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#44183 - 11/18/10 07:10 AM The Three SatanicTypes
mabon2010 Offline
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#44211 - 11/18/10 11:09 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: mabon2010]
Lamar Offline
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Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 226
Loc: Alabama
I am just 41 seconds in and I have to stop you right here. Contrary to popular belief there is only 1 type of Satanist, and that type is atheistic and practices the tenets found in Anton LaVey's The Satanic Bible. Any other type ie theistic, is nothing more than a Christian heretic.

I am now at 3:29 in and I have to stop you again. I have a problem with the three common traits of all Satanists.
"1. They are non-conformists." Actually, they are conforming themselves to herd activity under the guise of "non-conformity."
2. "They are thinkers." Wrong again. They are pseudo-thinkers rebelling for rebellion's sake which does away with # 3. "They are individualists."

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#44219 - 11/19/10 12:50 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Lamar]
HeimiricIX Offline
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Registered: 10/29/10
Posts: 75
Loc: Mexico City.
Actually I had one small problem with the video and is that while I consider your video to be acurately (in a very basic/introductory way for newcomers or curious) describing 3 types (Of many, actually, where even mix ups can happen) of LHPps not all in the LHP is called Satanism. Luciferians for instance are not Satanists, they are Luciferians.

Just a thought.

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#44221 - 11/19/10 01:27 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Lamar]
OrgasmicKarmatic Offline
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Registered: 08/01/10
Posts: 256
Loc: Michigan, USA
 Originally Posted By: Lamar
I am just 41 seconds in and I have to stop you right here. Contrary to popular belief there is only 1 type of Satanist, and that type is atheistic and practices the tenets found in Anton LaVey's The Satanic Bible. Any other type ie theistic, is nothing more than a Christian heretic.

I am now at 3:29 in and I have to stop you again. I have a problem with the three common traits of all Satanists.
"1. They are non-conformists." Actually, they are conforming themselves to herd activity under the guise of "non-conformity."
2. "They are thinkers." Wrong again. They are pseudo-thinkers rebelling for rebellion's sake which does away with # 3. "They are individualists."


Okay now I have to have a say. One, no one is going to say exactly what a Satanist really is. You can conform to LeVay and still be nothing but a conformist. This does not make you a Satanist. I respect LeVay but am I an atheistic LaVeyan Satanist? No. I am not. I am not up for any adjective. A Satanist is a Satanist is a Satanist. Period. For whatever reason. However, conforming to the belief system of others and playing the role of the Satanist also does not make you a Satanist.

I also have to point out something else.. the Satanist IS an individual. I walk my path by myself every day. I form my own beliefs about things as they come and go in my life. I do this, no one else and I am the one that I have to answer to. No one else. We may hold the same "umbrella" but we are singular. I don't see anyone attached to my hip. Unless I am mistaken or blind. Which I am neither.

There is more than black and white here and I am assuming that right now that is what your television is set on. Evolve.
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#44222 - 11/19/10 01:34 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Lamar]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3934
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
 Originally Posted By: Lamar
I am just 41 seconds in and I have to stop you right here. Contrary to popular belief there is only 1 type of Satanist, and that type is atheistic and practices the tenets found in Anton LaVey's The Satanic Bible. Any other type ie theistic, is nothing more than a Christian heretic.

I am now at 3:29 in and I have to stop you again. I have a problem with the three common traits of all Satanists.
"1. They are non-conformists." Actually, they are conforming themselves to herd activity under the guise of "non-conformity."
2. "They are thinkers." Wrong again. They are pseudo-thinkers rebelling for rebellion's sake which does away with # 3. "They are individualists."


This post fails on SO many levels.

Firstly, although Satanism and theism are not compatible, saying the only sorts that qualify as a Satanists are CoS types is rather absurd.

Secondly, if you think Satanism entails following along with how others do it, you have missed the boat completely.

Thirdly, if you think Satanism is about rebelling for rebellions sake, you have again, completely missed the boat. In fact, you aren't even on the right ocean.

You really should have thought about what you were posting here before you hit submit. You now look like a complete buffoon.

As far as the original video goes, as I have said in other places I have found it, it is quite simplistic and arbitrary. I certainly do not fall into any of those silly categories.
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#44224 - 11/19/10 02:36 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Dan_Dread]
Lamar Offline
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Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 226
Loc: Alabama
Dan Dread.

1. I did not say that the only sorts that qualify for Satanism must join the Church of Satan, but that I personally see it that in order to be a Satanist you must be compatible with the Satanic Bible.

2. I didn't say that Satanists follow how other people do it.

3. I was referring to groups like JOS (theistic Satanists) about rebelling for rebellion's sake. LaVeyan Satanists certainly do not rebell just for the hell of it.

Thank you.

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#44225 - 11/19/10 02:45 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: OrgasmicKarmatic]
Lamar Offline
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Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 226
Loc: Alabama
 Originally Posted By: OrgasmicKarmatic

Okay now I have to have a say. One, no one is going to say exactly what a Satanist really is. You can conform to LeVay and still be nothing but a conformist. This does not make you a Satanist. I respect LeVay but am I an atheistic LaVeyan Satanist? No. I am not. I am not up for any adjective. A Satanist is a Satanist is a Satanist. Period. For whatever reason. However, conforming to the belief system of others and playing the role of the Satanist also does not make you a Satanist.

I also have to point out something else.. the Satanist IS an individual. I walk my path by myself every day. I form my own beliefs about things as they come and go in my life. I do this, no one else and I am the one that I have to answer to. No one else. We may hold the same "umbrella" but we are singular. I don't see anyone attached to my hip. Unless I am mistaken or blind. Which I am neither.

There is more than black and white here and I am assuming that right now that is what your television is set on. Evolve.


Ok, resonating with the philosophy that LaVey set forth and calling yourself the label he attached does not make you a conformist. There are many LaVeyan Satanists who do not agree with every single think the man said.

"No one is going to say exactly what a Satanist is"
LaVey has doing exactly this in the Satanic Bible. I do not recognize any other group claiming to be Satanists as such because prior to LaVey, Satanism as a religion did not exist. So to me (I could give a shit what anyone else thinks) a Satanist is one who is compatible with the Satanic Bible. All otheres are irrelevant.

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#44229 - 11/19/10 03:24 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Lamar]
HeimiricIX Offline
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Registered: 10/29/10
Posts: 75
Loc: Mexico City.
Just my two cents:

So it's just a matter of words and their meaning it seems? I myself tend to differenciate the names from the things they represent. Claiming to be a Satanist could mean a lot of things depending on who is making the claim and I don't believe any are nessesary wrong.

While LaVey may have created Satanism as a religion (gave it a name) what he describes as Satanic thinking and as a Satanist existed before him and before his Bible.

Yes, noone before him claimed to be a Satanist but many before him could have been easily sliped into that category he just named.

But if we are to agree with that then Satanists are not truly Atheist, LaVey and the CoS at the time of the SB writing were not precisely atheists, and I'm not making that up, you can read it in the SB for yourself, the denial of the christian point of view doesn't make someone Atheist for their definition of god and the world may be different from that of a christian but may also be true for themselves.

On another point, a theist Satanist is not nessesary a heretic Christian, for all we know their Satan is not the same Satan of the christian mythology, for all we know, their Satan is a forest leprechaun that speaks in rhyme-riddles and gives cookies, yet he is a very real entity (for them) and that makes them Theists.

In the end it doesn't matter, you are right, it's irrelevant, it's all a matter of interpretation, of names and words, right?

Best
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#44246 - 11/19/10 03:37 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Lamar]
OrgasmicKarmatic Offline
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Registered: 08/01/10
Posts: 256
Loc: Michigan, USA
 Originally Posted By: Lamar

Ok, resonating with the philosophy that LaVey set forth and calling yourself the label he attached does not make you a conformist. There are many LaVeyan Satanists who do not agree with every single think the man said.

"No one is going to say exactly what a Satanist is"
LaVey has doing exactly this in the Satanic Bible. I do not recognize any other group claiming to be Satanists as such because prior to LaVey, Satanism as a religion did not exist. So to me (I could give a shit what anyone else thinks) a Satanist is one who is compatible with the Satanic Bible. All otheres are irrelevant.


You have misunderstood what I have said in reference to conformance. In fact, you missed it completely. Let me re-explain what I was saying before more words are put into my mouth here.

What I ACTUALLY said was and I quote: "You can conform to LaVey and still be nothing but a conformist. This does not make you a Satanist." I did NOT say that if you do indeed follow completely the tenets of the Laveyan Satanist that you are
in fact, a conformist. Get your foot out of your mouth, uncover your eyes.

You said that there are many of those that call themselves Laveyan Satanists but do not agree with everything that he said in this post but previously you had the nuts to tell someone else that the one true Satanism (hehe reminds me of Blackwood only in reverse in this case) was the Satanism that completely followed the Satanic Bible and what LaVey outlined himself. Again, throw me a bone here DUDE, and decide what you really are saying.

Again, I really want to stress that I do not disagree with the significance Lavey had on Satanism in rounding everyone up and laying out basic outlines. However, Satanism has evolved into much more than this and it is not the 60's anymore. Thoughts on Satanism have changed from what was outlined into so much more and, for those whom have chosen to be proactive with it, it has been very beneficial. Unfortunately, all this seems lost on you. Which is okay because push comes to shove I would rather have the proactive than the other side of the line.

Also, you state that Satanism was not a religion before LaVey. Satanism, in my mind at least, does not constitute as a religion to me period but to entertain you, that is a false statement. In fact, Satanism was considered to be anything heretical to the christian belief system before it was re-modified by LaVey.


Oh and by the way, perhaps you should start talking in specifics if you are going to attack certain groups. Surely, you are not a mind reader and neither is anyone else.


Edited by OrgasmicKarmatic (11/19/10 03:46 PM)
Edit Reason: Adding the third cent
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#44247 - 11/19/10 04:02 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Dan_Dread]
Fnord Offline
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Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: Dan_Dread
I certainly do not fall into any of those silly categories.


I've yet to meet a Satanist who's entirely comfortable being categorized and/or classified by someone else.

The video's attempt to do just that is somewhat ironic. "If you don't fit neatly into one of these three categories then you fail to be an individual." Hah!
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#44248 - 11/19/10 04:16 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: OrgasmicKarmatic]
Fnord Offline
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Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
 Originally Posted By: OrgasmicKarmatic

However, Satanism has evolved into much more than this and it is not the 60's anymore. Thoughts on Satanism have changed from what was outlined into so much more and, for those whom have chosen to be proactive with it, it has been very beneficial.


How has the thought current changed so much since TSB was written? What specific changes do you see and what do you see as 'so much more'? Also, how are people who embraced foundational Satanic principles 40 years ago so much different than people who embrace foundational Satanic principles today?


 Originally Posted By: OrgasmicKarmatic
Which is okay because push comes to shove I would rather have the proactive than the other side of the line.


Proactive? Do you mean with regard to the individual or with regard to Satanists en toto?
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#44249 - 11/19/10 05:01 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Fnord]
Dan_Dread Offline
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3934
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
 Originally Posted By: Dan_Dread
I certainly do not fall into any of those silly categories.


I've yet to meet a Satanist who's entirely comfortable being categorized and/or classified by someone else.

The video's attempt to do just that is somewhat ironic. "If you don't fit neatly into one of these three categories then you fail to be an individual." Hah!


I am no enemy of categorization or classification. My problem here is that his categories are narrow and arbitrary, and don't really serve any practical function as they don't describe anything representing reality.

We are defined by language after all, and I prefer clarity to obfuscation when it comes to definition.

What he provides is a caricature that borders on satire(albeit unintended on his part), in no way representative of how the substance behind the form is manifesting.

In short, the video is bullshit.
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#44250 - 11/19/10 05:05 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Dan_Dread]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
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 Quote:
In short, the video is bullshit.


This pretty much sums it all up. There might be some people who can be so easily pinned down but they are the exception. Whoever made this video is guilty of creating a false trichotomy. Yes, I did just make that word up so don't anyone bother telling me it isn't actually a word.
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#44251 - 11/19/10 05:12 PM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: Fnord]
OrgasmicKarmatic Offline
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Posts: 256
Loc: Michigan, USA
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
How has the thought current changed so much since TSB was written? What specific changes do you see and what do you see as 'so much more'? Also, how are people who embraced foundational Satanic principles 40 years ago so much different than people who embrace foundational Satanic principles today?


I can actually answer this with quite ease. The world around us today has changed in significant ways. For example, the ability to be so open with everything. In the world today, you can find out anything about anyone just as long as you have the will to do so. The stepping up and out of the individual is glaringly more obvious now than they were back then. From most that I have read Satanism as we knew it then was more of a "us vs them/collective we" activity. While I will agree that there are still those that actively live in such a way, most are liable to agree that they follow an individualists path.

The so much more.. Satanism offers so much to the individual as it always has. That will never change but it has evolved. It has learned to adapt and manifest in a new age. Satanism is treated differently and while a main outline is the TSB, individuals are not necessarily finding it completely binding as to the end all and be all of "who or what is a Satanist". As for what I personally see, I see members out there being more proactive with their lives and surroundings more than ever. Maybe it's because I am actually looking and finding these things, these people. Unfortunately, good with the bad, there are just as many out there that do not quite fit the bill. Alas, there always will be those people.

I also see a switch from the herd to the focus on the individual. I feel this is an extremely different and important thing for Satanism as it is a perspective of self.


 Originally Posted By: Fnord


Proactive? Do you mean with regard to the individual or with regard to Satanists en toto?


As much as I would like to see Satanists as a whole be proactive, not everyone is going to be. (Which leads me to question if these individuals are actually Satanists.. but who am I to say?) I am more referring to the individuals that ARE being proactive. There are a few of us.. we can spot each other out. I am certain that you are of no difference when it comes to spotting pro-activity.
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#44263 - 11/20/10 04:11 AM Re: The Three SatanicTypes [Re: OrgasmicKarmatic]
mabon2010 Offline
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Registered: 09/29/10
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I have read the comments with interest.

One thing we can all agree on is that nobody seems to be able to agree about what Satanism is, or who is a Satanist. It is all subjective, and relative to the individual state of mind.

Like anything that is created by people, there will always be those who complain or criticise, but do they attempt to put forward their own work or creations? No.

The hardened Satanist, who through experience knows their spiritual path like the back of their hand, may disagree with some or all the video, however, the video offers a useful service by countering ideas amongst the great unwashed that Satanists are no child sacrificing nutjobs. For the noob new to Satanism, the video offers a taste of what is on offer, consider it like a child's first ABC book, then they may delve into any of the three suggested "types" further, then make their own choice of what Satanism means to them, and to what path they wish to follow.


Edited by mabon2010 (11/20/10 04:13 AM)
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