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#40930 - 07/28/10 01:27 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Autodidact]
Jake999 Offline
senior member


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact

So, by all means, feel free to be all defiant and teen angst and define your existence as anti-herd. Just don't whine when the herd runs you over.


I got a chuckle out of this because it made me remember back into the 70's when a member of a European terrorist group... don't remember which... was being interviewed on German television. My German was never that great, so I was glad to have the subtitles for a change. The interview went something like:

TERRORIST: "And we will continue to kill and kill and kill until the government agrees to our demands and hands over power to..."

INTERVIEWER: "You'll continue to kill innocent civilians, children, and elderly people?"

TERRORIST: "That's right. We have the power and we will not shrink from its use."

INTERVIEWER: "Well, if you have such power, why not just take on the government forces and force them into submission in open combat?"

TERRORIST: "That's simply not an option! They would slaughter us..."

I was laughing too hard to pay attention to much more of the interview.
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Bury your dead, pick up your weapon and soldier on.


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#40931 - 07/28/10 01:37 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Autodidact]
Caladrius Offline
member


Registered: 07/25/09
Posts: 320
Loc: SoCal
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact
If, on the other hand, you wish to impinge on the lives of others according to your own definitions


Yet amazingly you seem to have no problems with a congress of people who have nothing to do with you "impinge" on you life?

 Quote:
"Peasants are often very loyal to inherited power structures that define their rights and privileges and protect them from interlopers, despite their low status within those power structures." - Wiki
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#40932 - 07/28/10 01:40 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: Raffy
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact
the flaw...

The flaw is - and no personal offence meant - too much thinking, and not enough living.

Not enough satanic exultation, sans words; sans thought.

Another flaw is - "we are"; you are; they are. But Life goes on; life flows.

We may differ - but so what? Heresy is Life.


None taken. I know Life is a competition for survival, and doesn't give a shit about heresy.

I'm just happy when I get to see self-stratification in action.
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An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

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#40933 - 07/28/10 01:50 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3151
 Quote:
I think my signature is a bit of a give-away - "those who are not our sinister brothers/sisters are mundanes".

All those who are not of our kind.

How do we know our kind? If you have to ask - you don't know

But, put simply, we know, because we have that sinister instinct (aka sinister empathy, or intuition) which enable us to know.

If we ain't got this instinct, we can possibly develop it, via our sinister way and techniques. If we have the right, the Satanic, character to start with.

So mudanes to you boil down to:
- only those who don't share your views (how stupid those views can be..)
- those I don't have an emotional connection with.

Sounds like pick and choose to me and on an equal level as a catholic priest calling me an idiot for not believing in god. Maybe you should think a bit longer about it, you seem to miss a few points.

Or to have my point summarized --> see jake.


Edited by Dimitri (07/28/10 02:04 PM)
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#40934 - 07/28/10 01:53 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Caladrius]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: Caladrius
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact
If, on the other hand, you wish to impinge on the lives of others according to your own definitions


Yet amazingly you seem to have no problems with a congress of people who have nothing to do with you "impinge" on you life?


I didn't say that, obviously. The context set by the OP was murder, not minor legislative issues.

In any group you are part of, whining about the rules is pointless. If you don't like it, work until you have sufficient power in the group, then change the rules. Or leave.

If you don't like something your government is doing, either adjust, or get involved/organize to change it, or move somewhere else.
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An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

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#40936 - 07/28/10 02:00 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
Some people have no right to continue breathing and as such should be put down like a diseased animal. If someone meant to do harm to either myself or someone I care about I could, and would, without hesitation or remorse, end their life. But to advocate the killing of anyone who is not like "us", anyone who is not a Satanist (who gets to be the judge of that anyway) seems a very Abrahamic thing to do.

As Jake has already mentioned, 'mundane' is a movable target and leaves us open for the wholesale slaughter of anyone for any reason. Then again, the world we live in already allows for that. You can kill anyone you want, well, you can try anyway.

As long as taboo breaking is the goal, why stop at killing people? Why not rape your mother while and while you are at it, marry your father, knock up your sister and the eat child as it is being born. Dress up like a KKK member, go to Harlem and scream at the top of your lungs about how much you hate niggers. Go to a VFW hall and start telling all the vets there that Vietnam never happened and they are all faking their shell-shock. I'm sure you can think of more too, get creative.

All this talk of culling sounds like bullshit to me really. I've never taken the life of another person and I suspect the majority of the people here are in the same boat. It is really easy to champion something like culling when one is behind a computer screen but could you do the deed when the time came and rubber met road? Could you draw yours before I drew mine?
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No gods. No masters.

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#40937 - 07/28/10 02:08 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Autodidact]
Caladrius Offline
member


Registered: 07/25/09
Posts: 320
Loc: SoCal
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact


In any group you are part of, whining about the rules is pointless. If you don't like it, work until you have sufficient power in the group, then change the rules. Or leave.

If you don't like something your government is doing, either adjust, or get involved/organize to change it, or move somewhere else.


This post is a fine example as to why I suggested earlier that this topic of Culling should be debated in context to Real World organizations actually Culling. Because intellectuals and pseudo-intellectuals will just take these ideas and interject their A Priori opinions... which is out of touch with what actually happens in the Real World.

So, if we were speaking about America and Friends military actions in the middle east, and we assume that America and Friends don't like the way things were in Iraq and Afghanistan. Shouldn't the Americans and Friends just participate in their power structure, run for office and change things? Rather than use lethal force?

Also shouldn't the Zetas and associated cartels just run for office to change things within the frame-work of the established power structure? Instead of killing 27,000 citizens and government officials?

Why is the military and Zetas not doing what you intellectually suggested?


Edited by Caladrius (07/28/10 02:12 PM)
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#40938 - 07/28/10 02:38 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Caladrius]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: Caladrius
 Originally Posted By: Autodidact


In any group you are part of, whining about the rules is pointless. If you don't like it, work until you have sufficient power in the group, then change the rules. Or leave.

If you don't like something your government is doing, either adjust, or get involved/organize to change it, or move somewhere else.


So, if we were speaking about America and Friends military actions in the middle east, and we assume that America and Friends don't like the way things were in Iraq and Afghanistan. Shouldn't the Americans and Friends just participate in their power structure, run for office and change things? Rather than use lethal force?


America and Friends did, in fact, have the power, didn't like the way things were, and changed the rules. They removed the previous power structure. You can argue over their methods, or their success, or their wisdom, or their followup actions, of course.

As I implied before, they can use lethal force because they're bigger than you. You are not a nation - if you want to change your government's legislative minutiae, running for office is a better solution than murder. See Jake's post - you are perfectly free to try killing "the opposition" to attempt to effect your policies, but it usually results in them killing you. Feel free to choose as you see fit.

 Originally Posted By: Caladrius

Also shouldn't the Zetas and associated cartels just run for office to change things within the frame-work of the established power structure? Instead of killing 27,000 citizens and government officials?


Shrug, probably - it worked for Hitler. (Sorry, passed the threshold for Godwin's Law). I have no idea what the Zetas goals are. I can only assume they are unable or unwilling to take over the government. Overtly, at least ...
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An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

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#40939 - 07/28/10 03:29 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Autodidact]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
The main reason why most have a problem with advocating culling is that they never broke free of their chains. Sure they rattle them and growl vehemently but they will never go further than the chains allow them. They love their chains because, even while they keep them in control, they keep them rather safe too. It is better to be a part of society and embrace its limitations than venture in the unknown outside of it and risk everything.

I see two differences to the "elite" statement in Satanism. The first is largely based upon vanity. You take a lamb, preferably the weakest, and sacrifice it to your ego. "One is so elite compared to that retarded Christian fundamentalist". That lamb is used to validate them feeling elite. That kind of elite requires those weak links to function, it depends on them, and when confronted with something superior, which is unavoidable, it falls apart.

The second approach is one of arrogance. One is elite because one says so. It doesn't require the validation of the mass, it doesn't require that sacrificial lamb. It is because one says it is, because one knows. It is also an approach most have difficulties with because there has to be a reason why someone says he is elite; it has to be validated by authority. They depend on authority. They don't understand we are Authority. And we are so because we say so.

It all boils down to Will to Power. When you cross the Abyss, conquer nihilism, you realize that reality is a matter of Will. You reshape reality, create your own laws and morals, and take the leading role in it. And you divide all those inhabiting that reality. Those that are able to do the same, or have the potential, are worthy; those being incapable and living a reality shaped by others are cattle. And you treat them like cattle. And like any good shepherd you know that it is inevitable that some of the herd has to be removed from the gene pool. As such, culling is a necessity. It is a means to an end.

You do the Devil's work.

D.

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#40940 - 07/28/10 03:51 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Dimitri]
Raffy Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Chicago
 Originally Posted By: Dimitri
Sounds like pick and choose to me


Even if this was the case, so what?

I pick; I choose. I use my instinct; my judgement; my experience. What others choose to believe or think, isn't important.

What theories they may use to explain or justify their own position aren't important.
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#40941 - 07/28/10 04:04 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Diavolo]
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1146
Loc: Amarillo, TX
The idea of who is "mundane" and who is "elite" is so subjective that advocating active culling is pointless. Everyone thinks they're right, they know better, they have it all figured out. Many people who can't even spell their own names, punctuate a sentence, or type without caps lock have vehemently proclaimed that I'm an idiot because I don't agree with their religious doctrine. To them, I am the "inferior" or "mundane."

The way I see it, "culling" need not be an active process. If someone is genuinely inferior or worthless, they'll die out on their own. Instead of some man who may or may not know what is truly "inferior" actively seeking out vermin to slaughter, leave them to their own devices and let them fend for themselves. If they really are as pathetic as you're making them out to be, they won't need any help disposing of themselves.

Besides, if you're really "elite" you shouldn't need to get your own hands dirty. "Culling" sounds like menial labor to me, the sort of grunt-work that should be delegated to a peon or that one could manipulate someone else into doing for them.
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#40942 - 07/28/10 04:29 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
Jake999 Offline
senior member


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
If I had an abacus, I might be able to come up with the number of times we've had people come on the 600 Club to declare their elitism. I suppose they COULD be elite in some way, although none ever seems to manage to define why they might be so.

If arrogance is the yardstick, then the mouse walking up the elephant's leg with rape on its mind is a powerful creature indeed. But I have to agree with the broadcaster Paul Harvey's statement, "Gonads are useful for their purpose but they are no substitute for brains."

ANYONE can declare themselves elite. When I think of a wannabe in elitist's clothing, I think of the Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan (1960-1987), Robert M. Shelton. He cut a dashing figure in his elegant robes, made fiery speeches proclaiming the superiority of the white race, lit the cross and proudly stood out as the elitist... for a used car salesman, I guess he was. Funny how such an elitist can be taken down by one little old insignificant black woman and a lawyer. But he had arrogance, at at one time, an estimated 5 million members. He was arrogant to be sure, and he had balls, and he managed to "cull" some of those he thought were lessers. Elite? I don't know. He kind of looks like the guy tried to sell me a 1972 Ford Pinto.

Putting on a suit and declaring oneself elite isn't BEING elite. Arrogance without substance is plain hubris and, as we Satanists say, "Counterproductive Pride." I suppose one can figure out a way to be elite without the demonstrable "bona fides" to back it up, at least in one's own mind. But it stretches credulity for those who see nothing much more than just someone else tilting at windmills.

I need to put in a quick edit and say that this doesn't necessarily apply to the ONA exclusively. It's an organization I personally can't get behind, although my lack of interest in its functions is in no way a condemnation. Just not my cup of tea. Their beliefs and their goals are at least as valid as mine, and I doubt they'd line up at my table to share a beer with me either.


Edited by Jake999 (07/28/10 04:35 PM)
Edit Reason: Last paragraph
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#40943 - 07/28/10 04:36 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: XiaoGui17]
Dan_Dread Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3934
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
I understand the general idea behind culling. I am my own master, and ultimately only answer to myself. Their laws are not written in stone, but instead are maintained by coercion to serve the interests of those imposed them. Why should I bow to the interests of some faceless policy maker? Why should the egalitarian ideal of 'rights' being axiomatic to everyone that can manage to breath rule how I behave and live my life? To this extent I agree with the principle behind the idea.

Where I part ways with it is at the point 'me' becomes 'we'. The only 'us' of any value to me is me and those I choose to accept or care about. This has absolutely nothing to do with whether these describe themselves as Satanic, ONA, or anything else. To be honest I would not care if the vast majority of self described Satanists I have met within my life were to drop dead on the spot. Why should I? Why should someone else's life philosophy bind me to any sort of allegiance or loyalty? To me this sort of criteria reeks of collectivism, and I'll have none of it.

Mine are mine because I deem them so, and that is the only criteria that holds any weight.

If you are not of my own, you are one of three things;irrelevant, a resource, or an obstacle. I can think of no good reason to devote my precious time or energy to the first group, which is the vast majority, and I deal with the last two in a context specific way that serves my own ends. The idea of devoting my time and energy to either serve or hinder those that do not matter to me in ways that do not benefit me is a completely alien concept to my line of thinking.
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#40944 - 07/28/10 04:58 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Raffy]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1647
Loc: Orlando, FL
I have no problem with the idea of ending the life of an individual for the right reasons, but more often then not, it seems as if most of the people advocating "culling" come off as unholier-than-thou armchair extremists. We aren't some shadowy, secret cult with arms reaching into every limb of society, so "Satanic Culling" isn't going to be effective at making a difference in the composition of society. (The people worthy of being culled, however, are quite efficient at culling themselves) And taking a human life doesn't create a magical portal to Azathoth or some similar superstitious nonsense. At present, I can't imagine how killing a person could be useful or practical for my self-advancement.

Furthermore, the word "mundane" makes my skin crawl. What the hell are we, Star Trek fans? This whole "us versus them" mentality reeks too much of religious fundamentalism, and a manifestation of the same herd mentality that Satanism so virulently opposes.

I recognize there is an unintelligent bulk of society enslaved to culture and commercialism, but this rabble is far too nebulous for me to conveniently label "Them".

There is "me" and "everyone else". I deal with them accordingly.


Edited by The Zebu (07/28/10 05:04 PM)
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#40945 - 07/28/10 05:03 PM Re: ONA and Culling [Re: Dan_Dread]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
What some see as a collective form of thinking, is nothing but a goal-oriented collaboration to others. It's what I mentioned in another reply; some paths of Satanism are political, meaning they are not satisfied with only inhabiting their universe; they prefer controlling it too. One does not lose their identity by joining forces with others. Especially not when one realizes there is no collective in it at all, it is nothing but a collection of selfish cells. It is old school thinking that one needs to be a part of a whole to be able to accomplish things on a larger scale; a whole of parts manages to do the same and it does not require those parts to be assimilated into a fixed structural manner of thinking.

D.

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