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#34322 - 01/21/10 09:21 AM Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift....
111Cal Offline
member


Registered: 12/22/09
Posts: 143
OK, For the holidays I was given Peter Gilmores "The Satanic Scriptures" as a gift by a well meaning relative who knew of my beliefs and tried hard to get an appropriate gift. Although the book has been out for some time, I have purposely NOT purchased it as I really have no interest in the current direction that Peter Gilmore has moved the CoS.

That said---- I tried to read it with an open mind. The first thing that I noticed was that there are LOT of typos and misspellings in the book. How can this be???? Dont they have editors how review books before they go to press???? And doesnt Gilmore himself, pride himself on how "smart" he is??? Anyhow, maybe thats a pet peeve.

The book, LOOKS good. Has a nice cover and is visually appealing to flip through. Some parts are actually ok (The Satanic Wedding, funeral, Rites of Ragnarok) BUT when it comes to those, I do not know how much of that was Gilmores doing, or simply putting OTHER PEOPLES ideas and words to paper by his hand. (I suspect a LOT of it is)

The portions that are Gilmores entirely are a bit pretentious and pointless. Sort of like the articles he would write for the Black Flame magazine. (perhaps they are reprinted from that? not sure) and the whole thing seems forced.

Some parts are simply not true. Such as the portion about Facism where Gilmore claims the current CoS is NOT facist, while everything else he has said and done in the last decade points otherwise!

By in large, the book was pretty much as I expected it. There was no reason for the book to be written or printed, other than the fact that Gilmore wants people to know that, YES YES YES YES, he is High Priest now. (LOOK AT ME FOLKS- IM THE HIGH PRIEST!) and he seems to really enjoy the sound of his own voice.

Its not a bad book, just not a memorable one at all. I would never have bought it on my own, but I wont toss it out either....

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#34350 - 01/21/10 08:22 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: 111Cal]
MatthewJ1
Unregistered



Yes, I have purchased and read this book by Peter Gilmore as well.

I noticed a number of spelling mistakes, but also noted that it was a rather beautiful looking book with the glossy cover and inside cover artwork.

I would note that any mistakes in the book may not be Peter Gilmore’s fault. The fault may lay with the editors or the publisher or the printer of the book etc.

I have been critical of High Priest Gilmore and the current hierarchy of the Church of Satan in the past. I have stated certain opinions in past threads. I have also viewed certain media articles and other information about the will and estate of Dr. LaVey and the succession etc.

I have said my piece on these issues and will now follow Jake’s advice and just get over it. It is what it is and it was what it was.

I will read and listen to anybody who can teach me something truthful, useful and interesting about the Satanic philosophy and any organisations, which has grown out of that philosophy, and those sources of knowledge should and will include Magus Gilmore, Magistra Nadramia, Magister Nemo and other members of the current hierarchy.

I don’t give a damn about the politics of it all to be honest and I don’t want to. It’s none of my business and should never have been in the first place. I don’t know these people personally.

I did learn some interesting things about the current position of the Church and the philosophy of Dr. LaVey from this book by High Priest Gilmore.

A number of these essays seem to me to be rather clear statements on the way the Church currently views the philosophy of Dr. LaVey. Others may dispute this conclusion. If they do, then they should say so and in a way that I and other members can understand.

I cannot comment on the supposed fascist orientation of The Church, if some person wishes to comment on this than I would appreciate that.

A comment has been made here that the book is not a memorable one, or that High Priest Gilmore is just repeating other people’s ideas, or regurgitating conventional pieties. This may be true.

I think Gilmore and the current hierarchy see themselves as the protectors and caretakers of The Church and the guardians of Dr. LaVey’s philosophy in the face of lairs like this one.

To each their own, I like this lair and that’s that as far as I am concerned. It’s much better, in my opinion, to have variety of opinion and free speech, rather than none at all or a very limited range of opinion and accepted speech.

I found The Satanic Scriptures overall to be a useful book – dry, but historically important with clearly written essays, which a novice or beginner could learn a lot from. I personally recommend it.

If you disagree with this than say so and state your reasons so I and others can understand.

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#34354 - 01/21/10 10:09 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: ]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
"I will read and listen to anybody who can teach me something truthful, useful and interesting about the Satanic philosophy and any organisations, which has grown out of that philosophy, and those sources of knowledge should and will include Magus Gilmore, Magistra Nadramia, Magister Nemo and other members of the current hierarchy."

Go forth with an open mind. Be aware they don't like to be questioned. If you join and send them money, be aware they will ban you because you are a member and post here.

Truth is an idea which can manipulated. Just do your own research and be aware that people will try to manipulate you.

Current hierarchy, who cares. They don't pay my bills or affect my life or my beliefs. If you need outside validation about who you are or what to believe in, Satanism may not be for you. In that case, you are just behaving like a sheep, looking for someone to lead you by the nose. Besides, if you want to get technical Jake processed Gilmore and Peggy's paperwork when they were first joining the church, back when he took care of stuff.

Any group of individuals who do not want to be questioned or challenged on ideas are stagnant and locked into a time frame with no future goals. That puts them into the same head space as the Catholic church in Rome. "Don't question, just accept because we told you so."

"I found The Satanic Scriptures overall to be a useful book – dry, but historically important with clearly written essays, which a novice or beginner could learn a lot from. I personally recommend it."

If a newbie can't learn from the Satanic Bible or understand it, nothing else matters. I don't view it as historically important at all.

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#34357 - 01/21/10 10:51 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Morgan]
babyflex Offline
lurker


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 1
Loc: san jose,ca
hey morgan have you read the devils notebook? thats the way i grew up in my years. if you want to discuss it message me, im open.! bye
_________________________
pics on myspace search by e-mail snoopy408@yahoo.com or my cell4087063335 i live the devils notebook

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#34360 - 01/21/10 11:30 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Morgan]
MatthewJ1
Unregistered



Thanks for your point of view Morgan. It is appreciated and pertinent as always.

Yes, I will not be some mindless sheep and will always keep an open mind about what is presented to me. You can take that to the bank.

I am always applying critical thinking to everything which is presented to me.

The reason I like this particular place is because of the variety of views about a whole range of issues.

I have noted some authoritarian sorts of views when I have lurked around LTTD, but have learnt some additional things about the philosophy and The Church.

I am a great believer in freedom of speech. I will not join The Church at this stage.

I am interested in LHP scholarship and like to draw on a wide a range of material as possible.

Study always focuses my mind for all the tasks I engage in.

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#34379 - 01/22/10 07:08 AM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: ]
111Cal Offline
member


Registered: 12/22/09
Posts: 143
Yes, it seems we are all pretty much in a similar position on this book.... I gave it a chance, and some of the LaVey stuff is worthwhile (the older stuff put in print) but as usual, Gilmore seems more interested in self promotion than real discussion.
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#34485 - 01/24/10 05:53 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: 111Cal]
MatthewJ1
Unregistered



Okay, I just want to clarify again.

I recommend High Priest Gilmore’s book The Satanic Scriptures to all readers. I highly recommend it to beginners or novices.

After having read Peter Gilmore’s book a number of times, I feel that Peter Gilmore is not into self promotion.

Peter Gilmore and the current hierarchy are the leadership and caretakers of the current C.O.S and they see themselves as working for the continued existence of the C.O.S and the integrity and cohesion of LaVey’s work.

I see nothing wrong with the above, as somebody has to get in there and do the job. In fact I say well done to them (Responsibility to the Responsible).

I disagree with High Priest Gilmore and the hierarchy, only in regards to his criticism of lairs like the 600 Club, which I regard to be an excellent website.

I personally like the diversity of opinion in this place.

The Church of course has standards which it believes must be maintained and this is their goal, but they may need to see that they are now only one fish in a large pond.

I will continue to study works produced by high ranking members of The Church and no doubt will get a great deal of information and knowledge out of them, just as I do when I study Dr. LaVey and Dr. Aquino’s works.

I am not a member of The Church at this time, but may become a member in the future.

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#34492 - 01/24/10 09:26 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: ]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
You know, I saw a copy of the book going for over 40 bucks on ebay.

There is a sucker born every minute.....

Once again, keep in mind if you join the CoS they will ban you and cancel your membership because you post here. So you will have wasted like $200 for the membership and a red card.

Whatever Dude, its your money....

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#34513 - 01/25/10 06:20 AM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Morgan]
Meq Offline
Banned
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 861
 Originally Posted By: Morgan
You know, I saw a copy of the book going for over 40 bucks on ebay.

I saw a few PDF versions of the Satanic Scriptures floating around the net. I'm guessing Gilmore can't stop people from getting their hands on it for nothing.

Then again, if a book's sufficiently evil-looking, with a black cover and with a title like that, there will always be people willing to pay ;\)

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#34541 - 01/25/10 10:06 AM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: 111Cal]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
I like a lot of what Gilmore writes and I also like listening to him speak. He certainly doesn't carry the same commanding sort of presence that his predecessor carried but he is quite interesting to listen to as he's well versed in both the history of the C/S and the history of religion in general.

Personally I wasn't much impressed with this book either. I think better examples of his writing can be found right on the C/S web site without the $20 price tag. I also get the impression that a large portion of the book consists of reprinted articles but I don't have source material to compare to, so I can't be certain of that.

Of particular interest to me was the extended chapter on music in or about the middle of the book. Gilmore is an accomplished musician and certainly knows his stuff in that arena. His waxing eloquent on that subject was, in my opinion, the most worthwhile part of the book.

On a bit of a side note, I've tried a few of the post LaVey heirarchy's books. Most of what I've read seems to be reprinted articles of one kind or another with much focus on aesthetics, movies, personal meetings etc. I'm certainly not saying that there isn't value there... there is. I was looking for deeper insight though than most of what was in the books. The one I have not read, and am looking most forward to, is Magister Svengali's 'Essays in Satanism'. Svengali's blog is chock full of Satanic wisdom and he makes no bones about exactly how he feels about things and what his opinions are about how things effect and are effected by Satanism.
_________________________
Dead and gone. Syonara.

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#34545 - 01/25/10 11:40 AM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Fnord]
TheInsane Offline
member


Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
From what I understand the whole book or the vast majority of it is reprinted articles that he already published elsewhere. Which is quite funny since the book was delayed for years and years and I thought it was Gilmore who hadnt finished it and was just being lazy. It must have been something else.

I however do not like Gilmore. He is so full of himself and i tend to disregard any satanist that tries to play the "true Satanism vs pseudo Satanism" card. Its just something no satanic "tradition" can really do and to me it signals that the person really doesnt know shit about the history of movements, much less the word Satanism.

Furthermore I find that Gilmore is only a sheep in that all he ever seem to do is to praise Anton LaVey. He never really strives to create something new for himself but keeps going on and on about Antons favorite subjects and his opinions rather than create his own thing.

And still he seems to neglect certain parts of what LaVey wrote and tries to ignore it or downplay it.

And because of all this he is repetative. In every interview Ive heard him in I think he has mentions that "Satanism is just show-business".

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#34546 - 01/25/10 12:01 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: TheInsane]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: TheInsane


And still he seems to neglect certain parts of what LaVey wrote and tries to ignore it or downplay it.


Not challenging you... just curious what you had in mind, specifically, when you wrote this?
_________________________
Dead and gone. Syonara.

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#34552 - 01/25/10 03:26 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Fnord]
TheInsane Offline
member


Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
 Originally Posted By: TheInsane


And still he seems to neglect certain parts of what LaVey wrote and tries to ignore it or downplay it.


Not challenging you... just curious what you had in mind, specifically, when you wrote this?


I gotta say I'm not sure these are the right observations but this is the feeling I get from Gilmore. To me he seems to not neglect the magic portion of Anton LaVeys philosophy but maybe how it works or how seriously one should take it. Anton saw alot of importance in it. Heck one half of TSB is dedicated to it.

Then its the classical debate on Satan's place in Satanism. I realize that for LaVey the concepts was something he'd rather not talk alot about the older he got but he still had the foundation that The Church of Satan was actually build on something called Satan. Now I don't believe LaVey necissarilly believed in Satan as a sentient being but I do believe that he was way more open to personal interpretation (in the early stages at least) and whatever he regarded Satan to be the very concept was of extreme importance. Gilmore on the other hand always seem to claim that "Satanism has nothing to do with Satan" or "We don't believe in Satan". To me he comes across as if he doesn't really care about the symbol of Satan either. He seems to think it is disconnected somehow from the world-view of Satanism. Although I might give Gilmore to much credit for this - it might be his fan boys that hold this closer to heart (I have been debating with a few of them throughout the years).

On a personal note I despise the Gilmore regime because its static. It does nothing new for Satanism. There are no new ideas or even a thought to dwelve deeper into already existing concepts. There have been no attempt to write any books on relevant historical connection Satanism has with Hindu tantra or Crowley or Nietzsche or Rand etc. No dwelling deep into its philosophy but only scratching the surface and repeating some of the buzzwords over and over again.

I also dislike that he somehow tries to say that because Satanists are individualist there is no satanic community. I think it is a bs notion since individualism itself doesn't actually go against the community thought (it can benefit the individual to spend time with like-minded for example). For someone who uses alot of big words and praise about true human nature he seems to forget that despite (or maybe because of) mans egoism we are a herd animal – needing, feeding and thriving in social groups. Of course this anti-community thought also renders The Church of Satan as completely worthless as an existing organisation since it serves no purpose whatsoever.

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#34560 - 01/25/10 06:02 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Morgan]
Apion Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 18
Morgan, I don't know what the deal is with the hostile tone but the only reason for expulsion in the C/S is mucking around someway in illegal activity. Unless the 600 club is an illegal networking site a C/S member is just fine. It's a very "do your own thing" mentality with a low expulsion rate. I'm not a member yet I have some contact with them.
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#34571 - 01/25/10 09:53 PM Re: Got Gilmores SATANIC SCRIPTURES as a gift.... [Re: Apion]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
Apion, you will see and learn.
It has happened to members here before, and will happen to members here again.

It's not actually hostile, its actually forarming individuals to be aware of what they write, that way, hopefully at the very least, they use a different user name.

Oh, and btw, I was banned from their site for questioning them.

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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