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#7900 - 04/18/08 08:11 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Dev Samael Daval]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
I just wanted to contribute a little bit more on this topic:

-MMR vaccine mediums: Chicken embryo (Mumps and Measles), human diploid cells originating from human aborted fetal tissue.
-Orimune/Polio virus vaccine medium: Monkey kidney cell culture.

I'll have more on this a little later when I read up more on this site that I was referred to:

http://www.naturodoc.com/library/public_health/vaccine_who_how.htm

I'm not one who usually believes everything that I read on the net but this affects me directly.


Edited by Sinistar (04/18/08 08:17 AM)
Edit Reason: grammar correction
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#7904 - 04/18/08 09:36 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
ta2zz Offline
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Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

Again I add welcomed to the poisoned world... Recently in the news plastic and the chemicals that leech from it in baby's bottles and bottled water... Why is the world years behind commonsense thinking?

Which plastic water bottles don't leach chemicals?

Other poisons...

TOXIC CHEMICAL BPA LEACHING INTO CANNED FOODS

~T~
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We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#7909 - 04/18/08 11:45 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
Stag Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 84
 Quote:
I'm not one who usually believes everything that I read on the net but this affects me directly.


I would caution that an online store hawking 'natural health remedies' may not be the most impartial, or accurate, source of information about vaccine-related risks. If you have genuine health concerns, go and see your doctor.

Stag

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#7912 - 04/18/08 01:14 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Stag]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
With all due respect, seeing a doctor is part of the problem. I'm okay health-wise. I raise all these concerns about poisons and the government agencies that are in the back pocket of the pharmaceutical companies that make these wonderful vaccines. They've silenced our children with their possible chemically induced Autism for the sake of making millions of dollars. There is a very real possible link between vaccinations and Autism. When you look at some of the mediums utilized, it shouldn't be surprising.

Thimersol, the preservative used in vaccines (49% Mercury by weight) is also used in pet vaccines, immune globaline preparations, certain skin test antigens, antiveins, ophthamalic and some nasal products, and tattoo inks (Sorry Ta2zz).

Eli Lilly is the maker of this fine product and past board members include George H.W. Bush, Kenneth Lay (Enron) and Indiana governor Mitch Daniels (also former Director of Office of Management and Budget for George W. Bush).

I do appreciate the information on vaccine ingredients but I remain wary of buying natural health remedies, Stag. Everybody seems to be full of shit nowadays...Too bad my son and the rest of the 1 in 150 children diagnosed with Autism have to suffer.


Edited by Sinistar (04/18/08 01:19 PM)
Edit Reason: Spelling
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#7914 - 04/18/08 03:10 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
Stag Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 84
 Quote:
I raise all these concerns about poisons and the government agencies that are in the back pocket of the pharmaceutical companies that make these wonderful vaccines. They've silenced our children with their possible chemically induced Autism for the sake of making millions of dollars.


Are you actually implying that the government of every single country on Earth, the World Health Organisation and the entire global scientific and medical community, are all part of a conspiracy engineered to cover-up the true risks of thiomersal, so that Eli Lilly can continue to make money on it? Do you really believe your family physician would wilfully poison you or your family for the sake of a kick-back from Big Pharma?

(if that's the case, why has the use of thimerosal in vaccine dropped since 1991?)

Those are some extremely serious allegations. Do you have any actual, hard evidence to back up this theory?

Stag


Edited by Stag (04/18/08 03:18 PM)
Edit Reason: spelling

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#7915 - 04/18/08 03:44 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Stag]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
I'm not a scientist so I'm afraid that I don't have the resources or the knowledge to acquire that evidence. My evidence is statistical and circumstantial, which I know wouldn't hold up in court.

I am in no way libeling the FDA or Eli Lilly. I've done the basic research and am disgusted with what's going on. I did say "possible". It's also a known fact that attorneys for the FDA now have lucrative jobs for Eli Lilly. I didn't imply every single government, just ours. The Food and Drug Administration to be specific.

There's even a Vaccination Injuries Court in which I hope to present my son's case. There are families that have actually won litigation. Believe me, these accusations are not new in the Autism Community.

As far as the use of Thimersol, the FDA and Eli Lilly actually say that they haven't used Thimersol since 2002 but have come under scrutiny because of hard, scientific evidence to the contrary.

Even the cattle ranchers have USDA stamps in their possession so that bad meat can be served to the American people. Money talks, bullshit walks. Dev Samael Daval is on to something by going vegan. I used to think of vegans as tree hugging liberals, but now I'm not so sure.

As far as poisoning everyone, I'm sure that it wasn't purposeful, but to continue with the practice is criminal.
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#7917 - 04/18/08 04:16 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
Stag Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 84
Whilst the causes of autistic spectrum disorders remain largely unknown, many more people such as yourself will have to suffer the horrible uncertainty of not knowing how, or why their child contracted this disease. I cannot begin to imagine what this must be like.

All the more important then, that we are able to discriminate facts from idle conjecture. Conspiracy theories such as the ones evidenced in this thread only serve to muddy the political waters, making genuine medical research into autism that much more difficult. There're also the very real dangers associated with declining vaccine uptake, brought about as a direct result of the fear these theories generate.

 Quote:
There's even a Vaccination Injuries Court in which I hope to present my son's case. There are families that have actually won litigation. Believe me, these accusations are not new in the Autism Community.

It is important to note that medical facts are established through controlled clinical trials, not in the courtroom. Though I wish you every success in your case, any outcome will have little bearing upon the medical understanding of autism.

Vaccination is not, and never has been, wholly without risks -- but then neither is the alternative. A sound public health policy should be able to balance up all these risks based on the best medical science we have available at the time.

Stag

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#7921 - 04/18/08 07:22 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

 Originally Posted By: Sinistar
Thimersol, the preservative used in vaccines (49% Mercury by weight) is also used in pet vaccines, immune globaline preparations, certain skin test antigens, antiveins, ophthamalic and some nasal products, and tattoo inks (Sorry Ta2zz).

I say bullshit... Although some reds do contain mercury the key is knowing which...

"Cinnabar (mercuric sulfide) used in red tattoo inks can lead to allergic reactions and scarring. Tsuruta et al. reported a case of a 40-year-old Japanese man with a red tattoo who developed a whole-body rash after eating 250 g of raw swordfish and alfonsino.19 In this case the mercuric tattoo pigments caused the initial sensitization to mercury in the patient, producing a delayed hypersensitivity reaction.

Subsequent exposure of the patient to mercury-containing products either through ingestion/inhalation/injection (mercury vapor, mercury-laden fish, vaccines, toxoids, amalgam dental fillings) or direct contact (mercury-containing creams, contact lens solution) precipitated the allergic contact dermatitis.

While the ink compositions that are used in tattoos and permanent makeup are subject to FDA regulation, this has not been enforced. Importantly, no ink is approved for injection into the skin, which is what entails the actual practice of tattooing.20 Further compounding the difficulty in regulation is that manufacturers of inks and pigments are not required to reveal the contents, since the information is proprietary. Inks vary by manufacturer, even among like- colored pigments.

With the recent growth in popularity of tattoos, the FDA is taking a closer took at related safety questions regarding adverse reactions to tattoo colors."

tattoo inks

Furthermore ink is deposited under the skin not injected...

~T~
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We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#7956 - 04/19/08 02:51 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Stag]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
Admittedly, this topic hits home too hard so it's difficult to be subjective in this case. I thank you for your empathy and hope that you wouldn't have to walk in the same shoes, sir.

Yes, you are right about not establishing medical facts through the courts. I hope that you understand that I just find it difficult to trust the medical community's word at this time. I am currently at a loss when trying to figure out if I should vaccinate my son any further in the future.

Admittedly, this is the most heartbreaking thing that I've ever went through in my life. Just picture a happy healthy baby who used to smile at everyone that he came into contact with and then one day that happiness and personality all goes away. Imagine trying to communicate with your child and getting little to no eye contact. Or he just smiles at you blankly and his eyes show no understanding of what you are saying. Imagine a room full of toddlers and all of them are playing with each other, laughing, running, jumping, etc. and all the while your child retreats to a solitary corner of the room...in his own world. This is Autism, Stag.
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#7957 - 04/19/08 02:55 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: ta2zz]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
I read the link and hope that it is accurate. This is right up your alley and I wouldn't pretend as if I know more.

If you notice, I always keep my emoticon with a question mark because I welcome the enlightenment.

Somehow, I feel like the fat kid who got sucked up in that vat of milk chocolate...


Edited by Sinistar (04/19/08 03:32 AM)
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#7985 - 04/19/08 03:55 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Sinistar]
97and107 Offline
member


Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 267
Loc: New Mexico
I've had a lot of contact with Autism over the years, close friends, acquaintances, children of friends of the family it's funny but I never really noticed...that they were different.

They did seem more quiet. Maybe something about me draws Autistic people? I don't know...

Anyways don't give up hope, it gets better I'm sure. I just wanted to say that because sometimes saying how *not horrible* a disease is is just as good an observation as pointing out the negatives.

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#7989 - 04/19/08 07:26 PM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: 97and107]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
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Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Quote:
I am currently at a loss when trying to figure out if I should vaccinate my son any further in the future.


I also empathise with you. I just wanted to add this thought though.

I don't know how much leyway you are givin in the US (in Australia there is a little but not much) when it comes to vaccination, but maybe you could skip some of the less 'neccesary' ones. Like mumps and measels. And chicken pox.

I remember having ALL these diseases as a kid. They sucked, but aren't life threatening, in a big way at least, or likley to turn one into an invalid.

Maybe you can try to find some 'happy medium'.

As for the vegan thing, I get all nervy about meat sometimes, but only when it is 'factory farmed'.

Therefore I buy it from locol producers and slaughterers. None of this supermarket crap for me for either meat or vegetables.
The money I save and the quality I end up getting make the fact that I visit three or four different places to do my shopping well worth the effort.

Zeph
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It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8010 - 04/20/08 04:12 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: ZephyrGirl]
Stag Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 84
 Quote:
I don't know how much leyway you are givin in the US (in Australia there is a little but not much) when it comes to vaccination, but maybe you could skip some of the less 'neccesary' ones. Like mumps and measels. And chicken pox.

This tactic might work providing enough other children are vaccinated against these diseases. This is called herd immunity -- you're effectively relying on other, immunized people to act as a 'fire break' against infection, preventing the disease from reaching epidemic proportions. In other words, skipping vaccines is fine, so long as nobody else follows your example.

Measles itself is fairly innocuous, fatality rate ~0.1% to ~1%. However, its infection rate is so high that if it were allowed to go unchecked, the death toll would be significant. Not to mention the additional strain it would put on the health care system, to the detriment of those people suffering with wholly unpreventable diseases. This is why we have national immunisation programmes.

To pass on getting your child immunised for no reason other than base superstition, therefore relying on other parents not making the same mistake as you for your own child's wellbeing, is sychophantic in the extreme. If you have any evidence that these claims amount to anything more substantial, please let me know, I have yet to find any.

Furthermore, as previously stated the MMR vaccine, along with most vaccines used in childhood immunisation programmes, does not even contain thiomersal!

Stag

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#8011 - 04/20/08 04:42 AM Re: Mercury Rising - Vaccines & Autism [Re: Stag]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Quote:
If you have any evidence that these theories amount to anything more, please let me know, I have yet to find any.


I'm not interested in looking quite frankly. Both my children have been vaccinated successfully and I won't be having anymore children.

I also never said that I beleived anything about these theories either. But just as Sinistar has gotten personal because of his situation, I gave him a personal option, as obviously just reading the facts isn't making him feel any better about the immunization thing.

I wasn't advocating it as an option everyone and their dog should do.

Zeph
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Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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