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#48716 - 02/11/11 09:56 PM The Necessity of Evil for Evolution
Kali Offline
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Registered: 04/15/10
Posts: 33
(Hey everyone. I've been busy in college so I haven't had much time to surf this site. I'm working on writing an essay that conveys how evil is necessary to the survival of the human race. I'm not sure if it articulates everything to the best point. I know it might need some critique or criticism. Please tell me what you think, writing-wise, as well as view-wise. Do you agree? What are your thoughts?)

For the Love of Lucifer

I am a twenty-two year old woman who struggles with schizophrenia. I see a therapist, and recently we began doing meridian tapping and eye movement therapy. It’s amazing what the mind is capable of doing when trust is formed and you feel safe. The mind also has a natural survival mechanism on its own and possibly the greatest wonder of the universe. Sometimes, the amount of stability I enjoy in life makes me question whether I were schizophrenic at all, but I take medication and I survive. Surviving for as much time I can is my absolute goal. I also am learning in the process. I am learning about human nature and how evil is inherent to many situations. I’ve learned that coming to terms with hatred, cruelty, and evil helps us process reality and choose what we most appreciate in life. In my case it is justice, love, and honesty.

When I was fourteen I was struggling with racing thoughts, and I longed to fit into an awkward social scheme of behavior. Tight jeans, make-up, and relationships were hard for me to grow accustomed to. I remember that I watched a movie about a gothic girl who never fit in, and I identified so much with her on a deep level. She cut herself and disregarded the norms of society by drawing graffiti on the windows of a shopping mall. It was there that she made a friend with a man who helped her come to terms with her identity. Being young, the moral of the story was somewhat lost to me. I didn’t become gothic, but I absorbed myself in writing alone every day.

My stories, although I forget many of them, were somewhat erratic. After I went to a small Quaker boarding school, since my parents were afraid I couldn’t handle an over-crowded public school, I had even more issues with finding myself. I longed to fit in, but many of the students teased me and disregarded things I found important. Most of all, I was struggling not only with racing thoughts and neediness, but repressed experiences from my early childhood life.
During my episode, I had a sudden feeling of bright illumination. I didn’t necessarily believe I was Jesus, but that I had the right to think I was. So I stubbornly sat down in the bathroom stall of a hotel and prayed.

My parents hospitalized me, and although it was probably necessary, I was not able to handle the abuse of staff members at this hospital. I was isolated for not cooperating, they didn’t follow any procedure, and it was all to make me compliant with a system I felt was flawed. I believed I was strong enough to overcome my schizophrenia. But now, looking back, I believe it was probably the best thing for me despite the abuses. I was able to get back on my feet, and struggle to regain my sense of self. I learned to adapt, as the medication I found helped me. It balanced me in such a way that I could bring clarity and retrospection to my irrational fears. It took time, though.
I know there are some people who think that mental illness is just a sickness, but despite the truth about brain imbalances, there is a social context that the public needs to be aware of on a fundamental level. The basic social context is that hospitals should not be places where abuses can happen, it should not be a system made for compliance but a hospital needs to be a place to treat someone’s emotional and psychological hurts in many ways.

There are many people who I know that feel afraid to go to hospitals because they are not always the safest places. They say they would like a retreat, a place of safety in nature, or somewhere they can write out their feelings. I believe mental health has become too medication oriented. Not everyone has the money to seek out a good therapist. I am fortunate to have a family who cares about me, and helps support me so that I am a very stable individual. Yet, madness is almost an evil in and of itself. It is another evil necessary in the struggle of humanity.

Evil is necessary for the survival of humanity as a race and culture. That is to say that without evil there would be no night, no stars, nor a balance of opposites. Free will necessitates evil because as humans, we make mistakes by nature. To be a healthy human being in this world, we must come to terms with our demons. Those who repress their demons, whether consciously or unconsciously are merely lying to themselves. Evil exists within us all and is inherent to the human condition. We can choose to resist the temptation to do wrong, but in order to do that we must know what is wrong. Although evil deeds and purposely cruel actions lead to chaos, that chaos will eventually settle back into order. To know one’s own evil, is to know the temptation that every human possesses. Why would any individual possess such a quality? Evil is a part of evolution. It is something that we need not overcome by rising above it, but by integrating the pieces of our nature into the whole. By discarding evil, it only transfers to another source.

Energy is neither created nor destroyed, but knowledge conquers all. Conscious will is the path to individual enlightenment. The yin and yang of life, the cosmic egg, the revolving circle, and the morning star all point to the symbolic truth of the nature of evil. Evil is primal, both eternal and overwhelmingly powerful. It brings saints to their knees. I do not think that God, as a paternal far-reaching force in the sky, could prevent evil from coming to mankind. Evil is just as a part of God as madness.

Is madness evil? Madness is a part of the human condition, and there-fore an aspect of survival. I don't consider it evil in the sense, although I'm not certain that it isn't necessary. How can a complete destruction of the mind, or the nuclear bomb dropped on a third world country ever be good? It’s not good, but it teaches humans to use their hands and their minds to find alternatives. When faced with an evil such as war, those who think with their hearts will follow them toward a peaceful better world. Those with hands will build towers not on sand, and those with a voice will sing. Evil is an abstract notion that reveals the innermost core of the individual, and also the eternal, the changing, the stagnant, and the dark.

The night blankets the world in illumination.
Evil urges a man to do what he desires, out of hatred and passion. Does this passion have any result that is worthy of man? It does, in fact, but only through those who pick up the pieces. Should criminals get away with murder? No, I don’t think they should. And yet, evil cannot be contained unless society approaches it with an open mind, with conscious realization of the evil within us all. We must learn to survive not out of hatred for each-other, but out of necessity to continue to greater pursuits.

Coming terms with madness has helped shed light on the true nature of humanity. If you consciously choose to do something evil, you are only shedding illumination of the rottenness within you. A person who commits a crime should be punished, not just in a moral sense, but also helped in a cultural sense.

They should be rehabilitated so that they can come back to the real world as good people, but punishment needs to be something a human learns to accept. For punishment is also a fundamental aspect of human nature. We punish each other all the time. Those who deserve punishment are those who share no value to society. They are those who do nothing but take away from people i.e. killers and abusers. To build a tower just to see it fall is a form of self-mutilation, for humanity needs a strong-hold to continue on and progress.

Lucifer teaches us to touch the deepest scariest places of ourselves, and learn to cope with them in the best way we can. The only sin of Lucifer is ignorance. If you ignore the pain that bleeds, it will continue to bleed. Lucifer is much like the pain we feel when we get hurt, he is a warning to come to terms with our psychological needs. He is not necessarily a dark demon of hell, but he is the warning of what ignorance leads to. We part from ourselves through obeying evil, and we become better people by conquering it, acknowledging it, and moving through it.

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#48733 - 02/12/11 09:59 AM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
Jason King Offline
Banned/Martyrdom Denied
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Registered: 10/24/10
Posts: 731
Loc: 65?1%833Q!92A24 (It's a code)
 Originally Posted By: Kali
Energy is neither created nor destroyed, but knowledge conquers all. Conscious will is the path to individual enlightenment. The yin and yang of life, the cosmic egg, the revolving circle, and the morning star all point to the symbolic truth of the nature of evil. Evil is primal, both eternal and overwhelmingly powerful.


Kali, welcome. I've said this before, and I'll say it again now, Kali was the most proper glyph of the Master ever given. But anywho . . .

I chose a small portion of your post on which to reply simply because I'd like others to appreciate the depth of it and rejoin where they might see fit.

Constructive criticism: you pulled the term "evil" out of an undefined "hat," seeing as how every time you have introduced it, you were doing little more than assuming a contextual meaning which has never been provided.

In the material of yours quoted above, I do not see how any of the priors (e.g. energy, consciousness, life, yin/yang, etc.) establish either the necessity or facticity of a thing/concept determined as "evil". In this sense, I am duty bound to call you on a argumentum non sequitur, and if I can be frank, perhaps the only bald case thereof which has met my experience.

You appear to be assuming facts not in evidence, which may or may not invalidate your thesis, depending on how you choose to refabricate said thesis for further discussion/exploration. You have things of substance to communicate, I do not deny you that. But you need to shore up your logic a bit . . .

JK
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#48736 - 02/12/11 11:26 AM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2399
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
"in Italy for 30 years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance. In Switzerland they had brotherly love - they had 500 years of democracy and peace, and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock." - Harry Lime (Orson Welles) in The Third Man, 1949
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#48740 - 02/12/11 12:28 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Jason King]
Kali Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/15/10
Posts: 33
Thanks for the critique. You basically say what I was worried about in my essay. I picked up a book called "The Lucifer Principle" which goes on to describe how genetics, society, and etc. are influenced by evil and how it is necessary for human evolution. I haven't read the book yet, but this was the idea I was trying to articulate. The book is dense, and the concept is more existential I think.

Is evil i.e. corruption, war, cruelty for cruelty's sake at all a valuable tool in today's culture? Does it further the human race because we learn to acknowledge our darkness, and move through it? I really need to work out my thesis.


Thanks for the help though. I think I have more clarity on what I want to say now. It's just a matter of thinking outside the box and coming up with a way to represent it.

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#48742 - 02/12/11 12:36 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
There is no evil; there are only moral interpretations of certain behavior or actions.

You might find value in Nietzsche's work upon morals and master-slave morality, and his notes upon Will to Power. WtP is the foundation the Lucifer Principle is based upon.

D.

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#48743 - 02/12/11 12:36 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
Kali Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/15/10
Posts: 33
Good quote!

And I think it's true. War-faring cultures/countries adapt far more quickly than those who just sit around and ignore the world around them. What I also meant is that there should be a justified cause to war. Evil is an action with no justifiable cause.

I use the term evil abstractly, but in my essay barely got to the bones of it. I wrote it for fun anyways, it's not for a contest or class, so it's harder to get motivated to just write for writing's sake for me. There has to be a goal.

I was hoping it would spark some debate, but I didn't define evil enough.

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#48744 - 02/12/11 12:38 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Diavolo]
Kali Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/15/10
Posts: 33
I was tempted to pick up Nietzsche in the college bookstore, but instead I got 1984 and Cat's Cradle...both classics I haven't yet read. I will definitely continue to look into Nietzsche, I think we have some books on him at my house.
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#48759 - 02/12/11 03:42 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
TheInsane Offline
member


Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 356
As others have said all of what you wrote tends to fall flat because you never define the very core of what the essay is supposed to be about. For something like this you need a definition of evil which you never give.

Personally it seems to me that you divide between creative (good) and destructive (evil). To me neither is good not evil. Good and evil are terms coined in regards to concious action. But hey thats just me.

I do agree with JK that Kali probably is the best representation of a "Satanic divinity" there is. Very fascinating mythology surrounds her and she isnt at all what some people seem to think she is.

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#48768 - 02/12/11 10:57 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: TheInsane]
XiaoGui17 Offline
active member


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 1076
Loc: Amarillo, TX
While evil remained undefined, Nietzsche was the first source that occurred to me. I'm glad to see Diavolo mentioned him.

Here is the seat of the origin of the famous antithesis “good” and “evil”:—power and dangerousness are assumed to reside in evil, a certain dreadfulness, subtlety, and strength, which do not admit of being despised. According to slave-morality, therefore, the “evil” man arouses fear; according to master-morality, it is precisely the “good” man who arouses fear and seeks to arouse it…
-Slave and Master Morality
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Texas is to 'Murika what 'Murika is to the rest of the world.

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#48801 - 02/13/11 10:25 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: XiaoGui17]
myk5 Offline
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Registered: 01/24/11
Posts: 137
Without touching on good or evil, because I personally am selfish enough to think such terms only exist relative to my self interest, I will suggest the evolutionary biologist Steven J. Gould has an answer: the strength of a species is its DIVERSITY!

Simply, a community that has both political hawks and doves, for a coarse example, is best prepared for cooperation or war as is necessary. A community overwhelmed by one or the other will fail when circumstances make the minority or non existent point of view the only point of view for continued survival.

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#48835 - 02/14/11 08:52 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: myk5]
paolo sette Offline
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Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 263
Loc: IL, USA
 Quote:
Please tell me what you think, writing-wise, as well as view-wise. Do you agree? What are your thoughts?)


Evilness shows how much "becoming whole" means to the wrongdoer, criminal, felon, gangster, murderer, pshcho-sociopath, lawbreaker, sinner, troublemaker and/or villain. Preoccupation with the riddles of Evilness may perhaps stiffen the spine of the faint-hearted person or provide spectacles for his/her shortsightedness, so that from 'the gloomy hole in the wall' the evilness in the doer may enjoy at least a glimpse of the world of experience which is shrouded in a mist of delusions. It will certainly not end badly for the villain, for those who are terrified will be infiltrated by corruption as well as everthing of significance by the helpful idea of reason.

Do not underestimate the depth of Evilness, or to assume any kind of cheap thrill in Evil. The zealously nurtured attitude of credulity towards the treasure of thought is a lesser danger than pure root-Evilness which is fortunately many marvellously incomprehensible words as in Devil-cults. And, Evilness demands intelligence and Will-power as do all the greater things which desire to become real.

Evil is Real.

666
_________________________
tathagata-svapratyatma-aryajnana-adhigama
666
[nig]-ge-na-da a-ba in-da-di nam-ti i-u-tu

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#48841 - 02/14/11 11:46 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: paolo sette]
myk5 Offline
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Registered: 01/24/11
Posts: 137
Re: Paolo:
A bit of a thread drift to go from 'is evil necessary to evolution', to an examination of evil itself.

But I am game.

First, I don't agree that a wrongdoer = criminal = criminal = felon = gangster = murderer = sociopath = lawbreaker = sinner = troublemaker = villain. Sociopaths are handicapped. A wrong doer doing wrong is almost never doing wrong from the subject's subjective point of view. 'Law breaker' includes Xtian Jesus, no?
'Sinner' is entirely an abstraction. A murderer may be defending himself, most are.

There's no real relatedness to evil in your examples. I think a better example may be the 'vulture' investor who buys discounted 3rd world debt, and then bribes the 3rd world dictator to agree to bankrupt his nation to pay back the full balance. In that example there's willful destruction of the well being of an entire countries people to sate personal greed. There's no self delusion, justification or brain damage to get in the way of the wrong.

I've known a kind of evil, but from perspective real evil comes forth from weakness, stupidity and blindness. A more interesting evil I found in sales, a kind of blinding greed. It escaped me, but I saw others empowered by it and grow rich.

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#48875 - 02/15/11 05:08 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
Autodidact Offline
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Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: Kali
Evil is an action with no justifiable cause.

I use the term evil abstractly, but in my essay barely got to the bones of it. I wrote it for fun anyways, it's not for a contest or class, so it's harder to get motivated to just write for writing's sake for me.


You have just defined your own essay as "evil".

Regarding your pseudo-definition: isn't "justifiable" a subjective judgment? Who gets to determine if something is "justified"? Is it all actions, or some subset? Who decides which subset? Is the judgment a strict dichotomy (good/evil), or is it a range?
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An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?

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#48886 - 02/15/11 07:00 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: Kali]
MatthewJ1
Unregistered



If someone or something can be defined as "evil" or as "immoral" or as "unnatural" etc. then one has the excuse needed to take action against that which is defined as "evil" or "immoral" etc. in the form of exclusion or punitive measures, such as punishment or even violence and conquest.

If human history has taught anything, then it has taught that human beings create factions, parties, nations, communities etc. within which leaders and followers exist. These factions, parties, nations etc. war against one another in myriad forms for domination. The articulation of "evil" is a well used tactic in the struggle for control.

One should not ask: what does "evil" mean, but rather what effect does this word "evil" have in a particular context and for a particular faction. Or, what use does this word have at a given point in time.

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#48889 - 02/15/11 08:39 PM Re: The Necessity of Evil for Evolution [Re: ]
paolo sette Offline
member


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 263
Loc: IL, USA
 Quote:
There's no real relatedness to evil in your examples.


 Quote:
I've known a kind of evil, but from perspective real evil comes forth from weakness, stupidity and blindness.


I would not under any circumstances have it understood that in what I have written above I am making any recommendation or offering any advice. But, when you begin to discuss Evilness I consider it my duty to show you where my entrance lies to that "longest of all roads" which leads to root-Evil, and the difficulties strewn on the path are amaurotic to you; whereas, the path has been trodden by individuals that stood steadfast as a beacon on a mountain. It would be a mistake to assume that Evil is to be met with anywhere and/or anyone (and you are included) below those heights.

For a complete experience of Evilness, there can be nothing smaller or cheaper than the whole (root-Evil). The significance of this can be understood by the consideration of the fact that consciousness is only a part of Evilness, and is never capable of completeness: for the indefinite expansion of root-Evil (unconsciousness) is needed. By your estimates, you can neither capture with your formulae nor exorcize Evil by means of your scientific dogmas as it is seen as inescapable destiny.

The attainment of completeness calls for use of the whole (root-Evil). Nothing less will do; hence, there can be no easy conditions, substitutions or compromise.

You drag forth the vocabulary of pathology that you condemn with "psychosis" or "anxiety" terminology; then, whisper about a creative mystery as you relate to psychopathology--- but, what can a person who is probably not a poet create? (Think about that.) By you flocking to the misunderstanding of modern times caused many people to call themselves "artists." (You would call them convicts.) As if "art" (breaking the law) had nothing at all to do with "ability" (it takes a person to engage in Evil acts).

If you have nothing to create, perhaps you create yourself (delusion).


p.s.-- I am a proponent of Evilness that has engaged pure, root-Evil.
_________________________
tathagata-svapratyatma-aryajnana-adhigama
666
[nig]-ge-na-da a-ba in-da-di nam-ti i-u-tu

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