#59714 - 10/02/11 08:14 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: dust-e sheytoon]
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The Zebu
senior member
Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1647
Loc: Orlando, FL
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Sharia law has been partially implemented in Britain, in a process where both parties must firstly consent to the authority of a Sharia tribunal. This does not take the issue of communal coercion into consideration, in which individuals embedded in tightly-knit conservative families would be less likely to rely on common British law for fear of being ostracized by their families. The same would apply in America.
Before someone makes a comment saying oh, they're just kooks, or something…take a look at inroads that Sharia financial law may be making via influential Republicans such as Grover Norquist.
I doubt that many hardcore Christians support the adaption of Sharia tribunals in the US, but were this ever to occur, they would doubtless demand their own "Christian Tribunals" in the name of equality. Since Christianity has much more cultural leverage, such an institution would prove far more disastrous.
Edited by The Zebu (10/02/11 08:14 PM)
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«Recibe, ¡oh Lucifer! la sangre de esta víctima que sacrifico en tu honor.»
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#59731 - 10/03/11 02:27 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
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Meph9
member
Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
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Again just because I'm not shivering at the thought of a threat which really isn't happening as sympathy, support or caring in any way for any abrahamic fantasy. Meanwhile as individuals such yourself are scared hiding a closet at the thought of "sharia law" religious right wing conservatives are doing everthing they can to shut down organisations like Planned Parenthood with ridiculous regulations. In Kansas the state's GOP lawmakers are putting together a list of elaborate and unreasonable rules to make providing legal abortion services too dificult, they are using their political positions to manipulate to cause ideological social change. You've got all these Republican candidates advocating for the reimplementation of things like don't ask don't tell despite the fact it has been rather conclusively shown that the policy does not benefit our military. Have you noticed that the number of people you've deluded themselves into thinking that we have a "christian nation" which was founded on "religious Principles" has increased? I mean now you can say that in public and people will humor that idea as if it's somehow something other than delusional nonsense.
So while you're disracted with sharia law buying into their game they are busy trying to destroy the foundational secular principles of our government.
In terms of theocracy this nation has far more dire concerns
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#59737 - 10/03/11 07:56 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
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dust-e sheytoon
member
Registered: 08/23/11
Posts: 206
Loc: NYC
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"...your Sharia Law that you love so much would also try and put an end to planned parenthood and other such resources so the two intersect.
You're correct, 6Satan6Archist6, because abortion is illegal in all cases under Sharia law. And if a girl is raped and becomes pregnant she may be executed or "honor" killed for having sex outside of marriage (even though she was raped). In Pakistan, a virgin girl who was kidnapped and gang raped by four men has gained notoriety because her father refuses to kill her. http://www.theatlantic.com/international...s-anger/245691/
A few years ago in a garden in Isfahan, Iran a woman came up to me and asked me how many children I have. I told her that I make art and music, not children. She liked that, and then she complained that she has five children, and she did not want any more, but her husband refused her birth control, abortion is illegal in Iran, and her husband refused to grant her a divorce.
I appreciate that Meph9 is concerned about Evangelical agendas regarding cutting funding to Planned Parenthood. I'm grateful for the birth control I was able to access via Planned Parenthood, and I successfully and luckily prevented unwanted pregnancy. But no form of birth control is 100% effective, and there are rapists, so it's important to keep abortion legal.
Regarding Republican "no new taxes" guy Grover Norquist, he's partly responsible for the debt ceiling crisis --although he supports Islam, he got a bunch of politicians who have Christian anti-choice and Libertarian anti-government support to try to destroy funding for Planned Parenthood. That's quite an interesting trick, because paying for family planning services has got to be more cost effective than all the costs associated with birth, schooling, and feeding unplanned-for children.
BTW Thanks to Zebu for pointing out the similarities regarding the Taliban and extremist Christians regarding the Statue of Liberty (in another thread.)
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Fly for your lives! A great magician comes! He summons armies from the earth itself! ~ ArabianNights
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#59770 - 10/04/11 05:28 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: dust-e sheytoon]
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Meph9
member
Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
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Sharia law is not coming! You're playing right into their game as the religious gets closer day by day to erasing the history and equal rights in the country. In fact one might say that in that respect sharia is approaching because what evangelicals would do to the world is almost identical to what the islamic radicals would do.
The important factor about sharia within the context of the current sociopolitical developments in America is that it is just a distractionary tactic.
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#59777 - 10/04/11 10:01 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: Meph9]
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The Zebu
senior member
Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1647
Loc: Orlando, FL
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It is unlikely to happen, but since it's already occurred in Britain, it's not outright impossible.
The important factor about sharia within the context of the current sociopolitical developments in America is that it is just a distractionary tactic
What makes you think we're distracted?
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#59779 - 10/04/11 11:03 PM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: The Zebu]
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dust-e sheytoon
member
Registered: 08/23/11
Posts: 206
Loc: NYC
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It is unlikely to happen, but since it's already occurred in Britain, it's not outright impossible.
Yes, especially because U.S. law is based on English common law. When a judge makes a decision on a case, and that decision is not overturned, it sets a precedent that other judges must follow - even if they don't agree with it.
According to this report http://b27.cc.trincoll.edu/weblogs/AmericanReligionSurvey-ARIS/reports/ARIS_Report_2008.pdf the number of Self-Identified "Christians" (including Catholics) declined by 10.2% between 1990 and 2008 in the US. During that time period the number of Self-Identified "Other Religions" increased by .6%, and the number of "Nones" increased by 2.9% (It would be interesting to know how many of the the "Nones" were Atheist Satanists.) The number of Self-Identified Muslims doubled, going from .3% to .6%.
There are still a lot more Christians than Muslims in the U.S., but there are similarities between extremist Christians and extremist Islamists which could feasibly contribute to collaborations:
Alcohol is forbidden.
Sex outside of marriage is forbidden.
Dancing is forbidden.
They are willing to use bombs to forward their religious agenda.
They both focus on religious martyrs.
Jesus and Mary are in the Bible and in the Quran.
They both rely on literal readings of religious texts rather than logic.
Stoning is a punishment condoned in the texts of both religions.
Faith is valued over knowledge acquired via scientific inquiry (although there is a strong interest in science amongst many Muslims, and they historically made some scientific advances.)
Muslims also tend to have more children than Protestants, plus there are lots of Muslim refugees to the US due to invasions and occupations in the Middle East. Of course they aren't all extremists, but until Islam undergoes a Reformation there is still the default programming of harsh Sharia law.
Plus, from an aesthetic and psychological viewpoint, mosques offer giant breast and phallic symbols, whereas cathedrals and churches only offer giant labia and vagina symbols. Naturally, some Satanic ceremonies offer more than mere symbols...
Dr. Aquino mentioned in another thread that Catholicism and Christianity are currently not really living religions (in the sense that Islam is to some people now).
For all these reasons, plus the globalist Caliphate nature of Islam - which does not truly acknowledge nation states - Sharia is a serious threat to those in the U.S. who could be severely punished or executed for liberties they currently legally enjoy. The operative words are of course, "could be."
_________________________
Fly for your lives! A great magician comes! He summons armies from the earth itself! ~ ArabianNights
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#59789 - 10/05/11 10:16 AM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: dust-e sheytoon]
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Autodidact
member
Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 428
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Plus, from an aesthetic and psychological viewpoint, mosques offer giant breast and phallic symbols, whereas cathedrals and churches only offer giant labia and vagina symbols. Naturally, some Satanic ceremonies offer more than mere symbols...
So, what you're saying is, Muslims are giant dicks, and Catholics are big pussies?
For all these reasons, plus the globalist Caliphate nature of Islam - which does not truly acknowledge nation states - Sharia is a serious threat to those in the U.S. who could be severely punished or executed for liberties they currently legally enjoy. The operative words are of course, "could be."
I'm sorry, didn't you start the post with:
When a judge makes a decision on a case, and that decision is not overturned, it sets a precedent that other judges must follow - even if they don't agree with it.
Since we already have hundreds of years of precedent, didn't you just disprove your own hypothesis?
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An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur?
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#59790 - 10/05/11 10:39 AM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: dust-e sheytoon]
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The Zebu
senior member
Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1647
Loc: Orlando, FL
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I do not think that Muslims will have enough leverage to actually enforce Sharia upon non-Muslims, and I don't see that happening unless the US is somehow conquered by an Islamic country (even more unlikely).
However, it is very probable that an increase of conservative Muslims may see the introduction of "blasphemy laws", which as they have been introduced by Islamic lobbyists in several European countries, are often championed by Christians (namely Catholics) in a feeble attempt to reclaim a sense of authority.
Faith is valued over knowledge acquired via scientific inquiry (although there is a strong interest in science amongst many Muslims, and they historically made some scientific advances.)
This is true of Christianity as well, but we see that religions only become hostile to science once it is championed by those who are not religious. While medieval Christianity actually encouraged science and scholasticism (relatively), contemporary Christianity is backlashing against everything as a reaction to secularism.
Muslims also tend to have more children than Protestants, plus there are lots of Muslim refugees to the US due to invasions and occupations in the Middle East.
There are certain movements (such as the "Quiverfull" phenomenon) that encourage Protestant women to turn themselves into walking incubators and spit out as many children as possible until their wombs collapse, but such things are relatively fringe... ultimately, immigration is probably more influential on demographics.
Dr. Aquino mentioned in another thread that Catholicism and Christianity are currently not really living religions (in the sense that Islam is to some people now).
Hardcore evangelism is seeing a surge, but this is largely reactionary, as I explained before. Catholicism is an ideological nonentity in America, as most adherents don't care the slightest about its doctrine or tradition, or even practice anything beyond going to Mass on Christmas and Easter (which have already been commercialized anyway).
Plus, from an aesthetic and psychological viewpoint, mosques offer giant breast and phallic symbols, whereas cathedrals and churches only offer giant labia and vagina symbols. Naturally, some Satanic ceremonies offer more than mere symbols...
I actually think that one of the main reasons why Islam has not caught on in the West is the lack of visual resonance. Islamic art still looks glaringly "foreign", and thus it is difficult for Westerners to relate to it. Plus, we love our portraits and statues, but those are no-nos in Islam. It's simply too entangled with Arabic culture for it to find widespread currency outside of immigrants or the ideologically disillusioned.
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«Recibe, ¡oh Lucifer! la sangre de esta víctima que sacrifico en tu honor.»
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#59803 - 10/06/11 02:01 AM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: The Zebu]
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Meph9
member
Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
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Let's get this straight I'm not saying it's impossible. What I'm saying is that it is far, far less likely to happen than xtian theocracy. I just think that as a nation we have a tremedous problem with prioritizing and so we should take it one step at a time. There will be a time for this discussion but I think that we need to get other things in order first. I saying we don't have time to be talking abstract hypotheticals and such
just look at the so called "ground zero mosque" stuff lead by evangelical right which was quite successful in throwing a tremendous and foolish amount of energy into demonizing the project and its leader Fizal Abdul Ramman
I mean Newt Gingrich called a commander center of terrorism and I've never seen anyone oppose that statement
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#59806 - 10/06/11 10:59 AM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: Meph9]
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The Zebu
senior member
Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 1647
Loc: Orlando, FL
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I saying we don't have time to be talking abstract hypotheticals and such
Why discuss a possible theocracy when war is more important? Why discuss war when the economy clearing needs addressing? Why not just talk about teenage pregnancy instead?
I'm sure most of us agree that the "WTC Mosque" fiasco was an overhyped nonissue, but I also think we can discuss the Sharia topic without descending into hysterics.
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«Recibe, ¡oh Lucifer! la sangre de esta víctima que sacrifico en tu honor.»
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#59980 - 10/12/11 01:38 AM
Re: Panel: Is Islamic Sharia Law Coming to America?
[Re: dust-e sheytoon]
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Meph9
member
Registered: 04/02/11
Posts: 161
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Once again no one is trying to make the case for Sharia and other religious law
The point is the we do not have Sharia in America and this is likely to remain true for a long time Sharia is not coming
The Amish are an example of xtian theocracy running amook with the law
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