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#75043 - 02/07/13 02:01 PM Women and Satanism
Surrounded Offline
stranger


Registered: 01/19/13
Posts: 5
I'm new here, and I went to page seven of the various topic threads, but didn't see anything dealing with Women and Satanism, so I thought I'd introduce it.
Anyway, in the recommended books listed on this site there is THUS SPAKE ZARATHUSTRA. In case you haven't read the story there is one incident in it where Zarathustra encounters and interacts with an old woman. Their conversation centers around women, and the old woman admonishes Zarathustra in the following manner: "Remember, if you have to deal with women don't forget your whip!"
So I'm wondering how all the Satanic-focused chicks involved in this forum feel about whether or not they're taken seriously or considered as "equals" by the philosophy? And how do you feel that the various manifestations of Feminism fit in with Satanic philosophy ( especially RAD FEM )?

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#75044 - 02/07/13 02:18 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
MrsRiverSong Offline
stranger


Registered: 02/04/13
Posts: 15
Loc: UK
I'm a Woman \:D I feel that woman are treated pretty much the same as men within Satanic philosophy, by that I mean the writings of ASL. The rules of the earth and Satanic sins apply just as much to women as to the men. There doesn't seem to be one rule for men and another for women that can be found Christianity or other religions. I,personally, have a slight problem with the naked female altar, although I would,imagine it could just as easily be a dude naked too but that's just my issue it doesn't ruin my life or anything lol.

In Modern as well as Theistic Satanism I feel that women tend to be more accepted in leadership roles and the men folk don't seem to have an issue with that. I see Satanism, as a whole, to be very forward thinking when it comes to many issues not just the role of women.

Hope I haven't totally misunderstood your question \:\)
_________________________
I'm a Theistic Satanist

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#75045 - 02/07/13 02:18 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
Cassandra Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/07/11
Posts: 83
Loc: Temple, Texas
I have not really thought about this much, but there is one thing that has been on my mind recently:

Now, this is not with all the men in Satanism--I've met a few that are completely open-minded and have that 'equal' attitude--but I find it very funny and a bit ironic that some Satanic men still have that negative attitude toward (Satanic) women that are single and sleep with whom she wants. The attitude I gather from these men towards a woman like this is still--

(SLUT!)

--which is interesting. It is okay for men to sleep around as they please but the Satanic woman still gets slapped with the label SLUT, even if that woman has not even slept around as much as her male counterpart...

I myself would be very curious to hear/read the opinion of anyone else on here about that.

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#75053 - 02/07/13 03:20 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Cassandra]
Le Deluge Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/05/12
Posts: 1790
 Originally Posted By: Cassandra
I have not really thought about this much, but there is one thing that has been on my mind recently:

Now, this is not with all the men in Satanism--I've met a few that are completely open-minded and have that 'equal' attitude--but I find it very funny and a bit ironic that some Satanic men still have that negative attitude toward (Satanic) women that are single and sleep with whom she wants. The attitude I gather from these men towards a woman like this is still--

(SLUT!)

--which is interesting. It is okay for men to sleep around as they please but the Satanic woman still gets slapped with the label SLUT, even if that woman has not even slept around as much as her male counterpart...

I myself would be very curious to hear/read the opinion of anyone else on here about that.


Do you find this a more prevalent attitude amongst "satanic" men than men in general? Personally, I'm not a satanist and have never cared whether two consenting adults have sex. I'll grant LaVey classified himself as a bit of a misogynist. Given the women in his life, however, I tend to wonder if it was part of his schtick.
_________________________
Apres Moi ... Le Deluge

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#75054 - 02/07/13 03:32 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Le Deluge]
Cassandra Offline
pledge


Registered: 12/07/11
Posts: 83
Loc: Temple, Texas
That's a good question. I've not noticed much of this attitude from non-Satanists, though I'm sure it is probably more prevalent in them than in Satanists in general. I have just only recently noticed it--but then I was not really all that observant before as I am these days.
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#75056 - 02/07/13 03:40 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Cassandra]
Le Deluge Offline
senior member


Registered: 08/05/12
Posts: 1790
 Originally Posted By: Cassandra
That's a good question. I've not noticed much of this attitude from non-Satanists, though I'm sure it is probably more prevalent in them than in Satanists in general. I have just only recently noticed it--but then I was not really all that observant before as I am these days.


Hard to say then. Almost every male satanist I know personally is married or in a long-term relationship. The last one I worked with was the guitarist of a band with a female lead. I'm guessing frat boys may have the market there, but I really don't know.
_________________________
Apres Moi ... Le Deluge

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#75063 - 02/07/13 05:10 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Le Deluge]
elfsyx Offline
lurker


Registered: 01/28/13
Posts: 1
Loc: USA
I can't imagine that there is some barometer that women could be measured by, from a male standpoint. What I mean to say is that if there is a barometer that measures ambiguous units of respect for which a woman could be awarded, there is no indication that I can find that a man would be the arbiter of the final measurement. I don't believe there is any commonly agreed upon measure of respect that can be earned with objective behaviors and agreed upon by a group of Satanists, seeing as the philosophy basically forestalls group consensus as an acceptable source of esteem. The only way that a woman could feel that she has "earned" an equal status to a man on a Satanic level is if she first creates the concept of man as the arbiter of esteem, and second the concept that she has to exhibit certain behaviors to gain that esteem. Which is perfectly within any woman's right. It just has nothing to do with an exterior model of Satanism as judged by the male gender, and everything to do with an interior model of one's own power.
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#75066 - 02/07/13 06:14 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
evilboy666 Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/29/12
Posts: 57
Loc: Texas
I believe the female is far deadlier thsat the male. I personally like helping lady satanists when allowed. Boys beware.
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#75071 - 02/07/13 08:50 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: evilboy666]
Khk Offline
member


Registered: 09/07/08
Posts: 398
Its creating separate threads that distinguish women in whatever way that helps solidify this difference. Plus your definition of satanic women as having two characteristics is a sad oversimplification. The kind of bullshit thread that religious miscreants would ignorantly hash together. In general, women are treated badly no matter what they do or who they are - partly because they are continually separated as an Other.
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#75087 - 02/08/13 03:29 AM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
Dimitri Offline
senior member


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 2430
Seeing its a personal path there's both egality and inequality.
There are no strict rules or dogma describing the position of the female and it's up to every individual to make up his or her own mind concerning race, culture and gender.

If there is a negative connotation towards the actions of a female individual, which she sees as part of her freedom or "Satanity", then its her responsibility as she is the main perpetrator of said actions. The same reasoning is also applied to men.



Edited by Dimitri (02/08/13 03:30 AM)
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Ut vivat, crescat et floreat

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#75092 - 02/08/13 12:26 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
Michael A.Aquino Offline
senior member


Registered: 09/28/08
Posts: 1941
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
As a point of historical record, neither the 1966-75 Church of Satan nor 1975+ Temple of Set considered there to be any difference in worth or prestige between the sexes. Women were & are just as able as men to rise to any level of initiation, hold any position of trust, etc. [The current High Priestess of Set [& CEO of the corporate entity] is a woman.]

As an amusing sidebar, the original Chapter VI of "Might is Right" (which Anton excluded from his "Book of Satan" plagiarism in the Satanic Bible, is sufficiently male-fetishistic to be retitled "Ragnar of Gor". Diane probably told him he'd be sleeping with Togare if he included it.
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Michael A. Aquino

[On Ignore: Dread, 6Satan6Archist6, Caladrius, MindFux, SIN3, Wright]

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#75105 - 02/08/13 04:59 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Cassandra]
Asmedious Moderator Offline
Moderator
veteran member


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 1499
Loc: New York
I believe that the main reason that a “free spirited” woman who sleeps with whom ever she wants, might be labeled a “slut,” by a large number of men (Satanists and others as well) is because of the male ego.

Men seem to be more prone to visual imagination then women, and when they are dating a woman and know that she had many partners they tend to visualize in their minds her past encounters, which they might find threatening, as well as making them wonder if they are as good as her other partners were.

Also, a man tends to enjoy having something unique and better then other men, and the knowledge that others have already “possessed” the woman that they are with might take away from her uniqueness in their minds.

This is not coming from a psychological evaluation on my end, but mainly from first hand experience, and from talking with some male friends over the years. So take it with a grain of salt.

I felt this way when I was in my teens and early twenties, but later in life as I did more self introspection and evaluation I was able to admit and accept the fact that these negative feelings didn't come out in me because of the life style and judgments that I projected on women but from my own feelings of inadequacy.

As I gained more world experience in the “romance” department, eventually I gained more confidence in myself and got to the point where I no longer felt that I was competing with my partners ex's and past adventures.

Eventually I got to the point where learning about her past, not only did it not threaten my ego, but hearing details about it became amusing, fun, and to be honest, quite a turn on, and was able to enjoy the women that I spent time with and viewed her as another person rather then an object to be possessed. Now when I learn about my female partners past, it is on the par of learning about a male friends past and their romantic encounters, and I am able to enjoy both of their experiences on the same level, without passing negative judgments.

I think that I consciously realized that I matured when a woman that I was dating told me that she had over 137 partners and it didn't bother me at all, but instead amused me. When she would get royally pissed off at me for some reason, she'd start calling me “138,” and I found it amusing, instead of making me angry.

I assume that men who are Satanists have an easier time getting over the ego and feeling threatened thing because we tend to do a lot more self reflection and are more honest about the source of our feelings, emotions, and insecurities, thereby being better prepared to evaluate them and to deal with them realistically from an objective point of view, rather then from an emotional subjective one, which only reacts to those emotions without honest analysis and self reflection.
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"The first order of government is the protection of its citizens right to be left alone."

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#75109 - 02/08/13 06:02 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Surrounded]
FemaleSatan Offline
member


Registered: 10/19/11
Posts: 418
Loc: The Dirty South
 Quote:
So I'm wondering how all the Satanic-focused chicks involved in this forum feel about whether or not they're taken seriously or considered as "equals" by the philosophy?


How can a philosophy treat men or women differently or not take women seriously?

Individuals that are part of that philosophy could treat men or women differently, but why should a woman care what others think, especially if she is a Satanist?

 Quote:
And how do you feel that the various manifestations of Feminism fit in with Satanic philosophy ( especially RAD FEM )?


I personally like Feminism, especially Anarcha-Feminism. That being said I don't think it necessarily 'fits in' with Satanism as much as it's something that I personally enjoy. I find asking something like this similar to asking how Vegetarianism fits into Satanism...

Cassie,

If you (or any woman) are (is) doing what you (they) do and enjoying it, you need to:

1. Own any repercussions of that behavior, including how others perceive that behavior.

2. Decide if you give a fuck about how those people view you in the first place.

Slut is just a word.
_________________________
http://female-satan.blogspot.com


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#75111 - 02/08/13 06:18 PM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: Cassandra]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
senior member


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2415
Loc: Utah
 Quote:
--which is interesting. It is okay for men to sleep around as they please but the Satanic woman still gets slapped with the label SLUT, even if that woman has not even slept around as much as her male counterpart...

I myself would be very curious to hear/read the opinion of anyone else on here about that.


It's like this: a key than can open many locks is a master key whereas a lock that can be opened my many keys is a shitty lock. To put it another way: it's way easier for a woman to get laid a lot than it is for a man; there are fat, ugly women who are sluts, show me one fat, ugly guy (who isn't rich) that get's a lot of tail. As the great comedian Jim Jefferies puts it "guys have to be witty, smart, strong and drive a cool car...women just have to be there".

None of this to say that I look down upon women who sleep around; their body, their business. I'd never start a relationship with a slut but I will use them for all they're worth.
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Don't Click

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#75117 - 02/09/13 12:32 AM Re: Women and Satanism [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
evilboy666 Offline
pledge


Registered: 09/29/12
Posts: 57
Loc: Texas
As Satanists,a man or woman should be able to use sex as a means to get ahead with no stigma. I believe the smart ones have been doing it for years.
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John Crawford

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