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#43835 - 10/26/10 04:55 PM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: TheInsane]
deathreaperuk Offline
banned
stranger


Registered: 11/27/09
Posts: 24
Loc: England
i quite like the Satanic rules and i feel they make sense

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

i have opinions but im not going to shove them down peoples throats, that would make me no better than other religionists who freely shove and promote there hypocritical opinions, if i am asked then i will freely give it.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

If someone cares for you, they will most likely want to hear your problems, they may ask you whats wrong then you know they want to hear your issue. i would never go to random people or friends with my problems as if they dont know me well why would they care about my well being enough to suffer my issues.

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

too true,if in anothers house why even go there if your just going to be disrespectful, if you dont like what they are doing, its his house he has the right to do as he pleases, if it pleases you or not. keep a level of decurum, one of the traits of god hood.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

Basicly a reversal of number 3, its your house your rules, your ways should be respected there, if they are not throw them out with style ;\)

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

The mating signal we all know what it is, that cute look, that brush back of the hair, body language, its in our animal instincts to recognise these we just need to awaken them.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

do not steal, but is it stealing if the other person wants it gone, is he referring to material possessions ?. could it be simple delusional psychological thoughts that are effecting there wellbeing that needs clarity and be taken from them? only you can decide.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

if you have gained your desires through the usage of lesser or greater, then more the power to you. you have the belief and the drive to attain them, to deny what you have gained, what you have worked for will be for nothing, remember the balance factor.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

people ask me "your a satanist why dont you argue and complain about Christians and Muslims etc" i say i dont need to, leave them to there styfiling dogmas i have no need to subject myself to it so why should i complain about it. this can apply to many things, why complain about a certain food, i dont have to eat it.

9. Do not harm little children.

Now this one totaly speaks for itself.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

why would i wanna kill an animal for no reason ? LaVey speaks of the "white magician" who kill animals as a sacrifice, we are better than that. if they don't harm us leave them alone, if we are attacked then kill it as it brings us too self preservation is the highest law. so that leads in to killing for food, we need food for our vital existence, so again self preservation.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

oh so true, why should anyone inter fear with your being, if your going about your business and someone bothers you for no reason yes ask them to stop, a simple word, but if he refuses then yes destroy him, they had intentions in the first place to bother you so dont give them the opportunity.

Hope i wasnt rambling too much lol

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#43848 - 10/27/10 04:23 AM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: deathreaperuk]
TheInsane Offline
member


Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
Now everyone else goes into detail on what they think about the 11 rules so I thought I would as well. First, as an overall judgment, I’d like to say that I am very critical to the way they are written and how they are called “rules” in a philosophy that pride’s itself with individualism and making your own rules. That being said this is what I feel about the rules one by one;

The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth

by Anton Szandor LaVey ©1967



1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

I do not agree with this. It is one thing if you give your opinion and people obviously doesn’t want to hear it. You can either give up and walk away or push it to them depending on the situation. However as a first rule for Satanic ethics I think it is ridiculous. We cannot wait around for people to ask us to give our opinion. I know that all to well since I am by nature shy and if you don’t say what you think you will be ignored and it is never beneficial to you.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

There is truth here and I interpret it as to not go around and tell people about your personal life at random. Of course Dr. Aquino has a point when he writes “How will they know whether they're interested until you tell them?”

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

In general I agree but if a person treats you bad for no reason, in his lair or elsewhere, I see no problem in confronting him about it. And if there has been a previous argument I think you have the right to go to his home to sort things out one way or another (respect or not).

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.
I prefer for my first line of action to ask the person to leave. I think this rule jumps immediately to the very last resort. I also think the rule is unbalanced. Being annoyed with someone to me doesn’t mean that he or she should be treated cruelly. I think I have to go quite far beyond being just annoyed to go to cruelty.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

Being a man, and a shy one at that, I know all to well that it is expected in our western society that man takes the initial step. Now we can have a big discussion on what a “sexual advance” is since its very much open for interpretation. I know however why this was written. It was of course to clear Satanism from accusations of rape and child molestation. This reason is of course all good I just don’t think it makes a good rule the way it is written.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

Do not steal. And LaVey could have easily also added that its ok if you need it to survive but I know why he wouldn’t put it on print.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

For me this is silly because I don’t really care about magic and I do not think it works in the objective world. Sure, change can be caused to the subject and he or she in turn can cause change in the objective world. I just don’t think a ritual can make things happen in the world miles from where you are. I take this to mean “higher magic”.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

Basically “don’t be a whiner”. Sometimes though there are things you don’t need to subject yourself to but that you do for whatever reason – sometimes for gaining something from it in the end. I think its ok to complain about it but it obviously has to be kept to a sane level.

9. Do not harm little children.

This is all good with me. However what is a small child and what is a big child. Should we make a distinction between the two? But there are obviously extreme situations where one might have to harm someone if they try to harm you.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

I agree with this as well even though there is obviously a difference depending on the animal in question. I do not have as much regard to the individual ant as I have for the individual bear for example but that almost goes without saying. Apparently ants are good food though. Might try a few sometime ;\)

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

Again, I think the rule jumps to the last resort way to fast. Ask someone to stop and if he doesn’t destroy him. One must be quite impatient and emotionally unstable to act like that. I doubt anyone of us here have acted like that in real life and I bet most of us has met people who “in open territory” has bothered us. I know for sure I have never destroyed anyone and I wouldn’t do so unless that person really did something bad. As with rule #4 I think this one is very unbalanced. Being bothered with someone doesn’t equal destroying him if he doesn’t stop.



In conclusion I think many of these rules are either incomplete or written in a clumsy way. It is also the main part of “original LaVeyan Satanism” that I tend to dislike the most. I do however like the 9 Statements and the Sins for the most part. Even the pentagonal revision – although I have a few words to say on that as well \:\)

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#43849 - 10/27/10 07:46 AM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: TheInsane]
Jake999 Offline
senior member


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 2230
AGAIN, people, it's not that hard.

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

Simply put, don't stick you nose in where it doesn't belong. This applies to people you all know who, for some reason, seem to think they know everything about everything. Sarah has a cramp... "Well, I think it's a tumor. I had a sister once who..." etc. It is the act of kibbutzing... interfering into the lives of others.

It does NOT apply where there is a tacit understanding that opinions are welcome and could make things better in politics, work situations, etc. You have a direct interest in the situation to which your opinion on better practices or policies might
enhance the the ability of the an organization you belong to to work better. In areas such as these your inclusion tacitly INVITES your input.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

Just don't go around whining and complaining. I know that many of you are used to this because of the easy access to captive audiences, as on the internet, but it's gauche. It's simply low class to spend all of your time complaining about problems to others, especially if they have no stake in your life.

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

Common sense. You're a guest. Appreciate the association that is offered and treat your host with the simple courtesy of respect he/she deserves in their own home, office, etc. Expect the same when the visit is on your court.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

This requires common sense, which is lacking these days. OF COURSE if someone is annoying you, you first ask them to stop. If they don't you have the right to remove them as you see fit in relationship to the transgression made. "Sir, I think it is time for you to leave" might work sometimes, and at other times, "Look jerk get the fuck out," might be appropriate.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

All the candy in the world is not for you, and I don't care how devastatingly attractive you THINK you are, there are some women (and men) who simply aren't into you. Man/woman up and use your brain. If you can't tell if someone is interested in you sexually, I would suggest more socialization training.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

Again. DO NOT STEAL. If it's not yours or the other person hasn't said they want to be rid of it, leave it alone.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

This is ambiguous, but if you've been using Lesser Magic in business (I did for a long time, simply in manipulations) it's telling you to respect it. Don't gain by manipulating things in your favor and then stand on a corner an yell, "I SCREWED JIM THOMPSON BIG TIME! I BOUGHT HIS COMPANY FOR 50 CENTS ON THE DOLLAR BECAUSE I KNEW THERE WAS A SUPPLIER STRIKE COMING." Respect. Jim will hear about it and he will no longer do business with you. Neither will others he speaks to or who hear about your pointless boasting. And yes, I have lowballed people in business... and they stayed close associates with me for more ventures.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

If you don't like being in a job that you hate, change things to get into a job you DO like. It might take some effort, as in gaining some education, but it can be done. You don't HAVE to keep the job. You can find other jobs, possibly at a temporary loss, but you can find them, until you qualify. Marriage... same thing. You may have to take the hit and pay alimony, child support or other penalties, but if it's that bad, get out of it. In the long run, everybody will be happier... and the kids don't need to be pawns in your petty ass games with your spouse. Shit happens. Correct and move on.

[b]9. Do not harm little children.[/b]

Do we REALLY have to parse words and come up with stupid scenarios here?

[b]10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.[/b]

Same thing here. If we need to kill animals to survive, we need to kill animals to survive. If you kill for the hell of it, check yourself into the closest asylum and stay out of the way.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

Again... people tend to get all bent out of shape over this and I see no reason why. If you're walking around and someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not, destroy him. AGAIN the situation determines the action... and destroy does not always mean kill.

If a person pulls a knife of gun on me... game on. I am trained in their use and usually armed myself. He WILL either back off or one of us will die. If you are NOT prepared for this (and I know everyone on the internet is a killing machine), you can destroy someone by prosecution... persecution... litigation.

You can show them up in public for what they are, lowering their esteem in the eyes of the community and causing them to be shunned.

A quick anecdote: I had a neighbor who wanted to be a pain in the ass constantly and despite my attempts to get along, he continued to insert himself into my life. I had too many trees. I had too many cars. My tree was too close to the road. So, I "destroyed him." I simply did a little research, found out his credit history, found out who owned the loan on his house, and that he didn't have the best payment record. So I bought the loan from the lender. When he defaulted on payments again, I took the property, evicted him and resold the house to a nice family who pays me every month to live there.


There's a tendency lately for people to want to overanalyze everything, and all it does is muck up the waters. Simply put, people, if LaVey's system doesn't work for YOU, why do you even consider it or care?

I'm sure drinking your urine in the morning isn't something that you would think to be palatable, but there are millions of people who practice the ayurvedic tradition of yoga. Drinking one's urine is called amarol, and is said to have health benefits. Practitioners like Dee Pak Chopra, MMA fighter Luke Cummo and others swear by the practice. It's not for me, so I simply agree to disagree and move on.
_________________________
Bury your dead, pick up your weapon and soldier on.


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#43852 - 10/27/10 10:24 AM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: Jake999]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: Jake999

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

Again... people tend to get all bent out of shape over this and I see no reason why. If you're walking around and someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not, destroy him. AGAIN the situation determines the action... and destroy does not always mean kill.


This election season (I'm in the US) has pointed out that this particular rule might be more difficult to employ than it appears.

I don't follow the normal media that much, but it seems to me that there's been a steady increase in the amount of "psuedo-political" crap over the years. Marilyn Manson said it best in Bowling for Columbine: the media drumbeat is fear and consumption (paraphrased).

On the other hand, most real people I know are very reasonable, and only moderately influenced by the fear messages (but heavily influenced by the consumption messages). Crime of all types (violent, property, etc) has been dropping steadily for decades (if I'm reading the data correctly) - there's actually very little to fear, relatively speaking.

On the third hand, I gather these types of TV shows (for instance) are driven by ratings - apparently a lot of people watch them avidly. Bread and circuses ... I guess I don't know enough "average Joes".

Unspun information is getting harder to get. I wonder if there's some sort of "objectivity rating" of information sources ... gotta be something on the Internet ...

Maybe I'll go to Jon Stewart's rally with a sign that says, "Everybody just mind your own fucking business!"
_________________________
An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

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#55051 - 05/25/11 06:13 AM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: Autodidact]
Daafje666 Offline
pledge


Registered: 01/08/09
Posts: 73
Loc: The Netherlands
Came across this some while ago on http://encyclopediadramatica.ch/Satanism :

1.Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked. - Unless you're Anton LaVey. Then you can fill whole books with them.

2.Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them. - Then someone please explain why there are so many fucking Satanists with LiveJournals.

3.When in another's lair, show him respect or else do not go there. - This doesn't quite sound so hardcore if you put it the same way your mom did: "If you can't say anything nice..."

4.If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy. - A Satanist will totally defriend, block, and ban you, hide your comments, and flag you as spam. Without mercy.

5.Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal. - A moot point for the majority of Satanists.

6.Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved. - Also known perhaps as... Thou shalt not steal? Again, Anton dazzles with his fresh social insights. And note the wide fuckin' loophole tacked onto the end there.

7.Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained. - What the fuck is this, Wicca? Voodoo? Wasn't this supposed to be Objectivism?

8.Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself. - Unless it's this page. Or any criticism of Anton LaVey. That cannot be tolerated.

9.Do not harm little children. - Another visionary position. Hard to believe one man came up with all of these.

10.Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food. - But keeping a lion captive in some shithole in San Francisco rather than a proper habitat is totally fine if it keeps your eccentric, creepy image intact.

11.When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him. - LaVey had to backpedal on this one, explaining that "destroy him" was not a literal exhortation to murder those who offend you. It's a mystery how the confusion initially came about.

They're not all that good, but some deserve at least a minor smile
_________________________
That's why.

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#55053 - 05/25/11 09:07 AM Re: Origin of the 11 Satanic Rules of The Earth [Re: Daafje666]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1646
Loc: Orlando, FL
 Quote:
Counterproductive Pride - Satanists' ability to compromise is what's kept their church from breaking down into a grotesque mess of sects and schisms, OH WAIT


Oh encyclopediadramatica, how we miss thee.
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«Recibe, ˇoh Lucifer! la sangre de esta víctima que sacrifico en tu honor.»

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