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#3195 - 01/07/08 06:00 PM trying to find balance
L Fern Tej Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 65
Loc: Las Vegas, NV. (u.s.)
I've just recently began exploring the satanic philosophies after i was intrigued by Anton LaVey's "Satanic Bible".
but one thing i don't quite grasp is the fact that Satanism revolves around darkness and the occult.
so why does the Baphomet of Mendez portray the balanced equality between good and evil (darkness and light)?
why not embrace all aspects of life rather than just those portrayed by an effigy of Satan?
i've tried searching for an article explaining this matter but none quite answer my questions, maybe you all could help me better understand?

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#3203 - 01/08/08 02:23 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
Asmedious Moderator Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 1737
Loc: New York
 Quote:
I've just recently began exploring the satanic philosophies after i was intrigued by Anton LaVey's "Satanic Bible".
but one thing i don't quite grasp is the fact that Satanism revolves around darkness and the occult.


This is just my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt.


The best explanation that I have heard, which I agree with as well, came from a high ranking official from the Church of Satan, during an interview. He said that, “We are basically Atheists, with a flair for the dramatic.”

I enjoy entertainment, and having fun. To me, the darkside is fun and entertaining. I love Halloween for that reason.

Remember, that the actual definition of “Occult” is that which is not seen, or that which is hidden.
Often times, reality (as best as we humans can understand it) is hidden from us, by those who wish to push their own agenda, such as religious organizations, governments, and even our family and friends.
Therefore, we search for things that are not seen by the average person (sheep). Our philosophy might also be considered occult, but not because of any secret dark knowledge, but because many people wish to keep it hidden, because they fear reality, and the way said reality might challenge their power, world view, and social standing. That is the occult part.

The dramatic part comes in, that yes, we do at times, like to act the part of the dark mysterious one. This might be done by the way that we chose to dress, or express ourselves. However, the more enlightened ones, know that we are simply acting, and portraying the type of character which is expected of us. We do this, because it is FUN, and entertains us.
There are those also, usually new initiates, the ones who have just discovered our philosophy, who for awhile (hopefully only for a while), believe and convince themselves, that they really are the dark mysterious character whom they portray. For most, this gets old after awhile, and they start to truly study and analyze themselves objectively, eventually becoming mature Satanists, and not just caricatures of Satanists.

 Quote:
so why does the Baphomet of Mendez portray the balanced equality between good and evil (darkness and light)?


To get the best answer, you would have to ask the person who designed that symbol, what they meant by it.

However, I will take a stab at a possible explanation.

Human beings in general, find the most harmony in their lives, when most things in it are balanced.
For instance, if we work too much, and play too little, we become like robots. We forget how to live, and how to enjoy what we are working for.
A good example is the business man, who works eighty hours a week, and when he goes out to dinner with his wife, all he can talk about is his job, and how difficult it is, yet he can’t enjoy said wifes beauty, or even a good glass of wine. When the wife leaves him for someone else, because she craves attention and adoration, he convinces himself, that she is an ungrateful wench. (Sometimes he might be right lol)

On the other hand, if we play too much, without being productive in some way, we become shallow clowns, who lose the sense of reality. Take a look at some of the celebrities who are constantly in the tabloids for a good example. They produce nothing of value, have no talent, but have enough money to play all the time. They create drama, where it does not exist. They get bored and turn to drugs, or some self destructive behaviors. They are in and out of rehab, or jail.

This doesn’t only apply to celebrities. As a matter of fact, the children of the earlier mentioned business man, who hardly ever see their father, but have all the “toys” money can buy, will often fall victim to the same types of scenario.

Lack of balance, also shows in many athletic types of individuals as well. The image of the typical highschool or college athlete comes to mind.
They may be in great shape physically, yet lack any real social skills, and even less cognitive (brain power) skills.
On the flip side, is the typical highschool or college “dork/nerd.” They find their value in how smart they are, and the high grades they get, but physically they are pale skinned little weaklings, and they too lack social skills, and real life experience.

If these people don’t strive for some balance, then often they end up unhappy. The nerd becomes withdrawn, and might find their reality in video games, while the athlete in time becomes a couch potato, who even in middle age, still bores his friends to tears, with stories of his “glory days.”

Another example, and I’ll make this the last one, because I could go on typing all day, is the “Class clown,” v.s “The oh so serious bore.”
It is well known, that most “class clowns,” who spend most of their times trying to make everyone laugh, are some of the saddest people in reality.

The “Serious bore,” who takes life so seriously, that they can’t laugh even at an old lady farting in church, eventually ends up pushing people away with their boring attitude.

If you sit down and think about, the truly “Self Actualized” (do a search on that term, it could save your sanity), or the truly content individuals, are those, who can find balance in their lives.

Too much of anything, is rarely satisfying, while too little is also rarely satisfying.

Also, if one does not have balance in their lives, they might very well find, that life will attempt to find the balance for them, which often times shows its face in what many might consider, negative ways.

For example, the powerful person, who controls many others, during his daily life, might have a fetish for being dominated. He will pay people, to put collars on him, spank him, and put him down verbally, as he eats out of a dog dish. This is natures way of finding this type of person balance.

The male who feels impotent, or sexually lacking, might find himself dreaming about, or going as far as actually raping women, but not with his limp genitals, but instead with a hard, or sharp object, which might give him the psychological and even physical sense of sexual release. Again, natures way of finding balance.






_________________________
"The first order of government is the protection of its citizens right to be left alone."

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#3208 - 01/08/08 04:09 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Asmedious]
L Fern Tej Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 65
Loc: Las Vegas, NV. (u.s.)
hmmm, i must say i am quite content with that answer.
thank you asmedious.
and for the record i would love nothing more than to ask Eliphas Levi himself about the baphomet.
but unfortuanetly he's 100 year old soil food :\
once again thank you for the helpful and lengthy answer.

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#3218 - 01/08/08 10:36 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
Euronymous Offline
stranger


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 46
Loc: san diego, ca
Satanism revolves around You; period. If your into the occult, cool; that's your bag. I don't know where you got the idea that Satanism revolves around "darkness". The sigil of Baphomet does not portray the balance between "good" and "evil". Those are clearly subjective according to one's perception. The Sigil of Baphomet portrays the "duality of nature" symbolized by the two horns of Mendes. You should know this. I suggest doing more research before you decide to post something you don't have much knowledge about.
_________________________
" And in the secret caves of my wisdom, it is known that there is no God but Me. "

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#3224 - 01/09/08 12:01 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Euronymous]
L Fern Tej Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 65
Loc: Las Vegas, NV. (u.s.)
 Originally Posted By: Euronymous
Satanism revolves around You; period. If your into the occult, cool; that's your bag. I don't know where you got the idea that Satanism revolves around "darkness".

Satanism indeed revolves around the individual as his or her own god, but also offers a guidlines and philosophies to follow, for if it didn't then it would simply be Atheism wouldn't it?
are you really so naive as to tell me that a religion called "Satanism" doesn't revolve around the occult?
t's quite obvious that you simply read the first paragraph from the churchofsatan.com and automaticaly assumed that this makes you a credible satanist.

 Originally Posted By: Euronymous
The sigil of Baphomet does not portray the balance between "good" and "evil". Those are clearly subjective according to one's perception.The Sigil of Baphomet portrays the "duality of nature" symbolized by the two horns of Mendes.

yes you're right, the sigil of baphomet doesn't portray balance between good and evil, unfortuanetly for your ego though, i clearly said "the baphomet of mendez" which is completely different from the sigil of baphomet.

 Originally Posted By: Euronymous
I suggest doing more research before you decide to post something you don't have much knowledge about.

and i suggest you not call people out on ignorant self-righteous whims and instead you yourself do a bit of research.

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#3228 - 01/09/08 12:23 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
XxTwiZteDxX Offline
stranger


Registered: 01/08/08
Posts: 10
Heres some links to the pictures so your not confused eronymous.

Im not much associated with the sigil, but the mendez one is quite a symbolic masterpeice in my mind. It represents to me one who is neither one who is dark nor light, but represents the being of balance who lives in a world the the two inhabit. We are the travellers.. it is our choice how we live within this world.

Sigil
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/XxTwiZteDxX/Baphosimb.gif
Mendez Baphomet
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/XxTwiZteDxX/Baphomet.png

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#3278 - 01/09/08 10:08 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
Euronymous Offline
stranger


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 46
Loc: san diego, ca
Yes; well, I didn't say anything about philosophical guidellines because that is just common knowledge. Insofar as revolving around the occult, that can be anything that pertains to the "hidden" facets of life, which is incorporated in Satanism, but, what I was trying to point out is that it is the individual who is the "focal point" etc. Now, the Baphomet of Mendes still portrays the "duality of nature" not a balance between "good" and "evil". It slso is representative of balance as a key ingredient to any type of magical working and life in general. If I came across as an asshole, sorry. I didn't mean to seem so egotistical, thought I admit I tend to be sometimes. I guess I get that from my father..lol. But in all seriousness, I apologize if I came across as such. And no, I didn't just read the first paragraph of the CoS website. I earned the title Satanist through my own blood, sweat, and tears.
_________________________
" And in the secret caves of my wisdom, it is known that there is no God but Me. "

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#3390 - 01/12/08 12:25 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Euronymous]
Noc Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 76
Loc: Delaware
Hail's

I totally agree with what Euronymous is saying. All truths come from within. Each of us has to find the balance withing ourselves either through Satanism, Paganism, Druidism, etc. I study all aspects of the occult and follow My own guidelines to find the true balance within myself. I have come across so many that get involved in the occult or Satanism or what have you to try to seem cool or to try to fit in and they will never find a balance or any hidden knowledge because they are looking for it in the wrong places. They forget to look from within ones true self. Simply reading a book and following it word for word isn't going to bring the balance unless your practicing what you read and do actual magick to find true balance. Do what feels right to You because everyone experiences things differently and what might be right for one person might be wrong for another. So for that reason I study all aspects and use all of those to find the balance inside Myself. There are truths in everything You just have to trust yourself in finding it.... A quote I live by is "It's better to be Hated for who I am, than to be loved for What I'm not"




Dark Blessings

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#4672 - 03/01/08 02:49 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
Engel08 Offline
stranger


Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40
Loc: California
 Originally Posted By: L Fern Tej
I've just recently began exploring the satanic philosophies after i was intrigued by Anton LaVey's "Satanic Bible".
but one thing i don't quite grasp is the fact that Satanism revolves around darkness and the occult.
so why does the Baphomet of Mendez portray the balanced equality between good and evil (darkness and light)?
why not embrace all aspects of life rather than just those portrayed by an effigy of Satan?
I've tried searching for an article explaining this matter but none quite answer my questions, maybe you all could help me better understand?


I saw it as being about more of coagulation and flow. Which were alchemical really. Especially when it came to mercurial elements ect. But I'm not really really well read. However there was a point where I studied the Mandez Baphomet. Indeed it is the duality between force and activity of energy. Not towards light and dark necessarily.


As for the effigy of Satan I think it is a bit of an entertainment thing. As well as a philosophy of being an individual in a world where those of a Christian god reign with many hypocritical laws and beliefs. In a way the "Satan" Aspect is a call for individuality amongst sheep.

There are few whom are dianic(To borrow a term to define Hinduism menaing deities) satanists whom believe in a figure of Satan. But this is rare. And since most satanists are atheistic and nondianic. They do not follow portrayals of baphomet.
However I believe most have thought of the philosphy of Satanism and the symbology surrounding it.
I don't know if Satanists are not balanced. I honestly think that more believe in the baphomet symbol and possible meanings than you think.

I find it amusing that even though people believe left hand paths are evil. It is Baphomet's right hand which coagulates.

Satanism is defined by the individual. One must keep this in mind at all times. It was the first thing in Anton's Satanic Bible.
_________________________
"Drink to me"

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#5122 - 03/09/08 06:48 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: L Fern Tej]
97and107 Offline
member


Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 268
Loc: New Mexico
You have to understand the crossroads that Satanism is at right now. We have on the one hand, a bunch of assclowns calling themselves Satanists prancing around like psychopaths and rude or just drama addicted monkeys, with a *false* ego of no real use for power.

On the other hand we have some very dedicated philosophers, occultists and scientists (a few) who caught onto the outsider's edge Satanism has, the part that works on deconstructing a failing society and rebuilding the foundation of mankind. These are people who are *born* Satanists much as Lavey suggested, and they suffer for their affiliations but find no other choice in life worthy of attention other than that which matters most - abandoning the paths well travelled to explore new roads.

Why? Why try the new? It's plainly obvious to anyone with a highly analytical mind that the human race is at a standstill. We're on the brink of being wiped out from the planet, with nowhere to go - no moon base, no technology to survive in space - nothing. Just a dying planet still wracked with the same old war and religion bullshit.

"It furthers one to have somewhere to go"

- The I Ching

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#5174 - 03/10/08 02:15 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: 97and107]
Isaak w shipley Offline
member


Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 112
Loc: Tenneessee
Balance is hard to find because nobody takes time out to harness that energy.Alot of bad karma i have had in past times.
Mistakes to learn knowlege.The kind not taught in school.
Rude people have crept inside my energy field trying to suc
me dry.Even causing self hating towards myself,friends,family.
The damage is done.
For good reason because it taught me how to survive with what i have.
Others who are selfish 24/7 are a disgrace to humanity.
Yes its wonderful to love yourself, but to help is to heal.

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#5175 - 03/10/08 02:27 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Noc]
Isaak w shipley Offline
member


Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 112
Loc: Tenneessee
Everybody makes mistakes.
If humanity fails to reconize this we have judgement and second class people.
People like me.
Who have been told "your evil"so most take it to heart.
Bad move.
Ive learned this "the hard way".
Humanity is in-tuned with light and dark.
Sun and Moon.
Bad habits,good judement.
Reverse the phycosis.
Good habits,evil judgement and hypocrites

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#5176 - 03/10/08 02:39 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Engel08]
Isaak w shipley Offline
member


Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 112
Loc: Tenneessee
Christianity needs to realize.
"Judge not lest you be judged.
No wander people commit vicous crimes that serve no purpose.
Inside the bible-belt,"hellville" you are guilty not for works but dress,class,habits.
Its propaganda scare tatics.
Meaningless talk for gluttons,drunkards "alike"
Who see themselves above their own "words to live by"
What is wrong with humanity.

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#5303 - 03/11/08 04:36 PM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Isaak w shipley]
king in yellow Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 7
baphomets interesting pose it symbolic, but is in now way linked to Satanism. if it were, it would still make sense.
If a god above, an anti-god below.
Evil being the great balance.

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#5593 - 03/14/08 03:31 AM Re: trying to find balance [Re: Isaak w shipley]
97and107 Offline
member


Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 268
Loc: New Mexico
As ever, the strong will survive and the weak will perish. Find your center and stabilize it, work your way out from there.

"what is not attended to regularily will degrade"

I Ching (I think?)

Your understanding of karma is very basic. Karma is more mutable than the new age freaks would have you think. It's just a series of natural laws, understanding nature is the key to learning how to surf the tide of time...

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