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#460 - 09/19/07 04:18 AM Re: Fakers [Re: Morgan]
School Bully Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: Melbourne
 Originally Posted By: Morgan
Thus by stating Vango and Picasso in regards to their blue period you prove my point.


The only point that has been proved is that the artist is the creator of beautiful things. His mental or emotional state is not as important as what he is able to produce from that. Art, I'm sure you realize Morgan, is all symbol. Anyone who dwelves below the surface does so at his own peril. Anyone who discovers ugly meanings in beautiful things is both corrupt and sick - whether that be the therapist or patient. It is the spectator, not the artist that all art mirrors.

 Quote:
"Beauty always does matter. There is no such thing as "ugly art" only good art and bad art"
Thus spoke/paraphrased Guilani as he banned some art from being shown in a new york city museaum.
What you are arguring about is your personal preference, your views verses what is more of a generally accepted idea. How do you define "good art"?


All good art is beauty. And beauty is the promise of happiness.

 Quote:
"Likewise there is no such thing as a moral or immoral book. Books are either well written or badly written. That is all."
So based on that statement, how do deal with the books you decide are badly written?


Obviously by not reading them - only I don't personally decide which books are badly written. Others do. Popularity is the crown which the world puts on bad art. Whatever is popular is wrong.



 Quote:
farienheit 214


... now there's a thought - BTW, is that anything like Farenheit 451?




Edited by School Bully (09/19/07 04:23 AM)

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#462 - 09/19/07 05:03 AM Re: Fakers [Re: ZephyrGirl]
daevid777 Offline
active member


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 951
Loc: Hell's Pisshole, Texas
Zephyr's right Schoolbully, she's hot. Oh yeah.

But that too, is aesthetics, and aesthetics are subjective... "subjectivity is objective..." hey, is this a Woody Allen film? Is subjectivity - objectivity? Or is an ugly fucker an ugly fucker? I don't know - I've met some of my wife's girlfriends that have happy husbands. I'm not going to judge. But, I think we all can generally agree on "pretty" or "handsome", or "beautiful" or "disgusting" - with some sort of justification.

Art, though, is a difficult concept to judge. If it is ugly, is it "intentionally ugly"? (But is it done with skill?) Does it convey it's appropriate message? I think that is how we should approach this subject. Does it make you think outside your normal expectations?

But, perhaps I'm just a romantic at heart.
_________________________
Where we're going, we don't need roads.

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#463 - 09/19/07 05:39 AM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut
 Originally Posted By: schoolbully
All good art is beauty. And beauty is the promise of happiness.

Where is the proof in that statement? Where do you connect beauty with happiness or a promise of happiness?

 Originally Posted By: schoolbully
Likewise there is no such thing as a moral or immoral book. Books are either well written or badly written. That is all."
 Originally Posted By: morgan
So based on that statement, how do deal with the books you decide are badly written?

To which you reply…

 Originally Posted By: schoolbully
Obviously by not reading them - only I don't personally decide which books are badly written. Others do.

So you live your life by the opinion of others? This is what you are saying… Care to explain your thought?

 Originally Posted By: schoolbully
Popularity is the crown which the world puts on bad art. Whatever is popular is wrong.

So just because something is popular by that very definition to you it is wrong… In the case of art does this now make it ugly, a book badly written?

By the way personally I could care less what the container your brain is in looks like… But I can say if the brain is ugly there is no amount of physical beauty to make up for that…

Good day…
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#465 - 09/19/07 06:03 AM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut
 Originally Posted By: School Bully
How fascinating. And how much do you charge for a blow job?

Poor chap... Don't you know that if you have to ask the price of something it is an indicator that you do not have enough to pay for it?
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#466 - 09/19/07 06:29 AM Re: Fakers [Re: daevid777]
School Bully Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: Melbourne
 Originally Posted By: daevid777
Zephyr's right Schoolbully, she's hot. Oh yeah.


Well, I sincerely hope so. I hate having to talk to ugly women.

 Quote:
But, perhaps I'm just a romantic at heart.


Me too, droog, me too.
_________________________
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#477 - 09/19/07 03:37 PM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
"His mental or emotional state is not as important as what he is able to produce from that"

So what he creates and the whys behind it have no bearing or meaning on the created artwork to you.
So a pretty flora advertisment has the same value as pretty flora oil painting.

"Anyone who dwelves below the surface does so at his own peril."

So all art history/appreication classes/museaum tours are worthless. So painting made of mixed meduium including tears, blood, and other substance dont make a difference in regards to meaning verses beauty to you.

"Anyone who discovers ugly meanings in beautiful things is both corrupt and sick - whether that be the therapist or patient."

So a pretty picture of dead rotting bodies, or tasteful crimescene photos, or ansel adams photos make/mean no difference to you.

"It is the spectator, not the artist that all art mirror"

I now see that you have never created any artwork yourself, or you would know this to be a complete falsehood.

Morg
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#489 - 09/19/07 10:20 PM Re: Fakers [Re: Morgan]
Octavius Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Left the party
There is a point, when someone becomes so mired in their own ego that they cease to be rational in their ability to interact with all others. Often, this is misrepresented as the quasi-achievement of enlightenment, becoming the Nietzschean over-man, or Nephilim, Demon, Priest, Connoisseur, "true" Satanist, etc. This is not the case. Clearly, this simply means that you've lost the ability to interact with others on any level in addition to letting yourself be challenged by new thoughts and ideas that may change the ones you so vehemently cling to. Your strength is a facade. Your self-deification is illusory and transparent. Titles mean nothing, even if thery're merely assumed as we see so aptly illustrated by our monacled comerade, Schoolbully.

This is all I can think of every single time I read one of Schoolbully's posts. With all due (?) respect, sir, you're wasting your own time. Looking forward to you illustrating my point...

Octavius


Edited by Octavius (09/19/07 10:29 PM)
_________________________
So long, and thanks for all the fish.

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#501 - 09/20/07 03:37 AM Re: Fakers [Re: Morgan]
School Bully Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: Melbourne
 Originally Posted By: Morgan
"His mental or emotional state is not as important as what he is able to produce from that"

So what he creates and the whys behind it have no bearing or meaning on the created artwork to you.
So a pretty flora advertisment has the same value as pretty flora oil painting.


What is a picture? Primarily, a picture is a coloured surface, merely, with no more spiritual message or meaning for anyone than a pretty flora advertisment. It is purely a decorative thing.

A picture has no meaning but its beauty, no message but its joy. That is the first truth about art that you must learn. A picture is a purely decorative thing.

 Quote:
"Anyone who dwelves below the surface does so at his own peril."

So all art history/appreication classes/museaum tours are worthless. So painting made of mixed meduium including tears, blood, and other substance dont make a difference in regards to meaning verses beauty to you.

"Anyone who discovers ugly meanings in beautiful things is both corrupt and sick - whether that be the therapist or patient."

So a pretty picture of dead rotting bodies, or tasteful crimescene photos, or ansel adams photos make/mean no difference to you.


Have you ever seen footage of an atomic bomb exploding? A terrible, deadly weapon but so beautiful to watch.

 Quote:
"It is the spectator, not the artist that all art mirror"

I now see that you have never created any artwork yourself, or you would know this to be a complete falsehood.


Morgan your moralising on the subject of art is becoming quite tedious. How often have you heard the phrase: "I don't know much about art, but I know what I like". In this way, the artist is completely irrelevant. It is the product itself that is important, not who produced it or even why. That is all secondary. There is nothing false about that. That is exactly as art should be. It should stand on its own merits. It should speak for itself. Any genuine artist would not wish it to be any other way. No, Morgan, It seems that yours is the complete falsehood.
_________________________
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#508 - 09/20/07 06:02 AM Re: Fakers [Re: ta2zz]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Originally Posted By: ta2zz
 Originally Posted By: School Bully
How fascinating. And how much do you charge for a blow job?

Poor chap... Don't you know that if you have to ask the price of something it is an indicator that you do not have enough to pay for it?


I'm assuming that Schoolbully was aiming this at me, but has since taken it down, probably in part due to your very amusing response Ta2zz.
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#510 - 09/20/07 07:51 AM Re: Fakers [Re: daevid777]
Nemesis Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2175
Loc: US
 Originally Posted By: daevid777
I've met some of my wife's girlfriends that have happy husbands. I'm not going to judge.


Oh Dave! You had me laughing about this all morning....Even now, having just gotten out of the shower, I'm still giggling
_________________________
Nothing is sacred.

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#512 - 09/20/07 12:42 PM Re: Fakers [Re: Woland]
Cody Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/16/07
Posts: 72
I personally loved the old Robert Tilton, he could turn the story of the creation around to state that someone needed to send him money and he was successful at it for a while, he got busted then continued on and he has been featured on BET (black Entertainment Television) lately, Benny Hinn is a close second. Damn, I need to get into the business of religion, I would probably make a hell of a lot more in the short run but I would know when to quit, or maybe I am lying to myself.

for your enjoyment or not and all that stuff in between:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lvU-DislkI



Edited by Cody (09/20/07 12:44 PM)

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#516 - 09/20/07 02:45 PM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
"A picture has no meaning but its beauty, no message but its joy. That is the first truth about art that you must learn. A picture is a purely decorative thing."

Simply to you. This is your opinion, not a universal truth.

"Anyone who discovers ugly meanings in beautiful things is both corrupt and sick - whether that be the therapist or patient...
Have you ever seen footage of an atomic bomb exploding? A terrible, deadly weapon but so beautiful to watch."

And now you think bomb explosions fall into the art work catagory?

"I don't know much about art, but I know what I like".

Yes, this does just seem to sum you up.

Whatever, you have your personal views on Art, I have mine. It does not seem that we will agree on this topic or come to similar terms, I think it is best to agree to disagree.

I wont decorate your house, as long as you agree not to decorate mine.

Morgan
_________________________
Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#529 - 09/21/07 04:55 AM Re: Fakers [Re: Morgan]
School Bully Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: Melbourne


My dear Morgan. If I decorated your house it would look so beautiful you would never want to leave it. Least of all to go out into that sad and depressing world we all inhabit. So don't say such silly things as if there is some sort of parity going on here. There is nothing to agree or disagree on. You don't stand for anything. All you've done is contradict and question. You have no position on art at all to offer. Mine is based on firm Satanic principles. I don't know what yours is based on. Your philosophy of art, such as it is, I should imagine, is based on some boring old cliche: "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".

What a stupid and dull cliche that is to be sure. You may just as well say that "everyone is entitled to his/her opinion". Put into practise, that would mean the opinion of the most stupid, ill informed ignoramous is worth just as much as the most intelligent and enlightened individual. Come to think of it, it does. It's called democracy.

You probably think this cliche phiosophy of yours ties in with some absurd notion of Individuality and subjectivism when everyone knows that people of the same ilk all instinctively think and act along the same sort of lines - it is one clear way people recognise each other. Or to put it into another cliche for you, Morg: "birds of a feather flock together".

But thanks for keeping me entertained and amused anyway, Morgan, albeit in your brutal clinical fashion. It's been a buzz but all good things must come to an end. I've had a bit of time on my hands recently with not much to do. I sorely miss the presence of Samael, Diavolo, and others. What a shame the vacuum has been filled with the opinions and reminicences of slobbering second rate social inadequates like Ta2zz. Ho hum. L'enfer, c'est les autres, o my brothers, l'enfer, c'est les autres.
_________________________
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#534 - 09/21/07 11:30 AM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut
 Originally Posted By: School Bully
I sorely miss the presence of Samael, Diavolo, and others.


Both are here old boy, you can PM them perhaps they miss you too…

 Quote:
What a shame the vacuum has been filled with the opinions and reminicences of slobbering second rate social inadequates like Ta2zz.


Thanks for the mention it lets me know you have not forgotten me… hell you even capitalized the T…

Remember ignoring a fact does not change anything…

Now excuse me I must leave my cave and go create art on skin…

~T~


Edited by ta2zz (09/21/07 11:34 AM)
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#535 - 09/21/07 02:12 PM Re: Fakers [Re: School Bully]
Woland Moderator Offline
Seasoned
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 763
Loc: Oslo, Norway
Dearest Schoolbully.

Whining and whimpering over the days of yore will get you nowhere.
Your argument are weak to say the least, and you seem disinterested when it comes to delivering decent dialog and discussion...

Why don't you pick on one your own size? ;-)

Try this on for measure:

Beauty is a cultural understanding, and as such in the eye of the beholder.
Art is a cultural understanding, and as such in the eye of the beholder.

An example of art:

_________________________
Regards

Woland

Contra Mundum!

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