Page 8 of 10 « First<678910>
Topic Options
#17085 - 12/28/08 03:36 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Japster]
Meq Offline
Banned
active member


Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 861
Is everyone a born Satanist? Or are only a few?

Every newborn human is pretty weak, vulnerable and dependent on others' care. But this question is more about the potential of that newborn infant.

An essay I read a while back (I can't find it now - was it possibly one of Rick's?) concluded by stating that Satanism is the bedrock of raw human existence, to which people add their own layers of ideological 'paint'.
Satan, in short, represents the core of vital human existence.
A Satanist is defined as an elite individual who lives from this core.

The question therefore turns on the conception of 'nature vs nurture'.
In proclaiming "Satanists are born, not made", Anton LaVey seemed to come down on the side of 'nature'.

Although Satan is the core of human existence, not everyone has it in them to live like that - and their born nature (including genetics) plays a large role in determining how 'vital' they are likely to live.
Therefore, by LaVeyan standards, not everyone is born a Satanist.

However, 'born' here could also be interpreted in a wider sense, to include the family one is born into (i.e. 'nurture' in addition to 'nature').
Many human beings are born into dysfunctional families, which leaves them with lifelong mental health problems and an inability to realise their potential - as well as an inability to overcome these issues.

Tough shit, by Satanic standards.
Such an individual is not an elite Satanist - unless, in the words of Nietzsche - he discovers a means to "turn injury to his own advantage," so that "what doesn't kill him makes him stronger."
However, I have yet to discover a single human being this fully applies to in practice.
I personally would exclude Nietzsche himself from this category on grounds of his mental breakdown - but he at least had the honesty to not proclaim HIMSELF an 'Ubermensch' - unlike many pretentious 'Satanists' today.

Yes, this is a selfish and brutal philosophy, make no mistake about it. It's certainly not for everyone. Perhaps secular humanist morality or Wicca would resonate more with a wider audience.
But that marks one hallmark of a Satanist according to LaVey - their values are not those of the masses.


If I may play Devil's Advocate, however... an Existentialist would consider LaVeyan Satanism's belief that "Satanists are born, not made" to be a form of bad faith. In Sartre's view, "Man is nothing other than what he makes of himself", and has NO fixed 'nature' - so claiming one is living from one's fixed 'Satanic nature' would be seen as a self-deceptive excuse to avoid taking responsibility for what one decides to make of oneself.
The validity of this is of course is open to debate.

Top
#17087 - 12/28/08 04:57 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Meq]
Dan_Dread Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 3895
Loc: Vancouver, Canada
Nature or nurture, it doesn't really matter in the end. The proof is in the pudding.

The end result is that ones words and actions tell the story.

Also, I wouldn't say people from 'dysfunctional' families are more or less likely to be Satanists. I myself was raised largely by murderers and bank robbers for my first ten years or so.

After that I was pretty much on my own.

If anything it made me stronger and more able to deal with reality than someone that had a 'normal' sheltered early existence.
_________________________
ADM
ideological vandal

Top
#17385 - 12/31/08 10:12 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Isaak w shipley]
ACF Offline
stranger


Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 15
Loc: Hamilton Ohio
My whole life I've lived in a Christian family. But my whole life, I have questioned, seen through the lies, and diverted away from Christianity. As long as I could remember I have been asking whether what my family believes is true. I've always thought it to be false, and always thought there was something more out there. Something better. After alot of reading and researching about Satanism, it was all what I have believed in the whole time.
_________________________
┼ I am my own redeemer ┼

Top
#17421 - 01/01/09 06:10 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: ACF]
daevid777 Offline
active member


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 951
Loc: Hell's Pisshole, Texas
It's not better, or worse... though it can be... both. There is nothing "more" here than there was "there"... but I get your meaning.

Good luck.
_________________________
Where we're going, we don't need roads.

Top
#18050 - 01/12/09 08:23 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Isaak w shipley]
Jerry Offline
lurker


Registered: 01/01/09
Posts: 4
i think what makes one a satanist is the understanding that you only live one life and you should live it how you want to live it.
Top
#18051 - 01/12/09 08:46 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Jerry]
The AntiChris Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 60
Loc: Pennsylvania
Being an existentialist and a hardcore agnostic it's tough for me to admit that the "born" theory definately applies to me. When reading about Satanism I found that most basic principles I had been practicing my whole life. In my case LaVey just gave me a place to hang my hat. So yes indeed, God made me a Satanist!!!
_________________________
Awake, arise, or be for ever fall'n.

Top
#18052 - 01/12/09 08:47 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: Jerry]
Mike Offline
member


Registered: 09/11/07
Posts: 253
Loc: Farmingdale, NY
 Quote:
i think what makes one a satanist is the understanding that you only live one life and you should live it how you want to live it.


What if a Christian realizes this? Are they then a Satanist? Just because this view is shared by many Satanists doesn't mean it's limited to just Satanists. There are many more aspects of Satanism than just having free will and "living life how you want to".

My suggestion to you is to read the Satanic Bible, and if you have a good enough understanding of it, you will see exactly what makes you a Satanist. Satanists are born, not made, and not everyone has what it takes to be a Satanist. "Realizing" you are a Satanist is nothing but giving yourself a title for what you already believe. And the Satanic Bible shouldn't change your mind either. If you are a Satanist, reading TSB should be like looking in the mirror and saying to yourself "wow, this sounds just like me".

And don't forget we must learn how to live life the way we want to. Becoming your own god requires you to have control over yourself. You need to somewhat "program" your subconscious in a way that will block out influence from any external force so that it is you who controls your thoughts and actions, which will result in having the ability to live life the way you want to. Also keep in mind the fact that this doesn't happen overnight, and it takes much effort to learn to control your environment as well. Having control over your environment means the ability to influence any situation to work in accordance with your will.

I'm just speaking my knowledge...I hope it helped.
_________________________
-Mike, "The Patron Satanic Saint of the Youth"

Top
#18053 - 01/12/09 08:48 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
Mike Offline
member


Registered: 09/11/07
Posts: 253
Loc: Farmingdale, NY
 Quote:
When reading about Satanism I found that most basic principles I had been practicing my whole life.


My point exactly. You don't become a Satanist, you just realize that your beliefs have a name.
_________________________
-Mike, "The Patron Satanic Saint of the Youth"

Top
#18054 - 01/12/09 09:06 PM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
6Satan6Archist6 Offline
stalker


Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2509
 Originally Posted By: The AntiChris
Being an existentialist and a hardcore agnostic it's tough for me to admit that the "born" theory definately applies to me. When reading about Satanism I found that most basic principles I had been practicing my whole life. In my case LaVey just gave me a place to hang my hat. So yes indeed, God made me a Satanist!!!



You do realize that the agnostic viewpoint is diametrically opposed to Satanism right?

One of the most basic principles is the realization that there is NO "God". To be agnostic means to give the belief in "God" validity by being a fence sitter and saying; "Well, maybe.".
_________________________
No gods. No masters.

Top
#18071 - 01/13/09 01:32 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: 6Satan6Archist6]
The AntiChris Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 60
Loc: Pennsylvania
OOps...busted..However that would only apply to atheistic Satanism. So really I have the freedom to do one (believe) or the other (not believe) whenever I feel like it, which is more freedom than merely being an Atheist. And isn't Satanism really about freedom? By the way, who the hell gave you the official rulebook anyway? I make my own rules as to what I believe.
_________________________
Awake, arise, or be for ever fall'n.

Top
#18075 - 01/13/09 01:56 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
The AntiChris Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 60
Loc: Pennsylvania
...and then again which god am I giving validity too? Maybe I'm agnostic towards Satan but I absolutely positively do not believe in a Judeo-Christian god. Maybe I have a thing for space aliens and interdimensional beings? Oh wait Cthulhu yes that's what I believe in. Really I don’t care, you can pick whatever one you want.

I'm fond of #4 in this case.

Agnostic-noun 1. a person who holds that the existence of the ultimate cause, as God, and the essential nature of things are unknown and unknowable, or that human knowledge is limited to experience.
2. a person who denies or doubts the possibility of ultimate knowledge in some area of study.
–adjective 3. of or pertaining to agnostics or agnosticism.
4. asserting the uncertainty of all claims to knowledge.
Dictionary.com
_________________________
Awake, arise, or be for ever fall'n.

Top
#18076 - 01/13/09 01:58 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
daevid777 Offline
active member


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 951
Loc: Hell's Pisshole, Texas
And obviously, you don't know exactly "what" to believe.

Nothing wrong with that, and this is not meant as denigration.

Just be careful when you say "agnostic" - that opens a completely new can...
_________________________
Where we're going, we don't need roads.

Top
#18077 - 01/13/09 02:08 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: daevid777]
The AntiChris Offline
pledge


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 60
Loc: Pennsylvania
 Originally Posted By: daevid777
And obviously, you don't know exactly "what" to believe.


This is misspoken. It's not that I cannot believe, it is that I "will" not believe. I choose not to give one theory validity over the other. I have ones however I prefer, or ones I find work better than others, but again this is not about being undecided.
_________________________
Awake, arise, or be for ever fall'n.

Top
#18079 - 01/13/09 04:29 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
daevid777 Offline
active member


Registered: 08/30/07
Posts: 951
Loc: Hell's Pisshole, Texas
 Quote:
I'm fond of #4 in this case.


 Quote:
4. asserting the uncertainty of all claims to knowledge.
Dictionary.com


You may think I'm proving your point by these quotes, but I don't think so.

"Uncertainty" is the key word.
_________________________
Where we're going, we don't need roads.

Top
#18080 - 01/13/09 04:50 AM Re: What makes you a Satanist [Re: The AntiChris]
Diavolo Offline
RIP
stalker


Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 4997
 Quote:

...and then again which god am I giving validity too? Maybe I'm agnostic towards Satan but I absolutely positively do not believe in a Judeo-Christian god. Maybe I have a thing for space aliens and interdimensional beings? Oh wait Cthulhu yes that's what I believe in. Really I don’t care, you can pick whatever one you want.


This is crap. If you're agnostic, you are either agnostic about everything or about nothing. The reason is identical in all cases. Picking one above another only shows agnosticism is pseudo-intellectual fashion.

D.

Top
Page 8 of 10 « First<678910>


Moderator:  SkaffenAmtiskaw, fakepropht, TV is God, Woland, Asmedious, Fist 
Hop to:

Generated in 0.035 seconds of which 0.002 seconds were spent on 28 queries. Zlib compression disabled.