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#55777 - 06/13/11 01:40 PM No Pat Down Law
Meph9 Offline
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Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
http://abcnewsradioonline.com/national-n...t-down-law.html

This is one of the most interesting and crazy pieces of legislation I have heard of in quite a while. Personally I find this bill not only incredibily stupid but poses a national security risk for the whole country. I mean this is one way to reduce the amount of drugs coming across the border because they'll just bring it in through the airport. This is like saying I don't like getting speeding tickets so I'm going to create a law that says the police can't give them out anymore.

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#55781 - 06/13/11 02:18 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
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Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
There is really no need for them to do pat downs anyways. With the metal detectors and x-ray booths they should be able to find anything that could constitute a threat.

 Quote:
I mean this is one way to reduce the amount of drugs coming across the border because they'll just bring it in through the airport.


Any amount of drugs that is worth smuggling into another country would be too large to fit on one's person. They would have to carry it in their luggage. Pat downs don't find things in people's luggage.

 Quote:
This is like saying I don't like getting speeding tickets so I'm going to create a law that says the police can't give them out anymore.


No it's not. All it does is stop TSA from putting their hands on people. It doesn't stop them from searching for contraband in other ways.
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#55786 - 06/13/11 03:29 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
Ringmaster Offline
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Registered: 04/07/08
Posts: 205
Loc: Salem Oregon
Before I go any further I do apologize if anything isn't spelled correctly or gramaticly correct I'm on a public computer right now so I'll do my best.

While there really is no need for pat-downs I don't think there should be a law against them. Yes we have metal detectors and x-rays for both people and luggage the pat down is now being reserved for those hyper sensitive people who don't want to have an x-ray taken of them for whatever reason.

Personally I would prefer both metal detector and mandatory pat downs for security and peace of mind. It's only a matter of time before people learn how the x-ray machines work and develop a counter. I'm sure it could be done (personal opinion). If the pat down remains in place it's just another step for people with malicious intent to think about twice before trying to do something on an airline. There's really no point in getting rid of pat downs because not only have they been around for a while but it should also ad an extra sense of security to travelers.

Of course you got people who attribute a pat down to being gropped; but these people should either A) not fly or B) deal with it.

As far as drugs go, 6 you hit the nail on the head. We do have that rare occurance in airports where people get caught trying to smuggle drugs in large quantities but most of the time end up getting caught.
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#55790 - 06/13/11 05:52 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
Meph9 Offline
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Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
This legislation is just an example of all the complaining about the methods used by the TSA. If these people think getting patted down is an egregious violation of privacy do really there not going to have a fit about a full body scan. It seems that people want to have security in terms of public transportation but don't want to have to go through any those security measures.

The TSA gets a nit a bad rep for doing what it's been created and put in place to do, but in the event there was some terrorist incident the first people who would be blamed would be the TSA.


In terms of the drug war I think the DEA should be completely defunded and broken up, because we simply don't have the time or money to finance their activities. I don't think there should be a war on drugs but I guarantee that gov't of Texas which nearly put this in place probably does.

Metal detectors don't find plastic or items which could be held on one's person so I wouldn't that the pat down is entirely useless.

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#55797 - 06/13/11 07:24 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
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Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
You have those plastic explosive sniffing machines, the x-rays so good you can see nipples, and metal detectors.

There is no reason for some cunt to touch me.

Every trip I take to the airport is fucking pain in the ass.

I go through all of that shit, and they still want to feel me up.
Yeah, I have big boobs, but please, shit with as much as they do sometimes I want a cigarette afterwards.

Instead of bothering the American chicks in tight clothes, they need to go bother the Arabic/Indian women in those huge caftans that hide bombs easily. Shit maybe next time I should dress like that and see if they leave my ass alone.

Morgan
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#55801 - 06/13/11 07:50 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Morgan]
paolo sette Offline
member


Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 263
Loc: IL, USA
 Originally Posted By: Morgan
Yeah, I have big boobs...


;\)

(No offense intended, Morgan. Just playing with your words, and having fun with it!)

 Originally Posted By: Meph9
This legislation is just an example of all the complaining about the methods used by the TSA.


We are always standing and working in this dynamism of duality that some would term a "problem". More precisely speaking, we are this "problem" and this "problem" is us. Unless we start from this "problem", we cannot solve the problem of combining with a resolution which has a priority to legislation, for example.

Ciao.


Edited by paolo sette (06/13/11 07:58 PM)
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#55809 - 06/13/11 09:18 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
 Quote:
This legislation is just an example of all the complaining about the methods used by the TSA. If these people think getting patted down is an egregious violation of privacy do really there not going to have a fit about a full body scan.


That may but true but my contention is simply that the x-rays and metal detectors are more effective at detecting possible threats than a pat down.

 Quote:
It seems that people want to have security in terms of public transportation but don't want to have to go through any those security measures.


Yeah, people can be difficult like that. However, I don't think anyone is asking for an end to all security measures.

 Quote:
The TSA gets a nit a bad rep for doing what it's been created and put in place to do, but in the event there was some terrorist incident the first people who would be blamed would be the TSA.


I think the TSA catches the most flack from people because often times they suck at their job.

 Quote:
In terms of the drug war I think the DEA should be completely defunded and broken up, because we simply don't have the time or money to finance their activities. I don't think there should be a war on drugs


If that is true then why were you an advocate of pat downs in your original post because they are "one way to reduce the amount of drugs coming across the border"?

 Quote:
Metal detectors don't find plastic or items which could be held on one's person so I wouldn't that the pat down is entirely useless.


Right, which is where the x-ray machines come in handy.

I would be more worried about having a suicidal pilot who would rather take out a jet full of people with him than die alone than I would be about some random asshole getting on a plane with malicious intent. And incidents of the former or even rarer than the latter.

Before 9/11, when was the last time something like that happened? And before that? Usually, when a trip on a plane ends up being fatal, it is due to mechanical failure or pilot error - or your ticket price includes an in-flight heart attack. But ever since 9/11, people have been extra paranoid about plane travel. Specifically concerning fears of terrorists or other homicidal d-bag being on their plane.
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#55811 - 06/13/11 09:35 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Morgan]
Meph9 Offline
member


Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161

Instead of bothering the American chicks in tight clothes, they need to go bother the Arabic/Indian women in those huge caftans that hide bombs easily

Yes, because racial profilig solves all problems...

You do realize that as soon those individuals who might want to do some harm on a filght see that there is a profile in place the change costumes. They start trying to get more dumb suburbanites to carry the bombs

On another all of the various terrorists of late (9-11,Underwear guy,Time Square) were wearing regular everday type clothes not mideast or muslim style garb.

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#55814 - 06/13/11 10:42 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
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Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
Actually, they should do racial profiling.
FUCK POLITICAL CORRECT BULLSHIT.

I know all about Tim Mcvey, but the majority of problem idiot bombers are of middle east descent. So search them more often.

Let them change clothes and dress just like everyone else. Maybe then their women would be allowed out of the middle ages. At least here the female children are allowed to go to school instead of being beaten.

People are more aware of the luggage they carry, especially now with all the carry on and check charges, no one is going to carry on someone else bag by mistake, shit that's an extra $55 bucks.

Yes, those guys were wearing regular clothes, So that is another point for racial profiling.

I live in NYC, I am more aware of what everyone does when I travel. Nothing is perfect but if you are going to do searches, do it right. Search the lady in the huge billowing outfit, not the chick who's barely wearing clothes. Search the smelly guys, it might be a way to try and fool the plastic explosive machine.

M
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Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#55820 - 06/14/11 02:31 AM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Morgan]
Meph9 Offline
member


Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
You seem incapable of understanding how ineffective racial profiling is when faced with an enemy who can easily adapt to beat that profile. Al Qaeda/Hamas/blah etc. have followers of all different colors.

It's got nothing to do with what the women over there are wearing, the people you're looking for aren't wearing that to begin with. So if you're going to make in terms of racial identity or nationality to look for say Arabs, one would miss the underwear bomber who was from africa. If you expand that profile to africans and arabs now you've already got a group which large help you narrow down suspects, not to mention the fact that there are so many people in the U.S. with mixed racial backgrounds.

It's just not that workable in the real world.

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#55827 - 06/14/11 09:02 AM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
battlescar22 Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/15/11
Posts: 10
I know that many people are getting pissed off by this law and ive seen it on the news again and again. But frankly i dont see the big deal, the guy isnt givin you a cavity search, he's just patting you down. It takes about a whole minute if that and its over. Its just for our safety. I find it intresting that people always find a way to be unhappy. Theyd bitch if someone snuck a knife on the plane but then they'll bitch because they get patted down to make sure no one has a knife on them.
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#55839 - 06/14/11 11:45 AM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: battlescar22]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
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Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
"You seem incapable of understanding how ineffective racial profiling is when faced with an enemy who can easily adapt to beat that profile. Al Qaeda/Hamas/blah etc. have followers of all different colors."

True, but so far they all look arabic including the shoe bomber.
Fuck it, its still better to do it, then not.

Anyplace you go, you judge people. By how they look, what they are wearing, what you assume them to be like. This simple thinking that you find useless helps to keep you alive and aware in various situations. You are quite naive if you think people don't live up to their stereotypes.

I think you are really thinking too politically correct.

Honestly, if they are going to try to do it again, there are simply better ways.

Poison the food and ice cube supply.

I have taken a knife on a plane by mistake and they missed it with all their deep scientific searching and pat downs. I didnt even remember I had it in my purse.

The security is pretty much a minimum wage job at this point, do you think they really care about doing the right thing in regards to people? They are going to do whatever they think they can get away with. Just ask Chole Kardasian when the guy or was it girl (I dont remember exactly) slipped his hand in her pants waistband and felt up her ass. Yeah she has a big ass, but
its obviously real. Maybe guys dont get it, but women do.

Morgan
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Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#55844 - 06/14/11 02:06 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Morgan]
Hegesias Offline
active member


Registered: 02/16/11
Posts: 725
Dispelling doubts through a respectful search of all people on public transportation would be a good way to clear the air and have everyone make polite conversation without anxiety on the plane.

I reckon first of all you observe the persons gait, their body language, then it's all down to the various attributes that can reveal the persons potential motives, like cultural indications, clothes, out of character clothes, poorly matched western fashions that look desperately random paired with an identifiably Muslim "gait" for example.

A bum looser stinking of booze and piss is not likely to be a lethally sophisticated psychopath. A suave, devilishly handsome and charismatic fellow is though.

You can't have a single fixation on or negation of one factor alone as that is foolishly blind prejudice without rationality that probably stems from trying to identify an enemy out of irrational fear simply to calm anxiety. A percent of suspicion due to race, a percent of cultural or religious indications, a large percent is the observable actions etc. you can't have a moral mind block when it comes to cold hard reality situations of mortality.

A lack of casual mannerisms or a 1000 yard stare that will always happen, if momentarily as the purp is "justifying" before acting.

It's everything together, you can't just remove different elements when profiling people simply because society says it's not nice or racist in a certain tone of voice.

In no way is persecuting Arabs with a "pat down" at the airport any different than persecuting white English skinheads at a football match against, say, I don't know, Saudi Arabia. Both guys from different cultures would get searched at the environment which they'd be predicted to have the propensity to become volatile, simply because these stereotypes have previously been observed to catalyse violence under the known conditions.

I can't see what the fuss is about unless you're a homophobe who experiences immense emotional trauma from a "pat down" from thinking the security is somebody trying to rape you. If men are that effeminate and nervous then they ought to be sanctioned on the indication of severe mental illness.
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#55874 - 06/15/11 05:59 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Morgan]
Meph9 Offline
member


Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
Indeed as man I did not fully understand the feelings of women in regards to strangers examinging their private places. Having said that I would say that if anything this points to a need to for the TSA agents needing to be trained and held accountable if they abuse their position.






These two men do not look the same, they do not have teh same ethnic background. Thus "so far they all look arabic" is not a true statement. I we should also remember that one does not have to be a radical muslim to want to blow up a plane.

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#55878 - 06/15/11 08:49 PM Re: No Pat Down Law [Re: Meph9]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http...iw=1280&bih=642


That is a picture of the shoe bomber.

The black guy picture you put up is the guy who tried to set his underwear on fire. He had mental issues, if I remember correctly and was even reported to the police by his family for being dangerous. Mental instability comes in all colors of the rainbow, but that is not what we were talking about.

M


Edited by Morgan (06/15/11 08:51 PM)
Edit Reason: fixed
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