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#53097 - 04/18/11 08:10 AM Bending your destiny or future
SerpentEagle Offline
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Registered: 04/15/11
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Loc: Ethiopia
What do you think the possibility of changing events, one's destiny and undesired situation through intention or projections?
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#53098 - 04/18/11 08:59 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: SerpentEagle]
Diavolo Offline
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Intention means little when it is not accompanied by action. No change is possible without something actively triggering that change or manipulating the very probabilities which might, eventually, lead to it.

One can intent or project as much and as long as one likes but if there is no real "acting" behind it, anything which might or might not happen is solely in the hands of others.

D.

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#53133 - 04/19/11 09:25 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: SerpentEagle]
TutuAkomma Samue Offline
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Registered: 03/18/11
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Dear friends,Gezahegn wrote:" What do you think the possibility of changing events, one's destiny and undesired situation through intention or projections?"

In the past, I thought I could cause a positive change in my life by ''good intentions''. Little did I know that I needed to use a balance to achieve everything possible in my power.

The much more you use your mind,in the same way, use your hands.Think and talk,but,work and walk your ideas.
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#53160 - 04/19/11 06:34 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: TutuAkomma Samue]
tuathacoagula Offline
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Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 24
Loc: Japan
One may be able to affect undesired situations through a form of projection that is manifested in ones actions. This has been noted by the above posters.

But destiny? Do you believe in such a concept, and on what level? I appreciate that one can argue that we are all destined to physically die. A memory of our live's may live on in those we surrounded ourselves with before death.

Under current scientific thought and observation the concept of Entropy notes that systems will move from order to disorder. Can intention or projection affect or change these, so that the individual can escape physical death or order can be made from chaos?

On a micro-level, I would say that thought and intention backed up by action can positively affect situations for the individual. This seems like a gimme. One must take charge of ones own life. But does this stretch outside of the individual?

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#55246 - 05/31/11 10:25 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: SerpentEagle]
Pizgatti Offline
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Registered: 05/27/11
Posts: 33
 Originally Posted By: SerpentEagle
What do you think the possibility of changing events, one's destiny and undesired situation through intention or projections?


Everyone wants to put a big magical label all over things. It all breaks down to some very minute elements. Before we get into that though, the first thing I would ask is "Who all believe in a destiny?" Do you believe that you have a destiny or a "future" unless you make it yourself. According to my belief and I thought most "Satanists" you are able to shape and make your own reality. In that sense, yes, we can change events. You have to get up and actually do it though. If you punch a random man in the face, your starting an event. If you slap a woman who balled up her fist to hit you like a man...your starting a different kind of event.

In the sense of "Magick", and sending projections it all depends on what you believe. I don't have enough experience with it to tell you if it works. I can say that in theory the emmitence of energies or thoughts might create an effect on a biological level, but once again I won't go into it since I don't have the expertise on the subject yet. I am going to start experimenting with this soon.

However, lesser "Magick" and manipulation of people is easily possible and I have seen this work first hand. This is what I meant in the first paragraph By minute elements that can change. If you knew a certain event was going to happen, or you suspected it...you could always mess with the main person organizing said event. Big banquet? You need the coordinator. Wedding? Either party, most likely the bride would need to be manipulated in some way. Something city wide? Speak to the Mayor.

It will always depend on what events you mean, and what you want to happen. It also depends on your skills in manipulation and the "con" as it were. As far as sending energy and intentions like you asked... I would just try it and see if it works for you.

Thanks,
-Pizgatti

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#56842 - 07/14/11 07:32 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: SerpentEagle]
Knievel74 Offline
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Registered: 05/18/10
Posts: 147
Loc: NY
I think anything's possible if you want it bad enough and are willing to work hard at it. The only obstacle in your way of getting what you want is YOU.
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"Man was meant to live, not just to exist". - Evel Knievel

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#56852 - 07/15/11 12:38 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Knievel74]
Diavolo Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
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 Originally Posted By: Knievel74
I think anything's possible if you want it bad enough and are willing to work hard at it. The only obstacle in your way of getting what you want is YOU.


Seriously man, that's bullshit. Fairy tales like these keep the rats running in the treadmill. The American Dream is bollocks, the idea that if you try hard enough and do all it takes, you'll accomplish anything you want is bollocks too. It's the “pray some harder” or “believe some more” for consumers.

You don't need to believe me, just look around, or look here. An environment of satanists, often considered quite strong-willed. Tell me, how many did accomplish all they ever wanted, got all they wanted? Only those downgrading their dreams and aspirations, and realizing that no matter how much effort they put into it, how much they want it; they're not gonna get it.

Welcome to reality.

D.

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#56897 - 07/15/11 11:30 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Diavolo]
Thule Offline
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Registered: 04/30/11
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Quite true. We are often taught things that weaken us. I was told that by working harder I would get ahead. Working harder actually caused me to fall further behind. I learned I wasn't working in the proper way.

I believe though we should do our best regardless of the out come and on some level believe in success to motivate ourselves to try. If we don't try we are guaranteed failure. At the same time our assessment should be somewhat realistic.

Manifesting: I do believe this can exert an "influence" upon events and it is possible to get slight results from it (as demonstrated by studies). But it is nearly useless without being coupled with real concrete action.
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#56899 - 07/15/11 11:53 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Thule]
Diavolo Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
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To quote the great Tyler Durden:

 Quote:
I see all this potential, and I see it squandered. God damn it, an entire generation pumping gas, waiting tables – slaves with white collars. Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy shit we don't need. We're the middle children of history, man. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our great war is a spiritual war. Our great depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars, but we won't. We're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off.


I recently read somewhere that in the English speaking countries, around 23% of the people have mental complaints. Elsewhere it's about half. This means that one on ten is not feeling that well. Which might explain why some freak out, become spree killers, murder their families or commit suicide. Either 10% of the population is mentally defect since birth or there's something we're doing very wrong.

People are stuck in a loop and the pressure keeps on building. And why? Because we are chasing dreams which are not even our own. We are chasing something artificially created. Values specifically upheld to keep the machine running. If we don't buy more and more often, everything will collapse. Our whole current system is build upon continuous replacement. Sooner or later that bubble has to burst too.

What people need to learn is what has value and what hasn't. What is worth it and what isn't. They need to see that the rat race is not necessarily at the benefit of the rats racing it.

D.

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#56966 - 07/16/11 04:48 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: SerpentEagle]
Aries9 Offline
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Registered: 05/14/11
Posts: 11
 Originally Posted By: SerpentEagle
What do you think the possibility of changing events, one's destiny and undesired situation through intention or projections?


I don't think changing events so much rely on "possibility" as much as it does with ability or resources.

As for destiny I'm going to assume you are talking about class status? I would say the possibility for changing that is slim to none. Well that is if you are talking about ascending it and not descending it. If you were born a peasant you will most certainly die one. No matter how skilled you are aside from a very slim chance of getting to know somebody you will not become part of the ruling class elite.

Of course you can always just fork out the extra cash and attempt to live in luxury and pretend to be. It does work for quite a few.

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#57108 - 07/19/11 01:22 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Aries9]
MatthewJ1
Unregistered



I would like to explore something which has been on my mind for a while now and which I think will have some bearing on the topic at hand.

I will also try to put my view across in simple words, not with the intention of being patronising and just obvious, but just trying to get things down straight. I will also use both unconscious and subconscious and leave it up to you to determine which is more valuable or meaningful to you.

I think human beings are fascinated by stories. They like to speak to others and to create their own stories and they like to enjoy the stories of others, whether by just listening to others in conversation, or by watching the TV, or by reading, or whatever.

I think human beings are a meaning generating species and they have a need to speak about themselves and their experience, and to see themselves reflected in the stories of others.

Some stories seem to have more significance than others for particular groups of people. Or, some stories are regarded as more important to the species than other stories. For instance, the story of the fall of man may be regarded as more important than some soap opera story you may see on daytime TV by many people.

I would like to make an assertion: the human unconscious or the subconscious is speaking though the stories we value, just as it can speak through the dreams we have. The more important and compelling one regards a story, the more unconscious or subconscious elements one can detect speaking from within it, or the more powerful those unconscious or subconscious elements are.

I would like to make a further assertion: every thing has the potential to be captured and made to mean something - that is objects, states of affairs, actions have the potential to become signs; to become elements invested with meaning, as a type of speech, and to be read within a larger context or system of meaning.

I would hence argue that the way we read and mean objects, actions etc. reflects our conscious interests, but more interestingly our unconscious or subconscious interests as well; and the more authority a particular reading has, the more powerful or prevalent the unconscious or subconscious forces are functioning within that speech or reading.

I think it is possible to analyse a text or a way of reading or meaning and determining the conscious and the unconscious or subconscious elements which determine its structure and the meaning of the elements within it.

In this sense, Leviathan is not a real entity existing independently of me, but is rather a word which the unconscious has highlighted as an appropriate choice for describing itself to me. I like the notion of the monster who lurks in the depths, or the raging dark presence beneath the cool calm surface.

If this line of thinking interests you, then I would recommend the below reading progression to give you some further ideas:

Introductory Lectures on Psychoanalysis by Sigmund Freud
The Interpretation of Dreams by Sigmund Freud
Elements of Semiology by Roland Barthes
Mythologies by Roland Barthes
On Signs edited by Marshall Blonsky
Jacques Lacan by Anika Lemaire
Nietzsche and Philosophy by Gilles Deleuze

The Dark Force of Nature

Lately I have been interested in the notion of the dark force of nature, of the dark side of a human being, or in a heart of darkness.

I like history and I think one can learn a lot about human beings and their stories and actions from considering the past. On the one hand, I am interested in determining the general principles underpinning the success of such powerful families/individuals as the Medici, the Hapsburgs, the Rothschild’s, the Hohenzollern, Carnegie, Morgan and Ford etc. in order to put those principles into practice. I think Robert Greene has also done this sort of work in his books.

On the other hand, I am interested in reading and determining the forces which have animated or driven our history. I am particularly interested in the dark unconscious or subconscious forces which have animated history.

I am interested in the types of stories, the types of signs selected and invested and the language structure which those signs require in order to speak in context; which speak those dark unconscious or subconscious forces as they attempt to manifest and act through individuals and groups in history.

One area of study, which has been certainly focused on is the Nazi movement and the types of messages or systems of meaning they constructed in order to give those dark forces a voice and a means to act in the world.

Another possible area of study would be to analyse the forces which were revealed and released during the United States in the 1960’s and early 1970’s. I am particularly interested in the significance of historical events such as the assassination of Jack and Bobby Kennedy, the assassination of Dr. King and the attempt on Wallace’s life. On top of this is an interest in the events surrounding the tragedy at Altamont, at Kent State, the social significance of Manson etc.

There are other areas of historical study, no doubt.

I tend to ask the following questions:

What forces are being revealed or released?
What stories, or themes, or what imagery or systems of signs, are giving voice to those forces? What elements and structure?
How influential on other people are those stories, or those systems of signs, in voicing those forces; are those messages compelling the release of those forces in others on an individual or mass scale?
What are the economic and political arrangements and circumstances in place at the time those forces are revealed and what impact does this have on them?
Are there opposing forces in play and if so what are those forces and how do they speak? What is the composition of those forces and how does this battle of forces play out historically or politically etc.?
Is there control of those forces, or has control been lost, or are those forces beyond control from the outset?
What use are those forces and what outcome did those involved expect and finally receive?
What general principles can be determined through this study and how can these principles be put into practice in order to obtain tangible goals?

Some Thoughts on Black Magic from This Point of View

I would tentatively like to offer a definition of black magic from the point of view of a work in progress. Here it is:

Black magic is the conscious awareness and control and deployment of forces in accordance with the will.

I think the difference between a dabbler, or the ignorant, and an accomplished black magician is in the level of awareness or consciousness of these forces and the level of control one can/must exercise over these forces. The magician has the awareness and the ability to control and the dabbler or the ignorant does not.

Black magical practice then is about the creation of a language which successfully speaks the forces which are to be generated or released and which compels others within controllable limits. This magical process assumes that one understands the individual elements and the structure and how the elements will work together to perform the speaking of these forces. It also assumes that the practitioner is a highly aware individual with a respect for this dark side of nature or human beings.

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#57109 - 07/19/11 01:27 AM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: ]
444ovthedirt Offline
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Registered: 07/18/11
Posts: 36
Martin Heidegger
http://www.iep.utm.edu/heidegge/


Wilhelm Reich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilhelm_Reich


\:\)


Edited by 444ovthedirt (07/19/11 01:27 AM)
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#57159 - 07/19/11 05:35 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Diavolo]
Knievel74 Offline
member


Registered: 05/18/10
Posts: 147
Loc: NY
 Originally Posted By: Diavolo
 Originally Posted By: Knievel74
I think anything's possible if you want it bad enough and are willing to work hard at it. The only obstacle in your way of getting what you want is YOU.


Seriously man, that's bullshit. Fairy tales like these keep the rats running in the treadmill. The American Dream is bollocks, the idea that if you try hard enough and do all it takes, you'll accomplish anything you want is bollocks too. It's the “pray some harder” or “believe some more” for consumers.

You don't need to believe me, just look around, or look here. An environment of satanists, often considered quite strong-willed. Tell me, how many did accomplish all they ever wanted, got all they wanted? Only those downgrading their dreams and aspirations, and realizing that no matter how much effort they put into it, how much they want it; they're not gonna get it.

Welcome to reality.

D.


You're reply to my post is bullshit. Losers usually have that excuse for not getting what they want.

If you didn't accomplish what you wanted in life it means you didn't work hard enough to get it because you didn't really want it in the first place.

Welcome to reality.

K.
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"Man was meant to live, not just to exist". - Evel Knievel

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#57160 - 07/19/11 06:02 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Knievel74]
Diavolo Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
So my friend what did you accomplish then?

D.

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#57161 - 07/19/11 06:12 PM Re: Bending your destiny or future [Re: Diavolo]
MindFux Offline
member


Registered: 12/27/10
Posts: 174
 Quote:

If you didn't accomplish what you wanted in life it means you didn't work hard enough to get it because you didn't really want it in the first place.


Yep if you get cancer and die at 18, you just didn't want your dream of retiring at 45 enough. If you wanted to be a sprinter but lost a leg in an accident, well you clearly didn't want it badly enough. If you dreamed of being a mathematician but suck at math, well too bad, you could have worked at it and become the best in the world. Seriously, what do you think the 'real world' is, a Disney film?

Life is by definition a struggle and hard work and dedication do pay, but to assume that those who haven't achieved quite what they planned to have not done so due to 'absence of work' is just ridiculous.

I use extreme examples to point out how absurd this thinking is. You've bought everything they ever sold you including how to measure your own worth. That's pretty sad.

MF.


Edited by MindFux (07/19/11 06:13 PM)

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