'm toying with wicca right now, cause it validates my environmentalism and respect for life, but there are certain things I can't quite reconcile with myself. Just like Atheism. Not to say that any god created the universe, but they may have came into being afterwards. Oh, btw, nice invisible pink unicorn reference. That vid was funny as hell. Like they illustrated though, you can say the invisible pink unicorn doesn't exist all you like, but feel pretty stupid when it comes up behind you and impales you through the chest.
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#25350 - 06/04/09 09:58 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: NDawg]
miriam Offline
pledge


Registered: 03/11/09
Posts: 90
Loc: Seattle, WA
you live to be proved wrong? what you clearly need is a girlfriend with sadistic super powers my friend.

believing everything will not, on any level, help you sort out what you really think. if you continue to dabble and "toy" with belief systems that only validate you, you will be unable to have any conviction about who you are or what, if anything, you stand for. you sound agnostic. or unitarian! (snort)....

if you're really interested in environmentalism and respect for life, you might better serve such institutions by becoming vegan or vegetarian, volunteering to clean up your neighborhood or at animal shelters, and taking out your recycling.
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#25429 - 06/05/09 11:32 PM Re: Atheistic Satanism [Re: miriam]
NDawg Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/05/09
Posts: 30
Loc: Da South
I live to be proved wrong because I know that I have some serious misconceptions about a lot of things. If I am proved wrong about something, then I just gained new knowledge. And if one of my core beliefs is called into question and proved wrong, then I have to do a radical restructuring on just about my entire lifestyle. And that's always fun. At least I'm willing to admit it. And you are correct, I do need a girlfriend. Look at what I'm doing right now. It's 11:30 on a friday night and I'm discussing religion on an internet forum.

But, anyways, why would I join a belief system that I don't feel comfortable with or doesn't agree with my own personal beliefs? The way I see it, there are so many options out there and everybody who is apart of them is so convinced that they're right that it really doesn't matter a pair of fetid dingo's kidneys what you believe, so long as you're not encroaching on others right to believe what they want. I'm just trying to learn as much as possible on my way through life. Like others on this site said, so far as we know, we only get one life to live, and the only certain thing about the future is uncertainty. I'm just trying to find something that I like and I can stick with. My conviction is that I am me, I know what I view as right and wrong, and if I can't find a religion that links up, (and I know that none of them will perfectly) I may go off and start my own. Besides, most agnostics are way too...wimpy. 'We can't prove that god definitively does or does not exist, so we'll say he does. Just in case.' Screw that.

All religions are both right and wrong at the same time. It's more of a go with what you feel thing. At least I think so.

I've been trying to go vegetarian, but living in a small town like I do, you really don't get many options. Just about the only place that has a true vegetarian option is subway. And I've got a pretty good sized grudge against wallmart.
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