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#27934 - 08/05/09 02:22 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
Another case of mental illness with Satan in the role as mr. evil voice: http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/sa...9-1225757604119
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#27961 - 08/05/09 10:15 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
One liners are not tolerated on this site.

Since you have been here from 3/8/08, you should know this already.


Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#27972 - 08/06/09 04:31 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Morgan]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
Morgan, Is it just me or are your just "out to get me". No mod have deletet my post, and as far as I can see, you are not a mod. You would obvious like to be one, but you are not. Maybe it is less of a problem that I posted one onliner because I am not in the habit of making oneliners? As far as I remember I was told to make shorter contributions on my last visit. But to make you happy:

The news article is about a mentally ill boy who killed his father and tried to kill his mother. The boy was "in to Satanism", at least the media say so, but it is rather obvious IMO that he had a mental condition (he could be "into Satanism", but this is not the most obvious explanation of his actions). So it is not a case of "the Devil made me do it" but a case of "mental illness confused as Satanism because our Christain culture makes people identify antisocial audio hallucinations as the devil". In this way, I view the to story as related, and that I why I decided to share it in connection with the old story in this topic.

- Amina

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#27990 - 08/06/09 02:10 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

Actually I was going to mention it yesterday as well. You were simply told the workings of the site as you were told in your first post. Those that cannot get it after a year are not tolerated well by most.

 Originally Posted By: Amina
The news article is about a mentally ill boy who killed his father and tried to kill his mother. The boy was "in to satanism", at least the media say so, but it is rather obvious IMO that he had a mental condition (he could be "into satanism", but this is not the most obvious explanation of his actions). So it is not a case of "the Devil made me do it" but a case of "mental illness confused as satanism because our Christain culture makes people identify antisocial audio hallucinations as the devil". In this way, I view the to story as related, and that I why I decided to share it in connection with the old story in this topic.

Are we reading the same article?

“Numerous drawings, text books and exercise books full of handwritten "musings" on Satanism and the afterlife were also found, the Supreme Court heard yesterday.”

So apparently the boy wrote things on Satanism and the afterlife. This is not the media saying anything, just relaying the evidence. It is not a case of Satanism being confused with anything. The only person confused here is you.

“Counsel for the youth Andrew Haesler SC said his client had a "disease of the mind" and was suffering from schizophrenia.”

"He was not capable of reasoning the rightness or wrongness of his actions," Mr Haesler said.”


Now as far as people identifying the voices they might hear as being from god or Satan well yes that was discussed here… But that is the only thing on topic yet it is not mentioned or even hinted at in the article in question.

Where in this article does it say anything about this kid hearing voices? What connects this story other than your confused view and the words Satanism and devil being closely related? Can you understand this or are you really that blind?

~T~
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#27998 - 08/06/09 03:53 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: ta2zz]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
Are we reading the same article?
]

I read a few articles on the case, but I had the impression that more then one link would be inappropriate? But yes, we are reading the same article.

 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
So apparently the boy wrote things on Satanism and the afterlife. This is not the media saying anything, just relaying the evidence.


Maybe, maybe not. In some cases books on Satanism turn out to be books on Wicca or role paying games. But this is not the point. My point was that the media thinks his involvement or interest in Satanism (who knows if his Satanism reflected anything beyond his own imagination) is relevant to the story.

 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
does it say anything about this kid hearing voices?


Yes, the article says:
 Quote:
Psychiatric examinations revealed the boy was delusional and had - on at least three separate occasions - heard what he thought to be the devil's voice, Mr Miller said


 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
What connects this story other than your confused view and the words Satanism and devil being closely related? Can you understand this or are you really that blind?


I both cases we have mentally ill people who think they hear the voice of Satan, and why commit criminal and violent acts. In both cases the most obvious explanation IMO is mental illness, but the media chose to highlight the nature of the persons delusions. Yes, the boy wrote on Satanism, but it would also be more obvious to explain his interest in Satanism (homemade or influenced by others) as a part of his delusions. This would not be unusual for people who suffers from schizophrenia - they often mix delusion with religious ideas and what ever they pick up.

By the way - I don't see why you have to call me an idiot, just because you missed the relevant part of the article.

- Amina


Edited by Amina (08/06/09 04:10 PM)

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#28009 - 08/06/09 06:32 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

Fuck me this is what I get for posting in between the stupid questions at work. Now let us get this back on track shall we.

The last line should have read:

Where in this article does it say anything about this woman hearing voices?

The original article in this thread states nothing at all about the woman hearing voices. In fact we are told that police said she told them the devil made her do it. There is no mention of voices in the story. Unless of course you’re just looking at the picture, there we can see the writer used his journalistic license to say the devil “told” her not “made” her do it. Still the connections between the two stories are very weak. Yes they are both news, yes they both involve killing and yes the both mention the devil or Satanism, that’s about it.

One involves a mother who for reasons unknown killed her newborn the other a child who killed his parents hoping they would be better people in the afterlife.

 Originally Posted By: Amina
My point was that the media thinks his involvement or interest in satanism (who knows if his satanism reflected anything beyond his own imagination) is relevant to the story.

I know your point and while I can see it in the headline of the article you linked, the same is not the case of the original article that this post is about.

 Originally Posted By: Amina
Yes, the article says: “Psychiatric examinations revealed the boy was delusional and had - on at least three separate occasions - heard what he thought to be the devil's voice, Mr Miller said”

The fact is there was nothing said about voices in this thread until I brought them up. ;\)

 Originally Posted By: Amina
By the way - I don't see why you have to call me an idiot, just because you missed the relevant part of the article.

I rarely fall to the level of name calling. While your feeling may represent my impression, remember you said the words not me.

~T~
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#28018 - 08/06/09 09:13 PM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
I am not out to get you. You just do the things you do.
That is the second time you have said that.

If you can not tell the difference between discussions and personal attacks, you have issues.

I am not a Mod, but I am blue colored familiar. As such I am supposed to help show people sometimes the error of basic mistakes to say the very least.

It doesn't matter to me if I am a Mod or not. In the past when I had more time I was a Mod on the Satanism forum. You weren't around then so that is why you don't know any better.

Once I gave you a warning, what would be the point of having every other mod or admin telling you the same thing.

Or do you need multiple people to tell you the same thing before it sinks in?

If anything, you just show more of your weaknesses.

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#28031 - 08/07/09 01:43 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Morgan]
ceruleansteel Offline
active member


Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 784
Loc: Behind you
The only opinion I have to offer here is that although it was grotesque what she did, at least the culling she did was her own - obviously damaged - bloodline and not anyone else's. I understand the fears and the feelings of inadequacy that come with being a new mother...your emotions are crazy and you are caught between marvelling at what has sprung from you and wondering if you *really are good enough* and all that doodly doo, but to give that a classification and make it an excuse for atrocity is the part that is inexcusable.

I don't give a shit how much post-partum any of these women suffered from and I don't give a damn if the devil was redlined into their cerebrum, crazy is crazy and no baby ever did a damn thing to get murdered over. So fry the bitches and move on, keeping in mind that if she was THAT fucked up, chances are her offspring would have magnified that crazy-gene, if for no other reason than because it was raised by her.

It sucks, but better she kill her own kid than set her eyes on mine.

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#28034 - 08/07/09 03:42 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: ta2zz]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
Where in this article does it say anything about this woman hearing voices?



Eh, so in one case we have a doctor telling us that the boy said he heared a voice and believed it to be the devil, and in the other case we have someone telling the media that the women believed the devil had told or made her kill her baby? Like, maybe the devil and the women had some sort of mail correspondence going on, who knows, or maybe he just turned up and gave her sort of an evil grin, witch she translated into a command to kill - but silliness aside, don't you think (as others in the discussion obviously DID!) it is a case of mental illness including audio hallucinations or something similar? Come on, no need to be silly, unless you want to go back and call all the other contributers to the debate (including mods) who used insanity as a plausible explanations idiots to.

Or, now we are in the land of silly, I guess I also have to for ask for forgiveness to all those who believe in the devil as an actual being because of my unwillingness to include the possibility that the devil DID actually tell those people to kill.

 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
I rarely fall to the level of name calling. While your feeling may represent my impression, remember you said the words not me.


If you are unable to see why I got that impression reading your replay, I think no need to work on your writing skills and/or your interpersonal skills.

- Amina

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#28036 - 08/07/09 03:57 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: ceruleansteel]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
I understand the fears and the feelings of inadequacy that come with being a new mother...your emotions are crazy and you are caught between marvelling at what has sprung from you and wondering if you *really are good enough* and all that doodly doo, but to give that a classification and make it an excuse for atrocity is the part that is inexcusable.


You could try to think about it like this: The brain is all about chemistry, and mental illness is also also about chemistry. In case of depressions, psychosis, postpartum psychosis, schizophrenia and other mental problems, the brain chemistry has a bigger power over peoples actions then if they had taken a mind altering drug like LSD (or rather, had been given a drug without knowing or wanting it). In the same time, the "trip" is a bad one, and people can easily do something very stupid.

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
I don't give a shit how much post-partum any of these women suffered from


Would your opinion be different, if we where told that someone forced a strong mind altering drug into her body, a drug that often make people act violently and even kill there own kids?

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
chances are her offspring would have magnified that crazy-gene, if for no other reason than because it was raised by her.


That depends on what she suffered from. If it is schizophrenia, there is a big chance that her kids could have inherited it, but with the right drugs, they could live more or less normal lives.

- Amina

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#28037 - 08/07/09 04:24 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
ceruleansteel Offline
active member


Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 784
Loc: Behind you
 Quote:
You could try to think about it like this: The brain is all about chemistry, and mental illness is also also about chemistry. In case of depressions, psychosis, postpartum psychosis, schizophrenia and other mental problems, the brain chemistry has a bigger power over peoples actions then if they had taken a mind altering drug like LSD (or rather, had been given a drug without knowing or wanting it). In the same time, the "trip" is a bad one, and people can easily do something very stupid.


All that proves is that culling is - in point of fact - the appropriate answer to the question. Unless of course you would rather we deport them all to Denmark so you can hold their hands and sing "Let the Sunshine In" with them. A broken arm can be fixed. A bad heart can be fixed or even replaced. But a fucked up brain is totally different thing altogether. And while a person who loses their arm poses no additional danger to society than they did before they lost it, the person who loses their mind becomes a threat to every man, beast, and piece of property surrounding him/her. Cull the crazy bitch before she decides my kids are next.

She has already proven that she will take another human life, and the life she took was the one life in the entire world that she should instinctually die to preserve. Don't hold her hand, don't comfort her. I don't give a shit if she's not in her right mind...as far as I'm concerned, the combination of wrong mind + murder equals she has no business sharing the planet with the rest of us.


 Quote:
Would your opinion be different, if we where told that someone forced a strong mind altering drug into her body, a drug that often make people act violently and even kill there own kids?


It doesn't matter because that is not what happened. You are missing the point completely: THIS WOMAN, AND THE OTHERS LIKE HER ARE FUNDAMENTALLY FUCKED UP IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT DOESN'T MATTER IF THEY CAN TAKE A PILL OR NOT. What if they forget the pill for a day and knock off some toddlers in the park? What if they get the shits one day and can't keep the medicine in their system? I feel no sympathy for her. I only feel like she is a threat to my own children that needs to be removed. Fuck a pill, fuck counseling. CULL.


 Quote:
That depends on what she suffered from. If it is schizophrenia, there is a big chance that her kids could have inherited it, but with the right drugs, they could live more or less normal lives.


Fuck that. I don't want that shit polluting the gene pool. We have anough nonviolent crazies running around. We don't need the violent kind. It doesn't have a damn thing to do with how great THEIR lives are. Do Satanist wave flowers around in Denmark and try to spread egalitarianism and world peace? What is this shit? Really? Fuck her crazy ass, and fuck your bleeding heart hippy ass as well. Survival of the fittest includes removing the weakest of the links as soon as they become a hazard to the rest. Sometimes mother nature takes care of that for us, but more often than not we have to take matters into our own hands.

If a rabid dog is roaming your streets do you take it in and feed it or do you shoot the fucker? I don't give a shit that she walks on two legs and speaks my language. She is a rabid dog.

Cull.

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#28038 - 08/07/09 04:35 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

 Originally Posted By: Amina
Eh, so in one case we have a doctor telling us that the boy said he heared a voice and believed it to be the devil, and in the other case we have someone telling the media that the women believed the devil had told or made her kill her baby?

Still grasping at straws trying to prove a link between the two articles I see.

 Originally Posted By: Amina
Like, maybe the devil and the women had some sort of mail correspondence going on, who knows, or maybe he just turned up and gave her sort of an evil grin, witch she translated into a command to kill - but silliness aside, don't you think (as others in the discussion obviously DID!) it is a case of mental illness including audio hallucinations or something similar?

Really? You really did ask me this after you read my last post? If you read my last post and were able to comprehend any of this thread you would see I was the one who brought it up. Hearing a voice that is.

 Originally Posted By: Amina
Come on, no need to be silly, unless you want to go back and call all the other contributers to the debate (including mods) who used insanity as a plausible explanations idiots to.

Why would I ever call myself an idiot. Do you read anything or just write things you think might fit in?

Remember we are talking about a damaged mind here not a rational human. ~ta2zz

 Originally Posted By: Amina
Or, now we are in the land of silly, I guess I also have to for ask for forgiveness to all those who believe in the devil as an actual being because of my unwillingness to include the possibility that the devil DID actually tell those people to kill.

Maybe she had a feeling, maybe after having done the deed her mind could not fathom that anything besides Satan could make her do this. Maybe she was just hungry.

 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
If you are unable to see why I got that impression reading your replay, I think no need to work on your writing skills and/or your interpersonal skills.

Again I understand why you got the impression as it does reflect my feelings towards you. I never called you an idiot though the words themselves come from you.

Good day

~T~

EDIT: You have a fascination with the Moderator title don't you.


Edited by ta2zz (08/07/09 04:37 AM)
Edit Reason: Marked
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#28039 - 08/07/09 04:52 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: ceruleansteel]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
All that proves is that culling is - in point of fact - the appropriate answer to the question. Unless of course you would rather we deport them all to Denmark so you can hold their hands and sing "Let the Sunshine In" with them.


Eh, in the case of mental illness we usually use drugs, not sunshine and singing. It helps rather well on schizophrenia and related illnesses, and most people how have suffered a mental illness (that would be 1/6 of the population or something like that, if we include stress and depression!) live normal lives contribution to society and paying taxes. When society has used 18 years to educate and feed a person, killing the person is not the most economical solution, unless the person is not able to contribute to society in any what what so ever.

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
A broken arm can be fixed. A bad heart can be fixed or even replaced. But a fucked up brain is totally different thing altogether.


Why? In some cases yes, but in other cases drugs can be used. This in IMO not really different then people who have to eat hart medication for years. Brains are part of the body, not some special container for the soul.

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
And while a person who loses their arm poses no additional danger to society than they did before they lost it, the person who loses their mind becomes a threat to every man, beast, and piece of property surrounding him/her. Cull the crazy bitch before she decides my kids are next.


If she suffered from postpartum psychosis as sugested, her psychosis will not be a chronic condition. Also, one would not expect her to go on any kind of killing spree. Those who suffers from postpartum psychosis are a danger to themselves and there kinds, but not to the general public. Depressive people also commits murder, but that usually only kill themselves or if they kill others they usually kill there own family - so they are much less of a danger to the general public then those who commit murder on purpose.

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
I only feel like she is a threat to my own children that needs to be removed. Fuck a pill, fuck counseling. CULL.


If culling was my first chose of action to defend my kids, I would be culling other more obvious sources of danger like drug dealers, those who sell and produce unhealthy food and cigarettes etc.

 Originally Posted By: ceruleansteel
Do Satanist wave flowers around in Denmark and try to spread egalitarianism and world peace?


No, but we do not have the death sentense in denmark, plus a rather clear reculation of the Nazi death camps because we got invated by the germans. They also culled mantally ill people and sterilized criminals and women who had too sex outside marriage, because they believed criminality and lack of morals to be hereditary.

On this issue I think I am most biased because of my education in the field of psychology. I don't view mental illness a so different from somatic illness - but that is just me and psychology at large sharing this opinion.

- Amina

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#28040 - 08/07/09 05:08 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: ta2zz]
Amina Offline
member


Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 177
Loc: Denmark
 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
Really? You really did ask me this after you read my last post? If you read my last post and were able to comprehend any of this thread you would see I was the one who brought it up. Hearing a voice that is.


In my original post of the link I explained it as "Another case of mental illness with Satan in the role as mr. evil voice".

Listen, maybe you feel rather original because of your suggestion about a voice, but I am unable to see how this can be so original. Maybe I am the only one who have studied schizophrenia and related illnesses, or who have read about other similar cases of people acting insane because of insanity, but your suggestion is more or less obvious unless we are to believe the woman is making things up or had a mail correspondence we the Devil himself.

 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
Maybe she had a feeling, maybe after having done the deed her mind could not fathom that anything besides Satan could make her do this. Maybe she was just hungry.


Sure. I am sorry, but I don't think the police and/or people schooled in psychology would view hunger as the most obvious explanations, or expect a mentally healthy woman to eat her kid. Maybe the explanation about satan came up later on but I have some problem with this theory: 1) Something motivated her in the first place. If not voices something else - and hunger is not a sane explanation. 2) In other cases of schizophrenia and psychosis it have been seen on numeroul occasions that people actually belive ther hear voices etc. It is not an explanation they make up after they have commited a crime. I could go on.

I think this is getting too silly, so I guess I will leave this discussion to you.

- Amina

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#28041 - 08/07/09 05:12 AM Re: Why a Texas woman mutilated and ate her baby [Re: Amina]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
"If culling was my first chose of action to defend my kids, I would be culling other more obvious sources of danger like drug dealers, those who sell and produce unhealthy food and cigarettes etc."

So you think its fine to cull people who produce various foods and cigarettes that you don't like?

How high minded of you to make such a judgement call for all people. Taking away their right to choose.

So what, the Germans culled people from Denmark. The winners always write history.

No, it is just you.
Modern psychology does not share your views.
Modern medicine does not share your views.
Modern law does not share your views.
Satanism certainly does not share your views.

Some people need to be culled, the more the merrier.

Morgan

ps. sorry i didnt talk about more dead babies to put it back on topic


Edited by Morgan (08/07/09 05:13 AM)
Edit Reason: ps added
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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