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#60473 - 10/26/11 09:39 PM Outside of humanity, do you hate the world?
Tropix Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/23/10
Posts: 16
Loc: Minneapolis
People blame other humans for most of the world's problems. Perhaps because humans are easier to influence than, for instance, gravity.

I hate diseases. I hate pain. Hell, I even hate work. The way the world works kind of sucks. Deal with it, right? But what I want to know is if you hate the system of which the universe operates. Do you hate the game and hate the rules of the physical universe? I want to know if you feel anger towards something that you can't do jack shit about.

This concept entails that there is no justice in the universe - that you have to make your own until you are satisfied and move onto something else. Does declaring "I win" make the world acceptable for three seconds? If there is no justice, is it your inherent job to slay the dragons that oppose you?

From a metaphysical standpoint, ponder the following. Even if you don't believe in Satan as a personified deity, you might consider what would make Satan proud. If Satan was the creator of the universe, and you hated it and you admitted it, would he be insulted? Such contempt is somewhat inappropriate for creator religions and even more so for nature religions. For Satanism, I think not. It is what it is.

My suspicion is that if humans ever agreed enough to work together, the common enemy would be nature. The attitude of the transhumanist philosophy is that we should take on the world via invention - an extension of ourselves. If everyone got along, we still wouldn't be happy, because tragedy in the universe would remain.

It sort of puts a dent in our pride. We will always lose in the end. For all the value of being your own god, or being superman, we remain inferior to the ideals we can only imagine. This doesn't have to humble us. We can retaliate, and at least enjoy the indulging of anger.

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#60474 - 10/26/11 09:45 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
Dan_Dread Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3790
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
Not at all. I find the adversarial nature of life, the will to power, the struggle, the carnage, disease, death, the food chain, unmatchably beautiful. It is the current to bury these things, shield us from them, demonize them, that I find distasteful.
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#60476 - 10/26/11 10:15 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Dan_Dread]
Tropix Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/23/10
Posts: 16
Loc: Minneapolis
That's exactly what I needed to hear. It resonates with feelings I've had - the appeal of these demonized things.

I like being mad about the fucking snow.

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#60479 - 10/27/11 07:36 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
Nemesis Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2175
Loc: US
Nope. My hatred is generally reserved for people only. I can't "hate" natural disasters, sickness, weather or really anything else. Either it is a part of nature or of my own doing. Hating something I've done is un-productive. Regretting it and making sure I don't make the same mistake is completely different from simply hating it.

Hating something I have no control over is a complete waste of my emotional resources. Whatever happens, happens.
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#60481 - 10/27/11 09:19 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
arjunasAscent Offline
pledge


Registered: 04/25/11
Posts: 69
Loc: PA, US
 Originally Posted By: Tropix
I hate diseases. I hate pain. Hell, I even hate work. The way the world works kind of sucks. Deal with it, right? But what I want to know is if you hate the system of which the universe operates. Do you hate the game and hate the rules of the physical universe? I want to know if you feel anger towards something that you can't do jack shit about.


These are coming of age thoughts. Back when God, virtue, and sin shaped how I saw the world, the universe was a mystery beyond grasp. There was a prevailing sense that faith helped and kept from the "truth". Embracing the dualities of nature changes that for some reason. Things are no longer a great mystery or misery and life opens up somewhat.

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This concept entails that there is no justice in the universe - that you have to make your own until you are satisfied and move onto something else. Does declaring "I win" make the world acceptable for three seconds? If there is no justice, is it your inherent job to slay the dragons that oppose you?


The aspects of justice represented in nature are duality and balance. The world isn't entirely "unjust", think how unjust it could be but isn't. Justice is a social construct, so ultimately you do take justice in your own hands.

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From a metaphysical standpoint, ponder the following. Even if you don't believe in Satan as a personified deity


No such thing

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you might consider what would make Satan proud. If Satan was the creator of the universe, and you hated it and you admitted it, would he be insulted? Such contempt is somewhat inappropriate for creator religions and even more so for nature religions. For Satanism, I think not. It is what it is.


Why would you be interested in making Satan proud? Why would you care whether Satan was insulted by your thoughts anyway? Satanism is not a religion in the traditional sense, it takes a fundamental change in perspective to understand why. Neither Satan nor God exist. It boils down to semantics.

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My suspicion is that if humans ever agreed enough to work together, the common enemy would be nature.


Man has always feared or revered nature.

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The attitude of the transhumanist philosophy is that we should take on the world via invention - an extension of ourselves. If everyone got along, we still wouldn't be happy, because tragedy in the universe would remain.


Consider that happiness only exists because sadness exists. How can you have one without the other, it's nonsense. You have both or you have none.

 Quote:
It sort of puts a dent in our pride. We will always lose in the end. For all the value of being your own god, or being superman, we remain inferior to the ideals we can only imagine. This doesn't have to humble us. We can retaliate, and at least enjoy the indulging of anger.


We will always loose in the end, but not without having won plenty. You can see the glass half empty or half full. What is winning without loss? What is life without death?


Edited by arjunasAscent (10/27/11 09:20 AM)
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Words are mere sound and smoke dimming the heavenly light - Goethe

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#60482 - 10/27/11 09:21 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Nemesis]
Tropix Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/23/10
Posts: 16
Loc: Minneapolis
It's interesting that hate can be thought of as an emotional resource (exhaustible or accountable to productivity), but also as something to indulge in. Or is that confusing hate with anger?

If it is unproductive to hate the weather, is it unproductive to love the weather? Why is hate unproductive when fighting a disease, but productive when confronting the actions of a human? Does hate have to be felt by the thing hated?

If I hate a politician, I can tell them I hate them by doing something that lets them know they are hated. I can also objectively explain to them the error in their actions. When viewed deterministically, every human action is reduced to a subtle ignorance. It didn't occur to a person to think about something. A problem with another human can be approached with or without anger and with or without hate. What makes hate good toward humans?

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#60483 - 10/27/11 09:23 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
Vinter Offline
stranger


Registered: 10/24/11
Posts: 18
 Originally Posted By: Tropix
But what I want to know is if you hate the system of which the universe operates. Do you hate the game and hate the rules of the physical universe?

No, I do not hate the system of which the universe operates. Quite on the contrary, I love it, and I find it endlessly fascinating. I like the thought of being a part of it; the thought that every atom which constitutes the physical me is, always have been and always will be a part of the universe.

 Originally Posted By: Tropix
This concept entails that there is no justice in the universe - that you have to make your own until you are satisfied and move onto something else. Does declaring "I win" make the world acceptable for three seconds? If there is no justice, is it your inherent job to slay the dragons that oppose you?

I don't consider it a fight that I can win, because there is no fight and no dragons opposing me. I make the best of what I am and I do what I want. I enjoy my hobbies, I enjoy seeking knowledge and I enjoy the emotional ups and downs that come with my life and the things that I learn from them. I have come to an acceptance of the fact that all of this is, objectively speaking, fundamentally meaningless. However, it has a subjective meaning to me and that is all that matters. Therefore, I feel no anger.

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#60538 - 10/28/11 10:44 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Vinter]
felixgarnet Offline
active member


Registered: 10/17/09
Posts: 688
Loc: UK
Do I hate the world? No, not at all. I'm not keen on a lot of its two-legged inhabitants and their antics but that's not what the OP asked.

I find everything that goes on on this planet fascinating - animal and plant life, the stars and seas and the whole astonishing diversity of "stuff" that is alive here.

My personal situation allows me to take my time paying heed to whatever takes my interest and, in that, I am aware of being enormously privileged.

So, in short, no I don't hate the world but then I have gained sufficient mastery of my own universe to have it glide along in the groove with the wider one.
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"Here's to Artifice!" - Anton Szandor LaVey.

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#60560 - 10/29/11 10:09 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
FemaleSatan Offline
member


Registered: 10/19/11
Posts: 553
Loc: The Dirty South
I don't "get it". Most people I have known who hate everything are blamers. People who feel they are somehow infallable, that things are being done to them. These types tend to eshew all personal responsibility in favor of a victim mentality.

I am not saying OP is that type, by the way. I simply don't find the concept of hating everything something that corresponds with personal responsibilty of self sovreignty.
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#60575 - 10/29/11 02:53 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: FemaleSatan]
Morgan Offline
Princess of Hell
stalker


Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 2956
Loc: New York City
I dislike/hate people in mass. Until proven wrong, I consider most people idiots.

That has nothing to do with a victim mentality, it is based on lots of personal experiences.

Nature in itself is nothing to hate, it just is.

You can not control nature or people, you just control your responses to them.

Morgan
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Courage Conquering Fear
Fuck em if they can't take a joke
Don't Like What I Say, Kiss My Ass



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#60578 - 10/29/11 03:43 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Morgan]
FemaleSatan Offline
member


Registered: 10/19/11
Posts: 553
Loc: The Dirty South
I see what you mean Morgan. I'm not a huge fan of humanity in general myself. I tend to start at neutral with others and than get kicked in the teeth by them 99.9% of the time.

I was more referring to the I hate everything and everyone types.
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#60671 - 10/31/11 03:21 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
Dimitri Offline
stalker


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 3093
I don't see a reason to hate nature or mankind.
My hatred is reserved for those specific situations and occurances when it simply gets to much of a stress to handle with.

I find it a waste of energy pointing at all things which should evoke feelings of discomfort/dislike and link them with hatred. Shit tends to happen, having discomfort or a dislike of it and calling it hatred is just something that happens.

Besides, it is no hate unless a life-long and violent grudge is involved. All other things are simply discomfort of/or a disliking.
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#60673 - 10/31/11 03:40 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Dimitri]
Drax Offline
Banned
stranger


Registered: 10/30/11
Posts: 10
Loc: North America
Although hate can have its functions in given situations, it blinds the perception and expression of logic (as does love).

With that said, I hate infrequently and never bother to love finite things so much I cannot see them destroyed.

Furthermore, if I have to pick an emotion to describe how I feel about the majority of human life, I pick disgust and then apathy.

As for nature? Apathy.
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Embracing the Fall

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#60831 - 11/02/11 07:36 AM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: Tropix]
halfchaos Offline
temp ban
pledge


Registered: 10/24/11
Posts: 57
Loc: ^NY
Well, you know, I have managed to read a lot of different things from different people.

I was reading something that the dalai lama was talking about once that took some time for me to understand but eventually I did manage to understand it. He was talking about the benefits of the pain in our lives. In this case we may hate the world and expect that to be so damn depressing. Everything and everybody is so very terrible and we just can't help but cut ourselves or worse; die.

It happens. But I don't see it like that now. Yes I hate the world but, as I said, why is that a bad thing? I have met some beautiful people that I would not have met otherwise if this world was not as it clearly is. If the world was so much better then my life would be shit, I would have had nothing to overcome and nothing to learn from. I would be stupid and weak.

Some people wish to give hugs, they wish to kiss and love. They spread their adoration to everything around them because they believe contempt itself to be evil. Is it? Without death, how would we learn to cling to life as we do? Without pain, how would we know to appreciate what pleasure we manage to find? I don't spread pleasure, and I don't seek to immeasurably extend life. I seek the opposite. I seek death, I seek pain. I seek torment because it made me into the beautiful person I am today and there is still so much more to do.

Think about it. \:\)

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#60903 - 11/02/11 10:38 PM Re: Outside of humanity, do you hate the world? [Re: halfchaos]
RAIDER Offline
member


Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 152
Loc: PA
halfchaos,
You're not a beautiful person, you're as human as the rest of us. Seeking pain and torment ...masochism. Pain doesn't benefit us unless we enjoy it. Seeking Death......clinical depression.

original question...I do hate some individuals, political systems, religious schools of thought, etc...but the World in which I live is much bigger than all that bullshit. I love the physical world and being in it.
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