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#40386 - 07/17/10 10:19 AM Political Compass
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: Amarillo, TX
This is kind of a generic "forum" quiz that's popular to pass around, but I'm posting it here as more than just a springboard for water-cooler talk. I am genuinely interested in getting a rough demographic survey of the political affiliations of Satanists. I found Lewis's study interesting, but not really in-depth enough to give me a concrete idea where Satanists (as a rule) stand politically. I certainly have a good hypothesis based on observation, but I'd like more data, if you will indulge. You've probably seen it before, and may have your results saved somewhere. If you've never taken it, I recommend it; it's fun. \:\)

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

Yes, I am aware that many of the threads here ask for rough approximate affiliations, but I find them deficient. Satanists are notorious hair-splitters, and the definition of any political term (anarchist, democrat, republican, liberal, conservative, fascist, totalitarian, libertarian, authoritarian) can be used to mean just about anything depending on who wields it. We wouldn't call ourselves Satanists if we didn't think the use of terms was flexible. I like this quiz because, regardless of the label you affiliate with, it will give an objective measure of where you stand relative to others. I fondly remember that, in one high school class in which I encountered this quiz, most of the "democrats" and "republicans" were, in fact, populists, and there was little to no discernible difference between those who called themselves one or the other.

My results:

Economic Left/Right: 10.00 (Laissez-Faire Capitalist)
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.74 (For individual freedom)
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#40389 - 07/17/10 10:56 AM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
Mine landed about where I thought it'd land, although I expect my Economic Left/Right should be closer to 8 or so. I might have picked apart the questions too much.

Economic Left/Right: 5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.15

Economic conservative/capitalist, social libertarian. About right I'd say.
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#40391 - 07/17/10 12:00 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: Fnord]
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: Amarillo, TX
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
Mine landed about where I thought it'd land, although I expect my Economic Left/Right should be closer to 8 or so. I might have picked apart the questions too much.


I do the same darn thing. I spent forever deliberating over

"Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers."

Someone on either end of the spectrum may "strongly disagree" with that for a completely different reason than another. It's too middle-road of a statement to indicate anything without qualification. For one, it says "mothers" instead of "women," which suggests a woman may be career-oriented if she chooses not to have children. It also allows for the possibility that mothers may have careers. A hardcore social conservative may strongly disagree if for no other reason than he thinks a woman's only career is being barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen vacuuming under his ass and making him a sammich. An extreme social liberal, on the other hand, would resent the idea that mothers can't have their cake and eat it too, or that men can't be "Mr. Mom," and also may strongly disagree. It would be really hard to tell which one was intended by "disagree." :P

I also wondered about whether some of the statements were at all relevant to my political position. I mean, what does my opinion about the definition of "art" have to do with my politics? As for social issues, I'm hardcore libertarian when it comes to actual implementation of policy. The law, in my mind, should live and let live unless someone's life is at stake. But oftentimes the quiz asks for my personal opinion on social matters without attaching it to any issue of policy, and I wonder how that may affect my score. For example, I don't think people with serious genetic problems should be reproducing, so I may click "strongly agree," but I also don't think it's any of the state's business whether they do or not. So though my personal opinion may be more on the fascist eugenics side of things, my political position is far more libertarian. :P
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#40397 - 07/17/10 02:36 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
Economic Left/Right: -4.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.51
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#40411 - 07/17/10 11:39 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

It is shit like this that truly smells of Facebook or Myspace.

~T~
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#40436 - 07/18/10 01:28 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: ta2zz]
Dan_Dread Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3934
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
I agree with ta2zz. I died a little inside when I saw this mcdonalds calibre shit posted here. Whats next..a word association thread?

This isn't mcos.
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#40438 - 07/18/10 01:44 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
Damis Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/10/08
Posts: 60
Loc: England
I remember this site from my time in college, we were actually advised against using it in the course of our work due to it's gross inaccuracy at least when it came to British political positioning. (Such as how it puts the Labour party on the right, when it is by policy a moderate left wing party).

However if you are interested in finding out how your political position is viewed through taking an online quiz, then I would at least recommend: http://politics.beasts.org/scripts/survey

Although it's data from real world politics is about five years dated, I would think that it would still be useful when it comes to the core essentials. It's a lot more thorough and encompassing than 'Political Compass', with around seventy-five questions covering a wide range of common political topics. The results are also a lot more detailed, if memory serves correctly, it also provides a detailed breakdown of your answers and which areas influence your position the most.

However I would still be dubious about any online survey that claims to provide an accurate picture of something as complex and relative as a political position. (A lot of people can't even agree on what Left and Right actually are!).

When I took the latter quiz a while ago, I remember being placed firmly on the right but with a very big sway in the direction of the liberal quarter.
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#40440 - 07/18/10 02:23 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
Asmedious Moderator Offline
Moderator
senior member


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 1751
Loc: New York
Economic Left/Right: 2.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.41
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"The first order of government is the protection of its citizens right to be left alone."

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#40443 - 07/18/10 03:53 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: ta2zz]
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: Amarillo, TX
 Originally Posted By: ta2zz

It is shit like this that truly smells of Facebook or Myspace.

~T~


Facebook and MySpace quizzes are usually shallow, poorly designed, and give really generic, vague answers that would be applicable to anyone. This quiz, I feel, is accurate and informative enough to actually indicate something relevant.

"Which Disney princess are you?" may be cute, but it has no impact on people's lives. The Political Compass gives people a clearer idea of where they stand overall in regards to the issues and what political parties actually serve their interests. It can radically alter a person's self-perception.

I've known a lot of people who simply vote straight ticket for whatever party their family happens to belong to, without actually giving any thought as to why they vote the way they do or whether this party serves their interests or principles. In my opinion, this quiz is useful for introspection.

And as I said before, I'd actually like to get an idea where Satanists stand politically, for my own purposes. I'm not just asking for the hell of it.
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#40447 - 07/18/10 04:30 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: Damis]
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: Amarillo, TX
 Originally Posted By: Damis
However if you are interested in finding out how your political position is viewed through taking an online quiz, then I would at least recommend: http://politics.beasts.org/scripts/survey


My results from this were:

1 left/right +1.7821 (+0.1073)
2 pragmatism +8.5562 (+0.5150)

While I appreciate the effort to contribute something good, I don't really perceive much of a difference. I was asked a few of the questions twice, so it didn't really end up being 75 questions. It seems about the same to me, although I'm not really sure how the Pragmatic/Idealistic dichotomy is determined. I guess Libertarian/Authoritarian was a clearer axis. Also, I didn't really see a detailed output besides my basic numbers. Maybe that's something they've since scrapped?


Edited by XiaoGui17 (07/18/10 04:31 PM)
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#40468 - 07/19/10 01:42 AM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
Damis Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/10/08
Posts: 60
Loc: England
Like I said, it's probably been about two years since I've used the site in question, however I do recall that quite a few questions are the same but just rephrased, my best guess is that it's just a means of verifying your positions or the strength of said positions.
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#40474 - 07/19/10 09:09 AM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
ceruleansteel Offline
active member


Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 784
Loc: Behind you
Economic Left/Right: -2.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.85

so...tell me about me...

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#40490 - 07/19/10 02:58 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: XiaoGui17]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: XiaoGui17

And as I said before, I'd actually like to get an idea where Satanists stand politically, for my own purposes. I'm not just asking for the hell of it.


It will make for an interesting study I think.

I've interacted with folk online who claim to be Satanists but vote for increasing spending on social programs (ie left side of the spectrum).

To my mind, it's difficult to be a fierce individualist with a pull yourself up by the bootstraps mentality, who supports taking the earnings of one member of society and giving it to a weaker member of society. Of course I've illustrated my point in a simple manner, but I can't see much on the fiscal side of the left that I can support.

Redistribution of wealth via heavier taxation on a selected few?
I can't get behind that unless I'm willing to say that I think it's right to punish achievers.

Health care, the bailouts, this new bullshit nanny state garbage about monitoring people's BMI's... it's all overhead that the tax payer will ultimately shoulder the burden for. I don't see how any of it is compatible with fierce individualism.

If you get very far into this or decide to write something up, I'd like to read it.


Edited by Fnord (07/19/10 02:58 PM)
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#40494 - 07/19/10 03:31 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: Fnord]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
The problem with social programs like welfare is that it is meant to be temporary assistance until people can pull themselves up by their bootstraps but far too many people make being on welfare their job. I know a guy who actually admitted to me while he was drunk that the reason he keeps having kids is for the tax credits and welfare. Not long after that I stopped hanging out with him.

I could probably get food stamps right now if I wanted, but I don't. Not only would I prefer to make it on my own but I am in no danger of starving and it would be rather hypocritical of me, an Individualist Anarchist, to beg for help from the system that I so despise.

Even so I am still glad that Oregon has a free state health insurance plan. I myself have no insurance, whether from the state or private company, which is why I don't seek medical attention unless it is absolutely necessary. However, my sister recently got pregnant and that coupled with the fact that she is a working student makes her eligible for Oregon Health Plan. She is by no means a societal leech; she works full-time as a cook and a small town cafe and goes to school full-time at Portland State University pursuing a Master's in History so she can be a museum curator.

I like knowing that her and my future niece or nephew will be taken care of should anything bad happen. As far as most of the rest of the world I care not one bit for them or their well being. Fuck you, what have you ever done for me anyway! ;\)

Taxes? Fuck taxes, the government has no right to forcibly take money from those who have earned it. That being said I never did understand why "the rich" got to pay lower taxes. If they are going to take money from people it seems logical that the more you make, the more would be taken from you. In the end, however, I still "fuck taxes!"

And it is at this point that we come to a little problem of logic. On one hand I am staunchly against taxation but on the other I am for my sister's ability to receive health insurance which is paid for by, you guessed it: taxes. Very hypocritical and contradictory a position I hold. I see no way that these two very different opinions can hold as strongly as they do within my own mind but they do none-the-less.

Issues like these are seldom black and white. And the example I have just provided is proof of that. This test, while probably not totally inaccurate, should be seen as nothing more than a novelty. I couldn't pin myself to either side of the political spectrum; I have many varying views that intersect with both sides and as an over all I despise the authoritarian system that created this "political division" to begin with.

Just some random thoughts that your post, Fnord, got me mulling around in my head.

/free form rant


Edited by 6Satan6Archist6 (07/19/10 03:35 PM)
Edit Reason: Mechanics
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#40498 - 07/19/10 03:53 PM Re: Political Compass [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
Well, my own views aren't as stark as what I presented either.

I'm not against social programs en toto. I'm against the consistent gaming of the system and I'm against politicians who want to maintain the status quo and I'm befuddled by the people who support those politicians unless they are beneficiaries.

I think we waste way too much money in this country on increasing the size of the government (see my post on Michelle Obama's 20+ 'assistants'). Our government has gotten the idea that they should be calling the shots instead of acting in favor of their constituents (ie their employers).

I think for people like your sister, who want to improve and who have the drive to do the work, programs should be available to help. I'd rather be taxed so that someone can be become better (which will make the world I live in better) rather than be taxed to support someone like your ex friend ( I have a few of those ex friends too).

Stephen King once said in an interview I heard that sure you can teach a man to fish and feed him for life but how about feeding him for a while so he can learn to fish. If there is a result at the end of it and if there is a timetable attached, I have no issue.

As for the rich paying less taxes:
Here is an independent study with some citations. That bar graph is pretty well known and is pulled directly from the IRS site. The top 5% pay over 50% of all taxes.

AND:
As for being a hypocrite... we all are in some way or another.
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