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#40551 - 07/20/10 03:53 PM My Satanism [Wall of text]
TheInsane Offline
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Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
First off, this will be a long ass post. If you wish to read it then feel free. If you don’t feel like it then go on to something else but don’t complain about the length of it. I was asked to develop my theories on Satanism and it is what I intend on doing here. I have put some information in brackets before each part explaining how I went from Anton LaVey to my current view on life. I thought this was appropriate since most here are LaVeyan Satanists after all.

(1) Metaphysics

[The start of this thought was indeed with Anton LaVey and his theories on a “dark force in nature”. In the late 90’s when I started to explore Satanism some of the Dark Doctrines articles were available on the CoS webpage and they influenced me a lot. The CoS used to promote and Anton himself seemed too really like them (giving out honorary degrees to the people writing them) until the falling after his death. But I kept on reading their stuff and this is how I went from The Satanic Bibles short one sentence on the subject to read about the extended concept in other traditions. And just to be clear this is not a deification of Satan. I do see Satan as a mythological representation of something “natural” in lack of a better term. No exalted being o consciousness.]

Satan is traditionally the concept of what opposed the good or the perfect (i.e. God) to the Christians. My conclusion was always that as a Satanist one wouldn’t just accept the Christian worldview but choose the other side of the coin. No the real opposition would be to throw away the coin altogether.

This means that from opposition of a Christian worldview we get something totally different. One main thought of Christianity is that they divide everything into good or bad. We have concepts such as hell, Satan, sin, chaos and material reality that opposes all that the Christian views as being good. To me this means that a Satanist is one who doesn’t accept the dividing of the world like this. Things can’t exist apart from each other because they are each other in a polar relation. The road up is the road down. Without pleasure there is no pain.

I don’t believe there are a material and a spiritual world. It is all the same but we categorize the processes differently. Chaos and darkness is the concept I use for this and it is another thing that is linked closely to Satan in the bible. It is also prevalent in many other traditions such as the old Norse religion (Ginnungap), Tantric Hinduism (Maha Kali), Buddhism (sunyata), old Hellenic philosophy (Heraclitus/Hesiodos) and Taoism (wuji) to name a few. This is also a prevalent though in modern sub-atomic physics even though they, of course, have rid themselves of all the mythological language.

Remember that I speak of chaos as the metaphysical and philosophical concept (the original meaning of the word if you will) and not it’s every day usage. Chaos is something without stability, in eternal becoming and it creates ordered structures (out of necessity it seems according to science) which then fall back into this chaos. I recognize both chaos and order but the two are entwined and essentially the same. Chaos with its full potentiality manifests itself in order which if we look deep enough isn’t something apart or separate but it is also chaos at its core. And while things may appear as stable and unchanging everything does indeed change at all times. There is no exception.


(2) The left hand knows what the right hand is doing.

[I am unsure if Anton LaVey ever tried to actually define the left hand path. He defined Satanism according to his liking and had a theory on magic but besides saying things like Satan being a personification of the left hand path I believe he never truly went deeper into the actual concept. However the components were often there.]

The left hand path and how it should be defined is always a matter of discussion in the west. I tend to look more into the roots of the concept even though I can’t say I agree fully with them. One of the best shorter definitions I have read is the following (even though I do have a problem with some of the terminology):

 Quote:
VAMACARA TANTRA is part of a broad evolutionary process in consciousness, which is moving toward an integration with the Natural World, the physical body and the many sexual expressions of human behavior. All of Nature is then perceived as a sacred manifestation of the Divine, where there is no separation between Spirit and Nature, Mind and Body. So consequently there isn't any great effort to go beyond or transcend Nature. Rather, the effort is to put one's self in accord with Nature and the physical body, and to express one's own creative potential more fully. . .

. . .VAMACARA isn't part of the adolescent male's quest for dissolving the body in a ball of light, or seeking to conquer physical mortality. It doesn't seek the spiritual at the expense of the physical, because the two are already recognized as expressions of the same underlying reality. It doesn't seek physical immortality by turning away from death, because it also recognizes that birth and death are the complimentary sides of the same continuum. http://www.kamakala.com/



Furthermore the left hand path is antinomian in nature which in general does not mean criminal activity or performing shocking acts but its more about the breaking of unconscious patterns that determines one’s life (often more than we think).
The self-deification process have been discussed before. And while I dislike the term “deify” and “god” in themselves I do feel more comfortable with Nietzsche’s “übermensch” concept. This means that I prefer the thought of self-deification or the path to the overman to be a continuous process rather than the concepts meaning a realization of what one already is.

 Quote:
ZARATHUSTRA, HOWEVER, LOOKED at the people and wondered. Then he spake thus: Man is a rope stretched between the animal and the Superman—a rope over an abyss. A dangerous crossing, a dangerous wayfaring, a dangerous looking-back, a dangerous trembling and halting. What is great in man is that he is a bridge and not a goal: what is lovable in man is that he is an over-going and a down-going.


(3) Me, myself and I.

[One of my favorite parts of The Satanic Bible initially was the sections on how man is indeed a multitude of emotions and should strive to realize both the dark and the light aspects so to speak. I also liked the saying that there was never the spiritual and the carnal but only the carnal. This may seem to be in conflict of what I have and will write but I regard it as true in the sense explained above on the left hand path – that it is all one thing and the left hand path is the way of not trying to transcend nature but to put one’s self in accord with nature and the body because it is all there is.]

Many people tend to view the self as something with a core. Something that is truly you or even indestructible physically. On another forum someone else wrote a post about this and this is my shortened version of that (http://forums.abrahadabra.com/showthread.php?1162-True-Will&p=27368 ):

If there ever is a “one” it is one of constant change, of movement, of becoming. The unity may be compound but what makes it “one” is it’s trajectory. There is a line of pursuit so to speak – desires, will, wants and need for example. I don’t regard the Self as that which is found when we peel off all the layers but that which we always have and which becomes stronger when we co-relate and integrate the different parts.
This also resonates with Nietzsche’s and Herman Hesses view of the Self and the body:

 Quote:
“For there is not a single human being […] who is so conveniently simple that his being can be explained as the sum of two or three principal elements[. . .]Harry consists of a hundred or a thousand selves, not of two. His life oscillates, as everyone's does, not merely between two poles, such as the body and the spirit, the saint and the sinner, but between thousand and thousands.”(Hermann Hesse – Steppenwolf)


 Quote:
“Behind thy thoughts and feelings, my brother, there is a mighty lord, an unknown sage—it is called Self; it dwelleth in thy body, it is thy body.” (Nietzsche – Thus Spake Zarathustra)


 Quote:
“The body reveals itself as a complex totality. It is an ordered hierarchy. Thus, even though it may be the case that we are tempted to consider the ‘mind’ or consciousness as the highest expression of human complexity and abstract ability, for Nietzsche the body exceeds our greatest imaginings of complexity. The body is a’ great reason, a plurality, with one sense, a war and a peace, a herd and a shepherd’ (Nietzsche – the key concepts – P.R. Sedgwick).


Our Self, like everything else, is like a wave on the ocean. It can seem distinct but by the time it hits the shore or dissolute in the big all the substance of the wave have been exchanged many times around. It is never the same even if it appears to be. Therefore one can never find ones Self, one can only create it and be it. To become what you are!

(4) What would Satan do?

 Quote:
Did you ever say Yes to one joy? O my friends, then you said Yes to all woe as well. All things are chained and entwined together, all things are in love;
if you wanted one moment twice, if you ever said: ‘You please me, happiness, instant, moment!’ then you wanted everything to return!
you wanted everything anew, everything eternal, everything chained, entwined together, everything in love, oh that is how you loved the world,
you everlasting men, loved it eternally and for all time; and you say even to woe: ‘Go, but return!’ For all joy wants—eternity!
Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spoke Zarathustra


To me the character of Satan, being a representative of the concepts given above, stands for;

Eternal change
Wisdom
Antinomian practice
Realization that the body or nature or self is not to be despised (it is what it is and the key to wisdom is to affirm it and accept it)
The acceptance of the whole human being and is need for both pleasure and pain


I am sure I left a lot of things out, maybe even things I would consider essential. As long as any possible critique is well formulated I welocme it. I have nothing against a serious discussion of what I have written above. Why else would I post it? Serious discussions between opposing views most often lead to new realizations \:\)

Over and out!

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#40554 - 07/20/10 04:42 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: TheInsane]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3813
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
I came in here ready to shred this to itty bitty pieces, but instead found myself agreeing with much of what you wrote.

To my utter surprise, you seem to have a foothold into what I would consider several more advanced Satanic concepts and ideas.

I still think you are utterly wrong about some things (such as the existence of spirituality and stressing striving rather than being, as two examples) but all in all you seem to be on the path.

Thanks for clarifying your views by contributing this.
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#40557 - 07/20/10 04:55 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: Dan_Dread]
Jake999 Offline
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Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
Agreed, Dan. There are some fundamentals with which I disagree with TheInsane from his time posting here, but this... this is simply fundamentally sound. Good job, TheInsane. In a world of petty bitchiness on the web, a piece like this is great to find.
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#40559 - 07/20/10 05:08 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: Dan_Dread]
TheInsane Offline
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Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
Cheers! I'm glad you enjoyed that. Sometimes heated conversations in one field can make you think a person is worse than he really is. I guess thats a perfectly natural way of reacting.

As I said before, I love philosophy, have been studying Satanism for close to 15 years and have all the while tried to refine my own beliefs with all the new knowledge I have gathered.

I didn'd expect you to agree on everything - quite frankly I'm surprised you didn't pur more critique into your reply \:\)

I need to clarify that I do regard the term spiritual as faulty if we by spiritual mean "a supernatural being or essence" or anything like that. However the more diffuse "an animating or vital principle held to give life to physical organisms" rings more true to me (if we replace "physical organism" with "ordered universe" or "nature" or alike). That is what Chaos is. It is both the giver of life, the nurturer of life and the bringer of death.

Furthermore I reject materialism in the sense that it would be the only fundamental reality. I recognice, just like science, that materia is inherently empty and that it is mere energy in various forms and processes - no material core exists(if energy is the correct scientific language I dont know). So I do not reject the material world. As I said I regard it as one, something derived from a chaotic source and something that will return to it (and essentially actually is this all the time as well). Hope that made some sense.

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#40562 - 07/20/10 05:33 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: TheInsane]
Dan_Dread Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3813
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
 Quote:

I didn'd[sic] expect you to agree on everything

What gave you that impression? As I said, there is quite a bit I think you have completely wrong, and moreso now that you have added that little bit about rejecting materialism.

However, your views seem coherent and certainly fall within the realm of Satanism, so I feel no need to trash them as I would if you had presented an incoherent mess of pseudosatanism, as is generally the case with these sorts of posts.

All in all I am pleasantly surprised. \:\)
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#40564 - 07/20/10 05:58 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: Dan_Dread]
TheInsane Offline
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Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
It would be nice to take part in a similar read based on your personal interpretation of Satanism.

I am curious about what you think of modern sub-atomic physics if you were ever interested in it. The current scientific paradigm holds that materia is indeed empty of a core (like the original meaning of the word, not what is called an atom in todays physics, that means "the smallest building block" or "that which is indivisible").

This article deals with the topic at hand: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16...ref=online-news

 Originally Posted By: Jake999
Agreed, Dan. There are some fundamentals with which I disagree with TheInsane from his time posting here, but this... this is simply fundamentally sound. Good job, TheInsane. In a world of petty bitchiness on the web, a piece like this is great to find.


Cool \:\)


Edited by TheInsane (07/20/10 05:59 PM)

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#40565 - 07/20/10 06:08 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: TheInsane]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3813
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
 Quote:

It would be nice to take part in a similar read based on your personal interpretation of Satanism.

I have no need to offer an interpretation of Satanism. Satanism is what it is and doesn't require interpretation. If you want to know what I think about stuff, I have logged almost 1200 posts here over the years. Have at it.

 Quote:

I am curious about what you think of modern sub-atomic physics if you were ever interested in it. The current scientific paradigm holds that materia is indeed empty of a core (like the original meaning of the word, not what is called an atom in todays physics, that means "the smallest building block" or "that which is indivisible").

I think theoretical physics is very cool. I also think that every wannabe guru and spiritualist going just love to draw all sorts of wacky conclusions based on partial (mis)understandings to support their views. I think trying to draw some sort of spiritual reality from quantum physics is a waste of time, and furthermore intellectually dishonest.
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#40566 - 07/20/10 06:51 PM Re: My Satanism [Wall of text] [Re: Dan_Dread]
TheInsane Offline
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Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
I have read some of your old posts now and I think I know what kind of a Satanist you are. I thank you for your opinions and now welcome anyone else who would like to comment on what I wrote in the first post of this thread.
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