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#8307 - 04/30/08 11:10 PM Different Types Of Satanist
Tony Offline
lurker


Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 1
Loc: Florida
Hi

I would like to say that I'm new to all this, but I'm a little confused. I have noticed alot of people call themselves satanist but they don't really believe in satan as a deity. This to me is confusing because it sounds to me as your just an Atheist, and your basically using satan to mock the christian religion. why not just call yourself an athiest?

To me I do consider myself a satanist cause i see satan as a deity , and the one true god that made everything. I believe there is only one god, and that is satan.

I would like to know why people that don't believe in satan call themselves satanist, and pretend to worship satan when in reality they don't believe in him....I would really appreciate it cause I'm a bit confused.

Thanks

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#8310 - 04/30/08 11:57 PM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
PRO DOM Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/15/08
Posts: 21
Well then you are a true worshiper and there are many here who fit into that catagory. I for one am a true worshiper of Satan. I will stand up for Satan.
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#8311 - 05/01/08 12:00 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
Isaak w shipley Offline
member


Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 112
Loc: Tenneessee
Being Confused Is the fu##ing point!!!!
Why knock if not tried,Why oh why?
Sounds like I did My job well,Your discomfort
Is good enough for me,me and me.
I love it......................
The jealous oh poor child.


"Dazed and confused.."
Me...........

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#8313 - 05/01/08 12:41 AM This should be in Satanism 101 [Re: Tony]
ta2zz Offline
veteran member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 1552
Loc: Connecticut

Hello,

 Originally Posted By: Tony
I would like to say that I'm new to all this, but I'm a little confused. I have noticed alot of people call themselves satanist but they don't really believe in satan as a deity.

The difference is theist or non theist… To some this is a philosophy not a religion…

 Originally Posted By: Tony
This to me is confusing because it sounds to me as your just an atheist, and your basically using satan to mock the christian religion. why not just call yourself an athiest?

Oh Tony it is so much more than that… Have you read this yet? TSB Read the first half, the second half is mostly filler to make a publishable book, and to trap those needing dogma…

 Originally Posted By: Tony
To me I do consider myself a satanist cause i see satan as a deity , and the one true god that made everything. I believe there is only one god, and that is satan.

Good now keeping that out of the equation what is the most basis of your beliefs? Mine are live life to its fullest, try to always better myself where possible, be responsible for my own actions… What is your answer?

 Originally Posted By: Tony
I would like to know why people that don't believe in satan call themselves satanist, and pretend to worship satan when in reality they don't believe in him....I would really appreciate it cause I'm a bit confused.

Is this the first time you have been exposed to the reality of Satanism as a metaphor? Who pretends to worship anything here? You can learn much here perhaps you even have something to teach… Stick around for a while…

Good luck on your path

~T~

Beware those that worship false idols…
_________________________
We are the music makers, And we are the dreamers of dreams. ~Arthur William Edgar O'Shaughnessy

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#8314 - 05/01/08 12:41 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
selene Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/17/08
Posts: 15
Hi Tony,
I will not claim to speak for the entire forum, but this is my basic understanding of the subject at hand.

There are two general classes of Satanism:
1) Theistic Satanism, in which one believes in Satan as being an actual deity and pays homage thusly through adoration, rituals, etc.

2) LeVeyan Satanism, in which one does not believe in an actual deity known as Satan but rather acts the role of the adversary. Essentially, the concept of "Satan" to a LeVayan Satanist is the representation of indulgence and acting upon one's urges without remorse.

And of course, loosely based within the two generalized classes I mentioned are many different flavors, beliefs, and opinions.

As far as Atheism: to me, Satanism represents my philosophy more accurately then simply saying I'm an Atheist and don't believe in any gods.

-Selene

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#8315 - 05/01/08 12:43 AM Re: This should be in Satanism 101 [Re: ta2zz]
selene Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/17/08
Posts: 15
And here I thought I would attempt to be helpful...ta2zz got to it first by 1 second.

Selene

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#8316 - 05/01/08 12:53 AM Re: This should be in Satanism 101 [Re: selene]
ZephyrGirl Offline
R.I.P.
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 706
Loc: Adelaide Australia
 Quote:
Essentially, the concept of "Satan" to a LeVayan Satanist is the representation of indulgence and acting upon one's urges without remorse.


Can I add to that seeking and being able to see the 'real world around you' sometimes refered to as 'the truth'. Although, with the corruption of that word lately I am reluctant to use it.

LOL Selene, you've actually been very helpul. It's nice to see a new member that is willing to put their hat in the ring for something other than group mentality.

Zeph
_________________________
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass -
It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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#8317 - 05/01/08 01:09 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
Sinistar Offline
member


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 174
Loc: New York City
Whatever type that you consider yourself to be, it is good to start out by reading the Satanic Bible, conveniently downloadable in the Media Room.

Read all that you can after that. Satanic literature is a dime a dozen but good Satanic literature will be harder to come by, as you may already know.

Eat the meat and spit the bones out. Enjoy the ride...
_________________________



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#8324 - 05/01/08 05:55 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
psiren Offline
pledge


Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Spain
For me it's all down to the level of description I want. I'm an Atheist and the word is fine and dandy to describe my religious views. That's all it means though, lack of belief in god.

To describe my views beyond this, Satanism seems the most accurate word to use. It's not a religious belief for me, it's a philosophy and way of living. It's a convenient label to use rather than going into a list of things that make up my personal philosophy. I'm not a person immune to the attraction of a label and a definition, labels and definitions are handy things sometimes.

Of course I'm coming from the LaVeyan type of Satanism and I can see the confusion with there being different types. But there are different types and that's how it is.

The anti-christian thing does come into it for me, that's part of why I'm attracted to it but it's not all of it. I call myself a Satanist because I relate to the philosophy outlined in The Satanic Bible. I call it to myself, not often to other people because I'm aware that it can cause me problems and give off a wrong impression. In this sense the confusion you speak of can be a reason not to use the label. But on the flip-side the label is very useful when talking to people who know about it. It makes googling for places like this a hell of a lot easier as well.

And finally I don't pretend to worship anything. If people assume that I worship Satan that's not really due to any pretense on my part. I realise this assumption is likely outside of certain circles and this is why I keep the label within those circles and to myself in most areas of everyday life.

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#8325 - 05/01/08 07:23 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Tony]
School Bully Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 142
Loc: Melbourne
 Originally Posted By: Tony

To me I do consider myself a satanist cause i see satan as a deity , and the one true god that made everything. I believe there is only one god, and that is satan.


What you are saying in effect is that Satan is just another name for God. I don't think this is true. Do you know what "satan" means? It means adversary. Broadly speaking, anyone who is actively working against the will of God can be regarded as a "Satan". Outside the Judeo-Christian tradition the word is meaningless.

In Judaism, Satan is God's D.A. or Chief Prosecutor. Satan is used by God to test mankind. But Christians also added a bit of Zoastrianism to the mix and produced an independent being who is also the opposite of God and who is working against God; the proverbial anti-Christ and Prince of Darkness.

Did you ever see the movie Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory? (It's a firm viewing favorite round these parts, I can tell you). The story is about a very famous chocolate factory, called Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory, that produces the world's greatest chocolates, candies - confectionery in general. No one ever enters the factory, and no one ever leaves.

Mr. Wonka, the owner, runs a contest. The winners of the contest will be allowed to enter and tour the factory together. However, they will have to sign a contract and follow the rules. One of the rules is: no eating of any products inside the factory without express permission.

Afterwards, when they leave, they will go home with a lifetime supply of chocolate.That is, *IF* they follow the rules.



... yadda, yadda, yadda...



Then Wonka calls in Wilkinson, his aide. And Wilkinson is Slugworth! Slugworth was sent out to each of the children to test them! To see how they would respond. Anyone who either ate food he wasn't supposed to eat or brought a Gobstopper to Slugworth was dishonest, and would not become the successor. Notice, also, that Wonka himself gave each of the children a Gobstopper. So he himself set up the choice, and then gave them the opportunity to break the rule, using Wilkinson to offer the temptation.

So, to cut to the chase, Willy Wonka is God and Slugworth is Satan. Just as Slugworth is really Wilkinson doing what Wonka asked him to do, Satan is also not working for himself. At least, that is how the Jews view Satan.

"Satanism" however, can probably be best explained as an infantile disorder. It explains why so many people first discover Satanism in their teens, usually after a lengthy period of excessive altruism, brought about by excessively pious Christianity; then by using the writings of Ayn Rand, they redress the imbalance of their lives and usually grow out of it all in time to become happy little Joe Averages and Sally Soccermoms. In fact, LaVey once described his Satanism as "just Ayn Rand's philosophy with ceremony and ritual added".(Some however never grow out of it and are doomed to remain children trapped in a grown-up world).

That's how some people use Satanism but this is certainly no denigration of Modern Satanism as a way of life. Far from it. It's primary aim has always been self-liberation; not binding one's identity to anything oppressive. It is an intelligent way to avoid becoming a total loser in life. And Uncle Andy deserves great credit and is rightly honored by anyone calling him/herself a "Satanist". Satanism as an ism was something invented by Anton LaVey. Before that there was only devil worshippers, so the disciples of LaVey - or the modern Satanists - are the ones who really have a right to use the title.

But LaVey's Church of Satan failed - which is a great shame. By rights, it should have looked like Andy Warhol's Factory and sounded like Frank Zappa. But it was still a work of genius, IMHO.

As for independent or self proclaiming Satanists, I would stay well clear of that lot. They are always nobodies who desperately want to be somebodies and to that end usually end up doing really stupid dumb-assed things like shooting up High Schools, etc.

But as for Satan actually existing either physically, spiritually, abstractly, etc. well, that's a different story altogether, but not as God... sorry.

.


_________________________
.


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#8332 - 05/01/08 07:46 PM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: School Bully]
Octavius Offline
member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 561
Loc: just visiting
I'll keep this short and simple. If you worship a deity called Satan, then you are not a Satanist...you are merely a Heretical Christian. Cheers. Now go forth and do wrong.
_________________________
So long, and thanks for all the fish.

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#8586 - 05/10/08 07:06 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Octavius]
Necrophillah Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/08/08
Posts: 6
Tony -- most Satanists ARE Atheists..

To get a full explanation, you should invest in the Satanic Bible. LaVey explains this in full detail... and will make 100% perfect sense to you after reading it.

And LaVey also explains why it's not the Christians that are the problem or threat - it's the NEW AGERS.

The Satanic Bible is NOT Christian bashing... far from it.

I highly recommend adding it to your library and reading it!!
You'll be amazed at what is really in there and the full explanation of LaVeyan Satanism.
_________________________
In London there is a man who screams when the church bells ring. ~H. P. Lovecraft

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#8588 - 05/10/08 07:10 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Necrophillah]
Necrophillah Offline
stranger


Registered: 05/08/08
Posts: 6
Here's a link for you to listen too: It explains it \:\)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6209471016393406120&q=church+of+satan
_________________________
In London there is a man who screams when the church bells ring. ~H. P. Lovecraft

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#8590 - 05/10/08 09:37 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Necrophillah]
Xutech Offline
stranger


Registered: 03/18/08
Posts: 34
Loc: Australia
The "confused Christian" argument is a poor one. I for one don't think of Satan and pals as deities, but I certainly don't have the hubris to intercede for others. Nothing irritates like suggesting to another person, who you barely know, that regardless of their personal beliefs and reasoning, they are merely poor amateurs of another faith.

When I have the misfortune to run into people expousing the beauty of the Hare Krisna movement, they often start the conversation with spurious factoids like "Do you know that Sanskrit is the oldest written language"?. Whether it is or not, I reserve the right, and the right of others, to form their own opinions and not simply accept that regurgitated opinion as a whole, undiminished truth.

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#8606 - 05/11/08 02:15 AM Re: Different Types Of Satanist [Re: Xutech]
Nyarlathotep2012 Offline
stranger


Registered: 02/24/08
Posts: 16
Loc: Texas
If you believe in Satan as a deity then that's fine and dandy, if it works for you then whatever floats your boat.

Satanism is whatever you want it to be.

Modern Day Satanism, however, when the term Satanist became applicable is from The Church of Satan, which believe Satan as an archetype representative of free will and individualism. Magick, Ritual, etc is done to clear the psyche of the burden of whatever specific situation you have done a ritual for, so that you are able to grow beyond the situation and thusly, the outcome of your desire occurs, because you have opened yourself up to accept this result.

That is of course assuming you practice the spells and rituals in TSB or another Satanic document, many people, as was said earlier, use this as a philosophy to live their lives by without the ritual, etc. But generally, you will be hard pressed to find a modern day Satanist who necessarily believes in Satan as a supreme deity and thusly worships him. Most are LaVeyan Satanists.

There are many off shoots, like the ToS, that believe in a deity, but that is Set, and it would be an amazing feat to get one of them to call themselves a Satanist, because to them they are not, they're Setian.

Anyways, my point being, you will find more so than not that people who call themselves Satanists do not necessarily believe in or worship him as a deity, but rather worship no gods, because the term Satanists in it's "modern day" sense is from LaVey.

This is of course excluding Theistic Satanists, who, like what was said earlier, believe in a deity called Satan, Lucifer, etc etc.

Read The Satanic Bible, like was recommended, and it will be pretty clear as to why many Satanists today do not worship a god, yet at the same time call themselves Satanists. It was to start a revolution in the way people thought, to throw off the shackles of old oppressive believes, to be rid of the superstitious fear of Satan and his minions by taking on the very title of that which we have been told to believe in and fear.

Satan means the adversary, so a Satanist in turn is the adversary to society and old beliefs.

But Again, this is up to your discretion as at the end of the day, what is prised most is the individual and their progression and advancement. If what works for you works, then go with it, while at the same time be always willing and open to new ideas and trains of thought, because you never know where the next pinnacle in your personal advancement will occur.


Edited by Nyarlathotep2012 (05/11/08 02:17 AM)
_________________________
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here

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