Page 1 of 57 12345>Last »
Topic Options
#40911 - 07/28/10 07:10 AM ONA and Culling
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
I post - for comments - part of a controversial, and recent, article from the Order of Nine Angles about culling.


Satanic Sacrifice

If there is one thing which expresses the essence of the Satanic ethos it is culling; and if there is one way to detect a pseudo-Satanist it is their attitude to culling.

As it says in our pledge of allegiance to Satan:

" I accept there is no law, no authority, no justice
Except my own
And that culling is a necessary act of Life.
I believe in one guide, Satan,
And in our right to rule mundanes."

The Order of Nine Angles has always advocated culling, maintaining it is a Satanic practice; the ONA will always advocate culling. Why? Because there are mundanes, and us. A basic principle of Satanism is that mundanes are not only a resource, for us, but also expendable. This, in essence, arises from our Satanic morality – that we are better, more valuable, than mundanes.

The pseudo-Satanists are appalled by this attitude, just like Nazarenes are. For these pseudo-Satanists, “sacrifice” means some sort of “self-sacrifice”, where, for example, they say stupid things like: “Those who seek energy outside of their minds and wills, are too weak for the practice of Magic…”

To us, this is just Nazarene-speak, covered by the slick words of weedy charlatans. For they are basically weak, afraid. They do not have our élan, our style, our satanic ethos, our elitist morality – our defiance of mundanes and everything mundane.

To such Nazarene-speak we Satanists say: why should we, in some ritual for example, denude ourselves of energy when mundanes can supply not only whatever energy we may need but also give us energy to enhance our ritual and our lives? There is a reason, of course, why our Dark Goddess, Baphomet, is called The Mother of Blood. Our Sorcery, our Magick, is really Black, really Dark, genuinely Sinister. Dangerous.

Satanism is a defiance of mundanes, a defiance of mundanity, par excellence. Satanism is the ethos of arête, which means we judge people according to their personal character. The worthless are worthless; expendable. Therefore, why should we not put them to good use?

For us, culling is natural fact of life – of how we live, or how we desire to live. Of course, there are different ways of culling mundanes – not every culling takes place, or needs to take place, in some Satanic ceremony or ritual, although obviously that is a great source of Satanic joy. A good way of culling is war; another is stirring up religious and political conflict; another is insurrection, revolution, assassinations, and so on. In fact, any means of conflict offers opportunities for culling; opportunities for those of Satanic character to weed out the weeds and reduce the surplus population of mundanes. Another, more personal way – and a good means of developing Satanic character – are “accidents”. And so on. You get the idea....


So, good riddance to mundane trash. Good riddance to everything mundane.
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40913 - 07/28/10 09:59 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: SkaffenAmtiskaw]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: MawhrinSkel
An interesting text, chiefly for its intended provocation. Apart from that I don't see any value in it. It is meant to shock, appall and inspire a sense of revulsion in its reader.


IMO, the value of the text lies not so much in such direct provocation, but of making us question certain assumptions to do with ethics, the acceptance of "authority", and culling.

Ethics, in the sense of there being a moral distinction made between "us and them" - between mundanes, and we Satanists, with mundanes (and by extension their wealth and property) being regarded as a resource and they themselves as being expendable.

That is, mundanes are inferior. They are worth far less than we are.

Acceptance of "authority", in the sense of us, of our Satanic kind, being - in practice, and not just in theory - beyond the laws and the authority of all governments and nations.

Now, I heard it said - and read - that most Satanists, especially those belonging to groups like the Temple of Set, regarding themselves as "law abiding citizens", and are expected, by such groups, to behave so.

Why?

Who makes laws, and why? Why obey the authority of such governments?

The ONA state quite clearly that there is no law, no authority, no justice, except for an individual one. That to accept anything else is to belong to the herd; to be a mundane, and not a defiant, individualistic, Satanist who bows down to no one. "Defy rather than submit" kind of thing.


Culling, in the sense of "what is murder" and who defines it and why?

For if one accepts an elitist Satanic ONA-like morality - of mundanes and us - and if one accepts we as individuals have a right not to obey the laws of mundanes or bow down to the authority of mundanes, then doesn't it follow that culling some mundanes is not wrong?
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40916 - 07/28/10 10:48 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
Responsibility to the responsible.

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

It's not a matter of thinking or knowing that many many mundanes need to be culled. It's a matter of not being an idiot. You can create and believe in your own subjective universe, but when you try to force your beliefs or acts on the unwilling in the rest of the world shit will happen. Unless you are very good, tell no one, and can keep your mouth sealed shut.

The laws are there to keep the sheep happy in their beds at night thinking the world is a safe place. It is a control factor for those who need to be controlled. Otherwise, it is a tool to be used when you need it. Whether you bend, break, jerry-rig, or choose to disguard it, it is still just another tool to manipulate for your own personal advantage.

Somehow I think your post would find a more provocative reaction over at the MCOS. They are mainly "satanic hippies" with their all equally served at their site ideas, just like Mcdonald's.

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



Top
#40917 - 07/28/10 11:04 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Morgan]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Morgan
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time


While I disagree with the pejorative term "crime" - I agree with the sentiment. As probably would the founder of the ONA, who has done "time".

It's a game you play; a dangerous but Satanic game. If you get caught, you lost. If you don't, you learn. A game that lets you exult in life, in a Satanic way. Some might say the ONA is Anton Long's own learning from experience.

To give a more realistic, a better, rendition of a particular cliché - what does not kill or disable me will probably make me stronger.
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40918 - 07/28/10 11:15 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3110
 Quote:
what does not kill or disable me will probably make me stronger.

Luckily you mentioned the "probably", otherwise I would have pointed at persons who are your friends but unknownly weakened your position.

I quite like to hear the idea of culling ONA proposes. It does not only weed out the "weaker", but from what I gather culling is also a succesful tool in further advancement of knowledge. Such as war or other extreme hostile situations tend to be a major influence on the use of a humans wit and skill and in the end have contributed to major break-troughs in technology and science.

But as a little remark; the word "mudane" is often spewed around and used in such a way it barely holds any "power" anymore. My question: WHO do you refer to as mudane? As far as I can tell, some people here qualify for being one and to push it even further (and to give it a good "educational kick") I would also claim YOU being one.
_________________________
Ut vivat, crescat et floreat

Top
#40919 - 07/28/10 11:24 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: Raffy
Good riddance to everything mundane.


Well if everything you hold to be 'mundane' is gone, then you have nothing left to be elite over and then you, yourself, shall become mundane.

There does exist a symbiotic relationship between the 'mundane' and the 'elite'. It's not a difficult thing to figure out.
_________________________
Dead and gone. Syonara.

Top
#40920 - 07/28/10 11:48 AM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Fnord]
Jake999 Offline
senior member


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
Mundane... such a movable target. To me, many of you who work 9-5 jobs and scrape to make end meet might seem mundane. I don't have to... so maybe a culling is in order.

Killing off your enemy isn't as easy as it is in Halo. Many people these days have superior weapons training and own superior weapons. So if my bullet hits its mark and culls the one whose weapons training and weaponry are inferior, despite their elitist rhetoric... is it a victory of the elite or the defeat an elitist who's been proven mundane?

I'll agree with Morgan that many Satanists, myself included, tend to be law abiding, but only a fool would believe that I or any Satanist I know wouldn't become the hunter if they were in jeopardy from someone who felt they wanted to "cull us." My attitude would be the same for them as it would be for any other,,, come into the valley of death, but bring a lot of body bags.
_________________________
Bury your dead, pick up your weapon and soldier on.


Top
#40921 - 07/28/10 12:01 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Dimitri]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Dimitri
WHO do you refer to as mundane?


I think my signature is a bit of a give-away - "those who are not our sinister brothers/sisters are mundanes".

All those who are not of our kind.

How do we know our kind? If you have to ask - you don't know \:\)

But, put simply, we know, because we have that sinister instinct (aka sinister empathy, or intuition) which enable us to know.

If we ain't got this instinct, we can possibly develop it, via our sinister way and techniques. If we have the right, the Satanic, character to start with.
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40923 - 07/28/10 12:06 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Fnord]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
Well if everything you hold to be 'mundane' is gone, then you have nothing left to be elite over


Paradise on Earth \:\)

But, the reality is - mundanes abound, on this rock we call this Earth. They breed like, well, rabbits. I was going to write - they breed "like vermin" but I thought that might be censored or get me banned \:\(

Truth is, our Satanic duty is not to rid the Earth of all mundanes - but to rule over them. To put them to good use.
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40924 - 07/28/10 12:39 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: Raffy
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
Well if everything you hold to be 'mundane' is gone, then you have nothing left to be elite over


Paradise on Earth \:\)


You say paradise on earth is to be rid of those you call 'mundane'.

Then you say:
 Quote:
Truth is, our Satanic duty is not to rid the Earth of all mundanes - but to rule over them. To put them to good use.


So which is it? Rid the earth of your mundanes and create a 'paradise' or put them to good use and create something less than or other than paradise?

As an aside, I would tread lightly in using terms like 'our kind' here. Most who seem to stick here also seem to remember that the individual is a primary tenet in Satanism. Personally speaking, I would shy away from being grouped into a kind which is why I don't identify with a group like your ONA or with the C/S or with any other group.

To put it most bluntly, if someone 'mundane' or 'elite' were to step inside my circle and fuck with me or mine directly then I'd try anything within my power to end them.

All of this grand design, Satanic world, culling of the 'mundanes' is bullshit to me.


Edited by Fnord (07/28/10 12:51 PM)
_________________________
Dead and gone. Syonara.

Top
#40925 - 07/28/10 12:54 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Arris Offline
lurker


Registered: 12/29/09
Posts: 1
From what I see, an aspect of culling sometimes missed is the effect that it has upon the one doing the deed, eg- it provokes certain changes within the psyche of the individual, breaking mental shackles and liberating the individual from imposed moralities etc. Of course this whole business would require a mature intelligent approach - to say the least - hence the quite strict guidelines one sees in ONA`s mss dealing with this subject - ie, the culling is rarely, if ever, done for personal reasons, like revenge, or done out of anger etc, and the intended "victim" is tested, repeatedly, and given a fair chance to demonstrate honorable character traits - not some arcane criteria but basic human decency etc.
Just thought I`d pop in my 2 cents, though maybe I could have chosen a less loaded thread for a first post......:)

Top
#40926 - 07/28/10 12:56 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Caladrius Offline
member


Registered: 07/25/09
Posts: 318
Loc: SoCal
My perspective on Culling:

I was taking a walk yesterday evening with a couple friends to a local park to get some fresh air. We were debating about religion, and how "evil" and enslaving it is. At first I agreed, thinking that the idea of religion, it's indoctrinations, etc, was "bad."

But the image of a gun sitting on a table popped into my mind, and I thought about something I had recently written. Which was when I Realized that like a gun, religion is neither good or bad. It is the person behind the gun and religion that makes it so.

Which led me that night to think about some Buddhist things. In its original language [Pali] nowhere in the 25,000 pages of the Tipitakas does the Buddha ever use the words "good" or "bad/evil." The words he uses are: "Kusala," and "Akusala."

Usually those words are found paired up with the word Kamma which in Pali means "Work," "Labour," and "To Build" NOT karma.

Kusala Kamma means Skillful Work/craft and Akusala means Unskillful Work/craft.

So if I were an Architect and I has given my workmen [Upasaka] a draft of my blueprint [Dhamma/Sasana], no matter how perfectly drawn out my blueprint is, if my workmen sucked at constructing [akusala kamma] the finished temple would come out jalopy. If they were Skilled at their job, the End Result would come out Perfect.

I see Culling in the same light. In my opinion, you cannot speak about culling out of context to a theoretical situation. For example, if I were to say: "I believe in Killing babies." The statement sounds bad. Thus rather than produce any productive debates, the debate goes off - because of people's emotional reaction to the idea - into a direction that is unproductive [akusala]. But if I were to put that same statement in a hypothetical situation it would be different, like this: "A pregnant single mother with 2 children is in critical condition, the doctor says that if her baby is not aborted, she and the baby will die. Thus leaving her 2 kids without a parent. Therefore I believe in killing the baby."

If we are talking about culling in context to the ONA, then perhaps it should be viewed in context to the Sinister Dialectic, or at least that there should be a skillful purpose to the Culling, with a desired end result. I don't think culling every mundane is Skillful.

Also, rather than just plainly debate about the virtues of Culling, I would try to bring up real world organizations who are using Culling Skillfully to the best of their Interests.

One example I have my eyes on is the Zetas gang/cartel in Mexico, who are utilizing Culling semi-skillfully to slowly take down the government regime of Mexico. Will Culling work for them.

Another example of a real world group using Culling on a mass scale is the US+Coalition military in the Middle East right now. I don't have a figure of how many people they have Culled. But I would ask whose interests are they serving? What is the desired end result? Is there Culling going to materialize that end result? Or are they just wasting ammo and lives?

So I would debate on How culling can be used in certain situations to skillfully engineer a desired end result, and if such culling are productive [kusala] or unproductive [akusala] in there given hypothetical situations.


Edited by Caladrius (07/28/10 12:58 PM)
_________________________
.:.gone fishing.:.

Top
#40927 - 07/28/10 01:13 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
You appear to be serious, so I'll answer seriously.

 Originally Posted By: Raffy

Ethics, in the sense of there being a moral distinction made between "us and them" - between mundanes, and we Satanists, with mundanes (and by extension their wealth and property) being regarded as a resource and they themselves as being expendable.

That is, mundanes are inferior. They are worth far less than we are.


This sort of attitude is fine, as long as you realize that a lot of that is subjective. Wealth and property, on the other hand, are defined by the state (and the masses). Are you sure you're really above and separate?

The flaw with many of these types of arguments is that they take a subjective and assume it's a universal. They conveniently forget that the "other side" of whatever dichotomy you've established also gets to decide who they think is inferior, who is expendable, what authority and justice are; and they're usually stronger than you are.

Most of the questions you ask are questions of power first, and possibly ethics/morality second. The fact is that governments and nations are bigger and more powerful than most "us"es. They make laws, and if you want to interact with the society it supports or reap the benefits it provides - living in a house, shopping in a grocery store, getting electricity - then they impose consequences for breaking those laws. They can impose, because they are stronger than you.

If individualism is your highest priority, then you are perfectly free to go find your own bit of land and be self-sustaining ... although someone may come asking about property taxes ...

 Originally Posted By: Raffy

For if one accepts an elitist Satanic ONA-like morality - of mundanes and us - and if one accepts we as individuals have a right not to obey the laws of mundanes or bow down to the authority of mundanes, then doesn't it follow that culling some mundanes is not wrong?


If, on the other hand, you wish to impinge on the lives of others according to your own definitions, well, then certainly they may feel the same, and decide that you're the one that needs to be culled. By your own logic, they are perfectly justified in Ruby Ridging your ass.

Most organizations understand those consequences, and understands that the powerful will look at individual associations in those cases. They have determined that the best, easiest path for them to continue their work is to demand that their membership stay within the law.

So, by all means, feel free to be all defiant and teen angst and define your existence as anti-herd. Just don't whine when the herd runs you over.
_________________________
An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

Top
#40928 - 07/28/10 01:17 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Fnord]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
You say paradise on earth is to be rid of those you call 'mundane'.


It's called humor \:\)




Edited by Raffy (07/28/10 01:17 PM)
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
#40929 - 07/28/10 01:24 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Autodidact]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact
the flaw...

The flaw is - and no personal offence meant - too much thinking, and not enough living.

Not enough satanic exultation, sans words; sans thought.

Another flaw is - "we are"; you are; they are. But Life goes on; life flows.

We may differ - but so what? Heresy is Life.
_________________________
Those who are not our sinister brothers or sisters are mundanes

Top
Page 1 of 57 12345>Last »


Moderator:  Woland, TV is God, fakepropht, SkaffenAmtiskaw, Asmedious, Fist 
Hop to:

Generated in 0.031 seconds of which 0.005 seconds were spent on 28 queries. Zlib compression disabled.