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#51559 - 03/22/11 10:33 AM Re: Secret Societies [Re: SatanicVeteran]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
Alex Jones' expose on The Bohemian Grove was interesting IMO.

Granted, I don't know that it really means anything other than our 'leaders' are possibly engaged in some activities that the local church marms would likely find unpalatable.

Skull and Bones, Bohemian Grove (maybe shared memberships?), Bilderberg ... all 'secret' societies that work to control the economy. Funny thing is, these days these folks can come right out say that's what they're doing because the general populace is too stupid to react. Hell, Obama got elected after he said he would 'skyrocket' energy costs to the average consumer.

Ironically, JFK had some interesting things to say about deals cut behind closed doors.

I think Aquino said somewhere around here that the 'truth' is whatever conspiracy the public is willing to buy/support.

The mistake is in assuming that people in (real) power hold honorable intentions. First and foremost, they're in it for themselves (just like us).
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#51563 - 03/22/11 12:34 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Fnord]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
Indeed, people are not only into power to make our lives better. It might be a side-effect of what they are doing but it hardly is as important as what it does to them.

I find conspiracy theories, although occasionally quite entertaining, not that important. Not that I don't think people are deciding or manipulating certain events but because it is of lesser importance than those memeweavers who are subtly creating that which controls our thinking.

And yes, that's conspiracy theory too.

D.

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#51569 - 03/22/11 02:06 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Fnord]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
stalker


Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 2514
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
 Originally Posted By: Fnord
Alex Jones' expose on The Bohemian Grove was interesting IMO.

... As previously discussed ...
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#51572 - 03/22/11 02:23 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Michael A.Aquino]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
Icke is a nutcase in my opinion.

My only observation is that it's interesting that all these leaders get together to have meetings at the grove under what appear to be weird circumstances. I've heard Bush Jr. and Clinton both asked about it and neither denied it nor would they go into any sort of detail about it.

Why is it that anyone who asks about it is immediately thought of as a conspiracy nut? It's the same way with 9-11. A LOT doesn't make sense about that day but whenever it's brought up people act like if you don't believe the 9-11 commission you are some kind of nut. Who knows, maybe I am a nut.

By the way, that article has nothing to do with Jones' interviews etc.
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#51576 - 03/22/11 03:17 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Fnord]
JMM Offline
stranger


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 29
Loc: Michigan
Holy crap. What an awesome group of answers. I'm starting a secret society of my own. I'm gonna call it "they". Then as its founder I will be able to take credit for nearly every accomplishment or disaster I choose. Everyone will still say "they did it" but I will finally bring a personal identification to "they". And the splinter faction of my group will be "them". All bases covered.

Honestly though I think all of you touched on the fact that the biggest group of collective secret societies still lay in the realm of christianity throughout the past 2k years. I read some of alister crowleys involvement in "the golden dawn" when I was reading about enochian majick, but Hunter S.Thompson wrote in "the gonzo pages" a much more toned down and sarcastic point of view on them basically calling the whole group "an excuse for the church to throw organized orgies commit sodomy without having to answer to the public" (I'm paraphrasing, and EVERYTHING Thompson wrote seemed to be a sarcastic jab at someone,)

but for TODAYS society the concept. Of needing any "secret societies" seems obsolete. We americans have allowed every disrespectful or shameful act of any group of more than 2 people to be allowed and constitutionally accepted under the 1st amendment anyway,(flag burning, protesting american soldier funerals, etc...)
so why even be secretive about it? Honestly if I were in the corner of the local Wal-mart pk lot with a flaming Pentagram or whatever religious symbol freaks out the religious right the most, at midnight, covered in green pudding liggting my farts, probably only 40% of the population would even slow down as they passed by. Someone would probably call the cops eventually, and I may be charged with lighting a fire on private property without a permit, but I really doubt they would even shrug their shoulders at what I was actually doing. Hahahaa.
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#51583 - 03/22/11 04:52 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: JMM]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: JMM
but for TODAYS society the concept. Of needing any "secret societies" seems obsolete.


As long as everything you do is legal and socially acceptable, and you have no issues with your person or papers being publicly accessible forever, then yeah, there's no need for secrecy at all.

And since we all know that people in general are tolerant and understanding, carefully checking their facts before passing judgment on the actions of others, and even then tend to discuss issues in a logical, unemotional way, you should also have no qualms about groups you associate with, the actions they do, the social positions they hold or support, or anything that could possibly be misconstrued or taken out of context, now or in the future, to negatively affect your life, your job, your family, your community, or that of your family's.

That, of course, is in the civilized world, but I believe most of that applies to the second- and third-world as well.
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#51593 - 03/22/11 07:10 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Autodidact]
JMM Offline
stranger


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 29
Loc: Michigan
Makes sense. What you described is a society that is tolerant, well maintained through logic and common sense and maintained by a general respect of each other.

Wish it were real.

But the really cool thing about this site...and I mean this...is that it isn't a run-of-the-mill "theology" site. I am constantly suprised and impressed with how respectful and well thought out a lot of these posts really are.

Now...how to carry that to the outside world...a world where people are generally intolerant, impatient, and quick to jump the gun into a fight over something as petty as a parking spot, even to the extreme end of that "civilized" spectrum where its socially acceptable to disown ones own son/ daughter for being gay-or as I like to call it: honestly loving another person regardless of what everyone thinks. Well that's the real trick isn't it?
Funny how all of our "civilized" rules and moral codes are based on a belief system that is so quick to judge and carry out sentence even on ones own flesh and blood, and its a site called "the 600 club, satanist community" , a name alone that would make a "good" christian cringe, that I have found some of the best and rarest qualities humans have to offer. Its the first site I have ever been on that I actually have gotten razzed a few times but I respected the other person enough not to get shitty with them. Hell...it made sense... even if I'm wrong I win here. I actually LEARN something. \:\)

Just my opinion, but if there WERE to be a true "secret society" and its goal were to be for the betterment of mankind, and they were to somehow be able to spread that to humankind in a way that people could understand and apply....wouldn't THIS site be a good example of one?


Edited by JMM (03/22/11 07:14 PM)
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#51599 - 03/22/11 07:48 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Fnord]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1640
Loc: Orlando, FL
Bohemian Grove is a rather enigmatic affair, but in all likelihood, probably bears little resemblance to the horror-novel conspiracies people have dreamed up in the absence of real information.

When the more impressionable conspiracy theorists do not immediately grasp the underlying causes of a problem, or encounter uncertainty of any sort-- their immediate reaction is to fill this void with the most horrible and absurd fantasies their subconscious can dream up. Rather than being based on objective and continually-tested research, these delusions are made into a "canon narrative" of sorts, and unquestioningly repeated ad nauseam like dogma-- the only variation stemming from tailoring this mythology to fit in with a person's particular metaphysical prejudices (Christianity, Ancient Astronautism, etc).

Counting esotericism into the equation is even more problematic, since most conspiracy theorists understand nothing intimately about occultism or the Hermetic Mysteries. To them, "THE OCCULT" is this terrifying nebulous mass of secrecy that the "world order" uses to control humanity. It is not anything natural or humanly understandable, just some big scary "thing" we should all be afraid of. Consequently, conspiracy moguls like to lump together collections of random words and oversimplify complex religious and occult concepts to cover up the obvious fact that they are full of shit.

For instance, Alex Jones, in commenting upon the recent footage of the Bohemian grove, confidently asserted that the ritual was an "ancient Canaanite, Luciferian, Babylon mystery religion ceremony" venerating the statue of an Owl, a "symbol of Moloch".

The most obvious problem with this sort of thing is that it is a clear scare tactic-- spitting out a bunch of disparate arcane-sounding words to make any sort of ceremony appear "evil". And anyone with the faintest familiarity with history and mythology can tell you that Canaanite religion had little to do with Babylonian religion (two completely different nations, languages, and practices), the term "Luciferian" has too many implicit connections with late European religion to be applied to the ancient mysteries of the middle-east, and that Moloch was never worshiped in Babylon, much less associated with owls.

I have seen other such people regurgitate his phrasing, excepting throwing in words like "Freemasonic", "Zionist", "Satanic", or "Reptilian" according to their personal taste. The more these stories circulate, the more it becomes clear that they're all just pulling it out of their asses as they go along.

 Quote:
Just my opinion, but if there WERE to be a true "secret society" and its goal were to be for the betterment of mankind, and they were to somehow be able to spread that to humankind in a way that people could understand and apply....wouldn't THIS site be a good example of one?


We LHP types are generally too bitter, self-interested, and misanthropic to care about the "betterment of mankind". We are too elitist to care if anyone else thinks the same way. Plus it's hard to be "secret" when you operate on a mostly-public message board. Unless, of course, you count the super-secret Illumaniti meetings we have in the Blue forum.


Edited by The Zebu (03/22/11 08:06 PM)
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#51604 - 03/22/11 08:56 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: JMM]
Autodidact Offline
member


Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
 Originally Posted By: JMM
Makes sense. What you described is a society that is tolerant, well maintained through logic and common sense and maintained by a general respect of each other.

Wish it were real.


I don't. Those traits give me a leg up on the general populace, and allow me to make a pretty good living.

 Originally Posted By: JMM
Now...how to carry that to the outside world...a world where people are generally intolerant, impatient, and quick to jump the gun into a fight [...]


Why would you want to "carry that to the outside world"? A man is responsible for his own actions. In the "outside world", all those people act of their own free will and they choose to be intolerant, impatient, and quick to anger. A Satanist doesn't have to implement stratification - all he has to do is see that it happens all by itself.

 Originally Posted By: JMM
Funny how all of our "civilized" rules and moral codes are based on a belief system that is so quick to judge and carry out sentence even on ones own flesh and blood


What do you expect from a religion that eats its own god?

Their very first commandment demands intolerance, or at least that's how it's interpreted. The funny bit for me is that Jesus, assuming he was actually real, seemed to be the Rodney King of his time, preaching "Hey, can't we just all get along?" ... but his followers very seldom act that way.

 Originally Posted By: JMM
I actually LEARN something. \:\)


Us too, JMM, us too.

 Originally Posted By: JMM
Just my opinion, but if there WERE to be a true "secret society" and its goal were to be for the betterment of mankind, and they were to somehow be able to spread that to humankind in a way that people could understand and apply....wouldn't THIS site be a good example of one?


No. Such a thing is not possible, as you yourself already agreed that a society of free people chooses not to act this way. To "better" mankind would necessarily involve behavioral adjustment, and necessarily be intrinsically tied to your definition of "better". There are numerous examples of such throughout history, and they ... didn't turn out so well.

Satanists realize the truth - man is essentially an animal, and acts like an animal most of the time. Making him "better" is a pipedream - he must "better" himself.


Edited by Autodidact (03/22/11 09:05 PM)
Edit Reason: fixed typo
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#51627 - 03/23/11 09:45 AM Re: Secret Societies [Re: The Zebu]
Fnord Offline
senior member


Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 2085
Loc: Texas
Zebu,

Exactly right. My own M.O. with regard to this sort of thing is to notice it, mark it as potentially odd and then question it. Most of the conspiracy theory folks go that one step further and weave fantasy into evidence to come up with an explanation.

In a way, it's much like religion who have (collectively) taken some past event(s) and woven fictional stories into them in an attempt to explain that which isn't clearly understood (also like history books).

Going back to Bohemian Grove as an example, I would say it's definitely odd that world leaders appear to be taking part in weird ceremonies in the woods as this isn't behavior normally ascribed to such people.

What it all means is speculation to anyone without further data (me, for example). Maybe they like playing naked in the woods. Personally, I can't begrudge them that.
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#51629 - 03/23/11 09:56 AM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Fnord]
mabon2010 Offline
member


Registered: 09/29/10
Posts: 259
Loc: The Commonwealth of Great Brit...
The ignorant write much rubbish about Luciferians and Luciferianism. The Illuminati and New World Order conspiracy nonsense is part of the wider need to explain the workings of the world by the sheep as that of "hidden hands", which is a variation of the "god" approach. The media feed this hysteria by their regular "men in black" type of television themes.

In reality the Luciferians dismiss such nonsense as does the Freemasons as the ravings of those prone to fantasy and delusions.

The Luciferian follows mainly a pathway of empowering themselves as gods rather than wasting their lives playing power games with sheep.


Edited by mabon2010 (03/23/11 09:59 AM)
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#52736 - 04/12/11 04:33 AM Re: Secret Societies [Re: HereticAiel]
Buer Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/12/11
Posts: 6
Hi everybody this is my first post and I have a lot to say about this topic. I can say that being in a group such as a "coven" is an absolute amazing thing to do. Not only does it open up your mind but it lets you see in a different perspective. Everyone in the coven or group is there for the same reason you are,(praise/expansion of knowledge. etc.) But these can be achieved in multiple ways. When combining all of your minds in praise and chants it fully opens your third eye, chakras, and the satanic energy around you.

Threw the years it has been told to me that some of the books of magick have been tainted and not as useful. But that certain groups of people have saved their books containing valuable information about certain rituals that fully unlock your human potential that has been constricted. A good example would be of the Kundalini Serpent for those of us who are familiar.

Also, just the word secret is a pull, it drags people to it increasing there curiosity in my view. ex. would have to be every person that looks over and sees someone whispering about them, it drives curiosity to the bone and makes you want to know, enticing you controlling your thoughts.

Also about the world leader thing:

many secret societies such as the bildenburg* Group, Skull & Bones, and Illuminati do have a lot in common. For one they are all said to be connected. Secondly they are said to house the leaders of the free world. And lastly they are all said to practice paganism beliefs and participate in rituals in secret.

Personal view:
Personally I think that the "secret" leaders of some of these "secret" societies do in fact have a very good tight bond with father Satan. It is said in " The Al Jilwah" That Satan himself does advise chosen people unlike any other person. Meaning that he gives them information that transforms into enlightenment.

It might be a little hard to understand, but this information is like information we learn everyday. A great example would be something like MATH, all of us know it and use it everyday, it solves problems and makes things easier. Imagine if you will meeting a group of people who knew nothing about numbers the advantage you would have over them, the power. This goes for the information that these chosen people have. It is impossible for us to know about it unless it is discovered and can hold much more importance than something such as math.


Edited by Buer (04/12/11 04:45 AM)
Edit Reason: thoughts

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#52796 - 04/13/11 12:46 AM Re: Secret Societies [Re: Buer]
The Zebu Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1640
Loc: Orlando, FL
 Quote:
" The Al Jilwah" That Satan himself does advise chosen people unlike any other person. Meaning that he gives them information that transforms into enlightenment.


What makes you think Satan is the author of the Al Jilwah? A being that wants humanity to 'conform to his commands' lest they be 'punished in another world' or endorses prophetry is more akin to Jehovah than the Devil, and simply cannot be the sinister genius of antinomianism that Satanists champion. Despite some superficial similarities in name only, the conservative, quasi-Islamic Yezidi religion does not resemble western Satanism in the slightest.

 Quote:
It might be a little hard to understand, but this information is like information we learn everyday. A great example would be something like MATH, all of us know it and use it everyday, it solves problems and makes things easier. Imagine if you will meeting a group of people who knew nothing about numbers the advantage you would have over them, the power.


The ancient Pythagoreans, (who, coincidentally, chose the two-points-up Pentagram as their symbol) did just that. Mathematics was seen as an occult science and a means of apprehending God. Nowadays fragments of their sacred doctrines are profanely cast before prepubescent swine in middle schools, but in the golden age of Hellas, geometry and arithmetic were quite esoteric.
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#52830 - 04/13/11 12:44 PM Re: Secret Societies [Re: mabon2010]
Hegesias Offline
active member


Registered: 02/16/11
Posts: 725
I just found that "hidden hand" shite and "project blue beam" I love these insane conspiracy theories and link them together to make even more silliness, I mixed it in with a post a while back because they theorise that the photon belt thingy is going to rapturize everybody so I had fun with it as they went so far as to make correlations with the demiurge of Chaos-Gnosticism that is actually the as above so below character for the ego in it's psychological metaphor. These theorists always have to take things out of context.

What is funny is that the secret society is the one we live in. What fucked up things go on behind closed doors and in family homes can be much more messed up than fiction, profoundly disturbed and fascinating. The mundane is not obvious so we have to look at things the way we do. Christianity may appear to be only in the churches and in particularly outspoken fanatics but the commoner Atheist can harbour decayed Christian morality, thus if he does, he is a godless Christian, which makes not much difference. Still there is the most subterranean conspiracy of all, the Christianity.
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